Steve Bruce

[terrytini]

Just now, Thug said:

Think of the worst thing ever.

Times it by 2,

Take away what you first thought of.

Add 5.

 

Exactly

[terrytini]

5 minutes ago, av1 said:

The fact that the performances and results seem to be getting worse? 

 

Well, you can’t really say ‘fact’ and ‘seem’ in relation to the thing I question.

Secondly, worse than what ?

[Thug]

Worse than what we ought to be doing, maybe?

[Dave J]

5 minutes ago, terrytini said:

Ah that’s different. Yes there is a division, and yes there are supporters who want him in/ out.

Your OP said “ if you like/ dislike him you want him in/ out”, which is a different thing. It looks like I’ve not understood it how you meant it.

Sorry my apologies - I would only ever talk in footballing terms  and nothing else. 

 

[Guest av1]

4 minutes ago, DaveAV1 said:

Nas and Wes will be very aware of this I imagine. Possibly one of the reasons they waited for a change of manager was to not put immediate additional pressure on the new guy. If Bruce does ok, great. But if he begins to fail the appetite for change means the new guy gets cut much more slack. 

I personally think they would have wanted a little more time to settle in  themselves and build more behind the scenes. CEO is in place, just, but perhaps they’d give him more time plus a DOF, in an ideal world. However if things continue to unravel, they may feel they need to act. 

I don't disagree with any of your post Dave, all i would say regarding the bit in bold, is that we don't know what has been going on behind the scenes, or indeed how long CP has been in talks with the owners. 

Tammy Abraham apparently said (I'm just going off posts I've seen on here, I've not seen it myself), that Purslow played a part in his transfer, so it's not behond the realms of possibility to suggest that whilst he was only announced on Thursday, he could have been "working" with the board for a number of weeks. 

That's all conjecture of course, but work on a replacement could already have begun. Some of stuff from Bruce over the last few weeks leads me to believe that he knows he's under far more pressure than last season. 

[jacketspuds]

1 minute ago, terrytini said:

Worse than what ?

Come on. Surely you can see how disastrous the last week has been. From the Burton result and subsequent throwing of players under the bus, to the farcical Adomah fiasco, and now the pitiful performance yesterday with more excuses.

Results-wise yes we aren't on a terrible points total overall if you disregard who we have played and the squad we have, but in reality the start has not been good enough. He has had 2 years at the club now but still can't seem to get a consistent tune out of a squad containing Chester, Hutton, Jedinak, Whelan, Kodjia, Grealish and Adomah. These are experienced, quality players for this level and have been with Bruce for quite a while that I'm sure many other managers would have got more out of.

[Guest av1]

8 minutes ago, terrytini said:

Worse than what ?

Than last season. The team is more disjointed and the results against pretty mediocre opponents have been poor. 

The idea is to progress, we seem to be regressing under Bruce. 

[terrytini]

All these replies are doing is saying you don’t like what’s happened.

My point is, nobody, ( well, a majority) not even Bruces most ardent supporters, expected anything different in terms of style. And we are 3 Points away from 2 points per game.

The owners will have known all about his approach, his plans for players, his record, his strengths and weaknesses, when they decided to retain him.

THAT was when they should’ve changed things, if they had a preferred candidate, before we got started, before the Window closed.

So either they knew all that and  wanted him, in which case to sack him now would be a premature turnaround - they effectively re- appointed him.

OR 

they didn’t want him but had no preferred candidate available - in which case that is presumably still the situation.

 

[terrytini]

4 minutes ago, av1 said:

Than last season. The team is more disjointed and the results against pretty mediocre opponents have been poor. 

The idea is to progress, we seem to be regressing under Bruce. 

I don’t think it’s easy to judge that over half a dozen games.

Brentford was as good as we’ve played under him, Sheffield was as bad, even worse than Reading ( my personal nadir).

On the whole, Id say on balance were about the same as ever.

[terrytini]

7 minutes ago, jacketspuds said:

Come on. Surely you can see how disastrous the last week has been. From the Burton result and subsequent throwing of players under the bus, to the farcical Adomah fiasco, and now the pitiful performance yesterday with more excuses.

Results-wise yes we aren't on a terrible points total overall if you disregard who we have played and the squad we have, but in reality the start has not been good enough. He has had 2 years at the club now but still can't seem to get a consistent tune out of a squad containing Chester, Hutton, Jedinak, Whelan, Kodjia, Grealish and Adomah. These are experienced, quality players for this level and have been with Bruce for quite a while that I'm sure many other managers would have got more out of.

Paragraph 1 - I don’t think the owners would sack him because of a bad week, nor shoukd they.

Paragraph 2 - I don’t think any of that should be news to the owners, I think he’s delivering largely what one would have anticipated. Certainly not something so different to the past as to warrant a change of view by the owners.

[Fight Like Lions]

Next 6 fixtures (up to the next international break)-

Blackburn (A)

Rotherham (H)

Sheffield Wed (H)

Bristol City (A)

Preston (H)

Millwall (A)

With our squad all of those are winnable. Bring in a new manager now and we start to build the run needed to go into November and December when things start to get tougher. If Bruce is still here and messes this lot up like he has the first 6 games then we can kiss goodbye to promotion. 

[NurembergVillan]

9 minutes ago, terrytini said:

10 minutes ago, av1 said:

The fact that the performances and results seem to be getting worse? 

Worse than what ?

Hull A = 3-1 win, ok performance.

Wigan H = 3-2 win, ok in patches, came from behind and won in 4 mins of stoppage time.

Yeovil A = 1-0 win, poor performance but mitigated by playing second choice players. Rubbish opposition.

Ipswich A = 1-1, poor performance against 10 men. Lack of ability to unlock a defence owing to a lack of any sort of tactical shape and style.

Brentford H = 2-2, played well in the first half but missed chance.  Opposition coach made half time changes that we didn't respond to. Saved by an equaliser on 90+5.

Reading H = 1-1, rubbish aimless passing resulting in lots of possession and lots of hit and hope shots that never really troubled their keeper. Drew because of a silly penalty.

Burton A = 0-1 defeat, played appallingly against lower league opposition. Even with the changes, the lack of a tactical identity means the team has to be full strength to stand a chance, even against crap like Burton.

Sheff Utd A = 1-4 defeat, our heaviest loss under Bruce and another performance that exposed our defensive malaise and lack of any sort of a plan other than hoping the mercurial talents we've got up front can occupy the opposition for 90 minutes. It's fingers crossed football.

So surely this list shows what we're worse than.  We're worse than the last match every time we step onto the field, with the exception of 45 minutes against Brentford.

If he's a good manager, that's how we should be playing for 90 minutes every week.  If that's how he wants us to play but can't get the players to do it, even though they've demonstrated they're capable, he's not a good manager.

He's not a good manager.  Not any more.  If he ever was.

He's always been an effective manager, and that's why I bought into him.  A means to an end.  Right now he's ineffective and seemingly lacks the nous to correct that.

[terrytini]

I don’t see the difference between most of them and most of the previous 20, 30, 40, 50, 60 , 70 @NurembergVillan

[Guest av1]

2 minutes ago, terrytini said:

 

On the whole, Id say on balance were about the same as ever.

Ok lets say we are the same as last year. Last season wasn't good enough, so the same this year won't be either. 

I see no progression as a football club with Bruce in charge. And when we fail again this season (That's just my opinion of course as i can't see him taking us up), and we lose half the team we will need yet another rebuild and people will be defending him on the grounds he's lost 5/6 of the first 11, blind to the fact that Bruce's inability to build a squad is the very reason for that fact. 

 

[NurembergVillan]

Just now, terrytini said:

I don’t see the difference between most of them and most of the previous 20, 30, 40, 50, 60 , 70 @NurembergVillan

Which in itself speaks volumes as to why we're not getting promoted with him in charge.

The players come and go but the lack of any identity, and thus any progress, remains.

[terrytini]

If I may be so bold......some seem to be saying that the owners, who effectively appointed him a few weeks ago, shoukd now sack him after one League defeat and some poor play.

You can’t logically throw all your plans away and do that....otherwise no Manager would last a month.

Now, if you talk cumulatively, you may decide enough enough.....or you may not.

But they shouldn’t do that......they knew all there was to know when they decided to keep him.

[Johnnyp]

We'll beat Blackburn. He'll get a reprieve. It's Barnsley all over again from last season. We've 10 players away on international duty. Who would a new manager work with exactly ? I want him gone but it ain't happening. Yet.

[terrytini]

2 minutes ago, av1 said:

Ok lets say we are the same as last year. Last season wasn't good enough, so the same this year won't be either. 

I see no progression as a football club with Bruce in charge. And when we fail again this season (That's just my opinion of course as i can't see him taking us up), and we lose half the team we will need yet another rebuild and people will be defending him on the grounds he's lost 5/6 of the first 11, blind to the fact that Bruce's inability to build a squad is the very reason for that fact. 

 

Fine.

Thars just your view - and that of many others- of Bruce .

But those fears and negatives were there a few weeks ago.

[Johnnyp]

Just now, terrytini said:

If I may be so bold......some seem to be saying that the owners, who effectively appointed him a few weeks ago, shoukd now sack him after one League defeat and some poor play.

You can’t logically throw all your plans away and do that....otherwise no Manager would last a month.

Now, if you talk cumulatively, you may decide enough enough.....or you may not.

But they shouldn’t do that......they knew all there was to know when they decided to keep him.

Nobody. Not one person here is channelling all of their angst at Steve Bruce because of losing a single game 4-1. Its cumulative. 100% cumulative. And the whole "relax lads it's only one game " is patronising and condescending to be fair. Not from yourself but I've seen it a bit after yesterday's result. It's 80 odd games. I've had enough now.

[bannedfromHandV]

Shocking result and by all accounts a performance to boot. 

Bruce will quickly run out of people to back him at this rate, I don't think in itself it warrants the sack but its not looking as encouraging as it was a few weeks back.