Rugeley Villa Posted June 4, 2017 Share Posted June 4, 2017 1 minute ago, Xela said: Frightening. Just glad we have such good security services. we are stopping a lot more than is getting through by the looks of it. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rugeley Villa Posted June 4, 2017 Share Posted June 4, 2017 (edited) 8 minutes ago, rjw63 said: Forgot to say, when we came out of the Symphony Hall a couple of weeks ago after a gig, there were coppers armed with machine guns. I liked it. I'm all up for armed police and handing over whatever powers is necessary. Edited June 4, 2017 by Rugeley Villa Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StefanAVFC Posted June 4, 2017 Share Posted June 4, 2017 2 minutes ago, Rugeley Villa said: handing over whatever powers in necessary. eh? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rugeley Villa Posted June 4, 2017 Share Posted June 4, 2017 3 minutes ago, Risso said: Look at some of the polls that have been carried out, this one for example: http://www.icmunlimited.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/04/Mulims-full-suite-data-plus-topline.pdf Only small percentages support the likes of IS, but 5% of 2m people is 100,000. An example is the following question: Q.32 Recently, four school girls from London travelled to Syria to join Islamic State. They are believed to have been recruited to become "jihadi brides". Can you understand why school girls like these would be attracted to become jihadi brides? Base: All respondents Roughly a quarter of respondents said yes. Q.35 Have you personally seen anything which has tried to encourage people to support violent extremism in the name of religion? Between 10% and 15% of people said yes. And so on. I've known this for a few years but it is concerning. Islam still has a lot of Stone Age views and a lot of backward people following the religion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rugeley Villa Posted June 4, 2017 Share Posted June 4, 2017 Just now, StefanAVFC said: eh? More control of internet or whatever. Or we can just carry on as normal and worry more about what trump is doing? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StefanAVFC Posted June 4, 2017 Share Posted June 4, 2017 1 minute ago, Rugeley Villa said: More control of internet or whatever. Or we can just carry on as normal and worry more about what trump is doing? One, not sure who mentioned Trump here. Two, giving up personal privacy under the guise of security is a very slippery slope indeed. We're sleepwalking into authoritarianism. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rugeley Villa Posted June 4, 2017 Share Posted June 4, 2017 Just now, StefanAVFC said: One, not sure who mentioned Trump here. Two, giving up personal privacy under the guise of security is a very slippery slope indeed. We're sleepwalking into authoritarianism. Well I'm prepared to give up a tiny bit of my privacy for national security. Not only that I'm not up to anything that would end up with armed police smashing down my door. I'm sure you are well aware but this is a huge problem we are having and it's probably going to get worse before it gets calmer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StefanAVFC Posted June 4, 2017 Share Posted June 4, 2017 how does monitoring everyone's internet usage prevent 5 blokes getting together in person, discussing renting a van and driving it into a crowd of people? Lets not forget that Theresa May has been targeting our personal freedoms for a few years now. People who don't want to have their usage tracked will make sure they're not. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ingram85 Posted June 4, 2017 Share Posted June 4, 2017 3 minutes ago, Rugeley Villa said: Well I'm prepared to give up a tiny bit of my privacy for national security. Not only that I'm not up to anything that would end up with armed police smashing down my door. I'm sure you are well aware but this is a huge problem we are having and it's probably going to get worse before it gets calmer. How would giving up your freedom of privacy stop lunatics from driving a van into people and start stabbing them in the 'name' of some made up deity? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xann Posted June 4, 2017 Share Posted June 4, 2017 10 minutes ago, Rugeley Villa said: I'm all up for armed police and handing over whatever powers is necessary. This is an awful thing to say, but you need to watch the first three 'Star Wars' films. That's starting with 'The Phantom Menace', sorry about that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chindie Posted June 4, 2017 VT Supporter Share Posted June 4, 2017 (edited) There aren't powers that will stop last night happening. There are powers that will claim to, and they will eat away at your rights, and extend their grasp further until they barely resemble the law they were intended to be. We slip into authoritarianism so easily. Edited June 4, 2017 by Chindie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rugeley Villa Posted June 4, 2017 Share Posted June 4, 2017 Just now, Xann said: This is an awful thing to say, but you need to watch the first three 'Star Wars' films. That's starting with 'The Phantom Menace', sorry about that. Do I have to Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobzy Posted June 4, 2017 Share Posted June 4, 2017 20 minutes ago, Risso said: Look at some of the polls that have been carried out, this one for example: http://www.icmunlimited.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/04/Mulims-full-suite-data-plus-topline.pdf Only small percentages support the likes of IS, but 5% of 2m people is 100,000. An example is the following question: Q.32 Recently, four school girls from London travelled to Syria to join Islamic State. They are believed to have been recruited to become "jihadi brides". Can you understand why school girls like these would be attracted to become jihadi brides? Base: All respondents Roughly a quarter of respondents said yes. Q.35 Have you personally seen anything which has tried to encourage people to support violent extremism in the name of religion? Between 10% and 15% of people said yes. And so on. I don't understand how this demonstrates tolerance? And, even if it did, I think it's a dangerous statement for the Prime Minister to make. "Enough is enough", "we have tolerated extremism". It's heading down the path we all don't want it to head down. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StefanAVFC Posted June 4, 2017 Share Posted June 4, 2017 1 minute ago, Chindie said: There aren't powers that will stop last happening. There are powers that will claim to, and they will eat away at your rights, and extend their grasp further until they barely resemble the law they were intended to be. We slip into authoritarianism so easily. From the comments on this page, some people are happy to invite authoritarianism into their lives. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rugeley Villa Posted June 4, 2017 Share Posted June 4, 2017 3 minutes ago, Ingram85 said: How would giving up your freedom of privacy stop lunatics from driving a van into people and start stabbing them in the 'name' of some made up deity? I'm not saying I will give up my freedom. We will never completely stamp it out but more needs to be done because we cannot carry on like this. A lot of people moan about having whatever privacy taken away but if it helps against terrorism I'm all for it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ingram85 Posted June 4, 2017 Share Posted June 4, 2017 Just now, Rugeley Villa said: I'm not saying I will give up my freedom. We will never completely stamp it out but more needs to be done because we cannot carry on like this. A lot of people moan about having whatever privacy taken away but if it helps against terrorism I'm all for it. But how will you giving up your freedom help stop terrorism from happening? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobzy Posted June 4, 2017 Share Posted June 4, 2017 1 minute ago, Rugeley Villa said: I'm not saying I will give up my freedom. We will never completely stamp it out but more needs to be done because we cannot carry on like this. A lot of people moan about having whatever privacy taken away but if it helps against terrorism I'm all for it. That's honestly bonkers - I can't believe you mean it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StefanAVFC Posted June 4, 2017 Share Posted June 4, 2017 (edited) 4 minutes ago, Rugeley Villa said: I. A lot of people moan about having whatever privacy taken away but if it helps against terrorism I'm all for it. if this is an attitude shared by the electorate as a whole then I'm terrified. where does it end? Intercepting letters? Emails? Phone calls? All in the name of preventing terrorism? and you 100% trust the government are telling the truth when they tell you your reduced freedoms are keeping you safer? I'm sure the people of NK are chuffed with dear leader keeping them safe too Edited June 4, 2017 by StefanAVFC Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rugeley Villa Posted June 4, 2017 Share Posted June 4, 2017 Just now, Ingram85 said: But how will you giving up your freedom help stop terrorism from happening? As I said terrorism will never go away but if certain measures are put into place and they infringe on our rights then providing they will genuinely help in the fight against terrorism then so be it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
colhint Posted June 4, 2017 Share Posted June 4, 2017 this is what I put in the Manchester bombings thread. I think whoever forms the next government should give a higher public profile to the Muslim Council of Britain. People say that 99% of Muslims are decent people, I think it's more like 99.99% are very decent people. I want to hear the MCB have a voice. I rarely hear about them in the media. In fact I think the only times I hear about them is when they have to apologise for an arsehole who claims their faith. I do remember a while back a local mosque raised money when Jewish graves were desecrated, hardly mentioned if I recall. I think if they have a higher platform they could highlight the many of the good things done by Muslims in this country. Unfortunately at the moment all we hear at the moment is the terrible things done by a tiny, tiny minority. I see they have had to come out again. They must feel like David Moyes last season on match of the day talking about another thrashing. Anyhow I have another thought, and this might already exist, I don't know. Given that the vast majority of muslims are good people, we should help them to help us. (probably not a good phrase but can't think of a better one at the moment) I reckon there are plenty of Muslim mothers brothers and sisters who are worried about their sons and also neighbours and friends sons behaving oddly, or think they maybe being radicalised. I don't know what lines of communication they have to report this. Maybe telling the father or Iman is not the right idea in some cases. If we could set up a Muslim help line along the lines of childline, where people could report their concerns totally confidential, we might get some people coming forward. I am sure there are plenty of Muslim women who love their faith but love children more. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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