Villa Park redevelopment

[nick76]

1 minute ago, bcarpet said:

Why would doubling the size of our club shop be a good thing? How many people really visit shops now a days? I do all my shopping online, including the bits I bought from the villa shop last month (which by the way wasn't a fantastic experience)

 

He's had a shocker so far for me

It’s absolutely jammed on match day at the moment.  My nephew loves going their pregame, I hate it because you are squeezing past people.

[Chindie]

4 minutes ago, Davkaus said:

Interesting perspective, thanks.

I think the one thing we can all agree on, is that if we thought the price hikes of the last couple of seasons were a bit steep, we haven't seen anything yet. I dread to think how much people will be paying if they want a ST next year.

They will be going in dry.

[mattyvilla]

probably put the tickets up 30% , huge increase in income no extra seats needed

[OutByEaster?]

I don't think there's any immediate intention to move from VP - both Purslow and Heck have said that they don't see us doing that at all and I would assume that the consistency of that message means it's coming from the owners. Never say never I guess, but I don't see this as being about a new stadium.

It's interesting and I guess there's been a fair bit of too-and-fro on this - the message a couple of months ago was that the demolition would be taking place in the summer of 2025, which is why I was so surprised to see the local press last week claim that we were back on for demolition this summer - and now it seems, the message is that we aren't going to see this happen in the next couple of years if at all.

The club seem confident that they'll still be able to host the Euros with our current capacity which is a positive.

The message seems to be about transport, with some odd stuff about needing to maintain the 'fortress' and adding too many seats at the same time - I suspect it's as much to do with the enormously spiralling costs of construction since the pandemic. As it is, we've spent a good chunk of money on architects, lawyers, surveys and all sorts of stuff like that, so this won't be a decision they've taken lightly.

I think the announcement of it was really scruffy and lacking in the detail people want - whenever that's the case with Mr Heck I tend to assume it means the news is bad so he'll start with a small bit and then add the finality later - he's confident, decisive and clearly backed by our owners, but I'm not sure we're going to like some of the things he does. The whole bit about not just pleasing one type of fan definitely to me was a suggestion that the one type of fan they're talking about is the one that pays £40 for a match ticket. By the time we get to 2028, I suspect there will be a lot more of those £120 a game experiences available and fewer and fewer regular seats - welcome to boutique Villa Park.

He's not a collaborative guy - he talks a lot about putting fans first and listening to voices and so on - I don't think he does that, I think he backs himself and makes his own decisions - we best hope he's getting them right.

Personally, I'm gutted, the North Stand isn't great and the designs were a significant improvement on Villa Park and a real statement of confidence in our future, and especially at the moment, when there's a chance we'll be top of the league at the end of the week, this announcement takes a bit of the air out of our balloon.

I hope we don't end up looking back on today as one of those moments where a chance to be 'bigger' and take a step forward was lost.

 

[ender4]

1 minute ago, Davkaus said:

I turn up, maybe buy a pint, watch the game, and piss off out of there   

I turn up, want to buy many pints and some food, look at the queues and think I’ll do without. However, I’m close to the limit of what I’d pay for a matchday ticket and I have a feeling so are many other people.  
 

Heck or someone has done a cost analysis and possibly worked out that increasing match ticket prices by 25% is the easiest way to get more revenue in, and he is correct that at those prices we aren’t filling 52,000 seater stadium.
 

However, if the thinking was long-term, then increasing the stadium capacity and getting more fans at current prices would have major benefits long-term but I doubt those benefits are in the cold £ calculation that is being done.

[ejs1111]

I think the answer is obvious.  NSWE are secretly building a temporary stadium elsewhere at the moment.  A super cheap lego style stadium for Villa to play in akin to Luton in appearance.  Then NWSE will demo VP except the Holte and rebuild a brand new stadium in the same location as VP.  A gorgeous modern 4 stand stadium similar Everton's new facility.  Win-win for everyone.  AVFC will just have to suffer playing in a lego sandbox for awhile.  

I'll get my coat

[Chindie]

2 minutes ago, OutByEaster? said:

I don't think there's any immediate intention to move from VP - both Purslow and Heck have said that they don't see us doing that at all and I would assume that the consistency of that message means it's coming from the owners. Never say never I guess, but I don't see this as being about a new stadium.

It's interesting and I guess there's been a fair bit of too-and-fro on this - the message a couple of months ago was that the demolition would be taking place in the summer of 2025, which is why I was so surprised to see the local press last week claim that we were back on for demolition this summer - and now it seems, the message is that we aren't going to see this happen in the next couple of years if at all.

The club seem confident that they'll still be able to host the Euros with our current capacity which is a positive.

The message seems to be about transport, with some odd stuff about needing to maintain the 'fortress' and adding too many seats at the same time - I suspect it's as much to do with the enormously spiralling costs of construction since the pandemic. As it is, we've spent a good chunk of money on architects, lawyers, surveys and all sorts of stuff like that, so this won't be a decision they've taken lightly.

I think the announcement of it was really scruffy and lacking in the detail people want - whenever that's the case with Mr Heck I tend to assume it means the news is bad so he'll start with a small bit and then add the finality later - he's confident, decisive and clearly backed by our owners, but I'm not sure we're going not like some of the things he does. The whole bit about not just pleasing one type of fan definitely to me was a suggestion that the one type of fan they're talking about is the one that pays £40 for a match ticket. By the time we get to 2028, I suspect there will be a lot more of those £120 a game experiences available and fewer and fewer regular seats - welcome to boutique Villa Park.

He's not a collaborative guy - he talks a lot about putting fans first and listening to voices and so on - I don't think he does that, I think he backs himself and makes his own decisions - we best hope he's getting them right.

Personally, I'm gutted, the North Stand isn't great and the designs were a significant improvement on Villa Park and a real statement of confidence in our future, and especially at the moment, when there's a chance we'll be top of the league at the end of the week, this announcement takes a bit of the air out of our balloon.

I hope we don't end up looking back on today as one of those moments where a chance to be 'bigger' and take a step forward was lost.

 

All of the stuff that came out of his mouth regarding 'why' we don't do it is rubbish. He's putting sugar over a decision he knows is going to be unpopular.

The transport argument lost it's validity the moment the council said yes to the idea of the expansion. If anything the club ops team should be happy getting people away from the ground is bad - we WANT people to hang around the stadium and spend money, and he is on record stating he wants to invest in stuff that is designed to drive non-match ticket revenue, with the crap about the greatly exapnding shop and the 'Warehouse'. If it's a **** nightmare to get a train for an hour would you rather stand outside the station or hang around in the warm with a drink? We've been told this is the dream, why the big clubs are doing so well at making revenue on matchday, making people stay on site longer... so suddenly we're unhappy we can't get people to leave quick enough? Come off it.

It's simply about short term wins. Whats cheap and quick and pumps money? Not a project that reduces capacity for a season and costs a bunch and has longer term returns at heart.

[mykeyb]

The increase in costs have made this unaffordable. Perhaps our 100 million project is now 125 or 130 million, then the loss of income for the 2 years adds on another 12 to 15 million and all of a sudden that's 150 million which needs to be found with the increase in revenue taking 15 years to pay back........he is right to have a look at it.

[ender4]

1 minute ago, ejs1111 said:

I think the answer is obvious.  NSWE are secretly building a temporary stadium elsewhere at the moment.  A super cheap lego style stadium for Villa to play in akin to Luton in appearance.  Then NWSE will demo VP except the Holte and rebuild a brand new stadium in the same location as VP.  A gorgeous modern 4 stand stadium similar Everton's new facility.  Win-win for everyone.  AVFC will just have to suffer playing in a lego sandbox for awhile.  

I'll get my coat

We could also ground share at the Sty.

[VillaJ100]

4 hours ago, sne said:

Thank McGrath that things on the pitch is going great because the off field stuff is a bit all over the place.

It feels like us sorting our shit out off the pitch had taken time to come through and now we're seeing the results. But now we seem to be a basket case off of it again in a couple of seasons where will we be?

We should tell BCC to F off, build the station ourselves, charge every bluenose an additional tariff to use it, buy Aston hall, buy all the low quality housing surrounding like Doug should have decades ago and do what we want

EDIT Heck can shove that terrible logo up his **** as well

Edited December 19, 2023 by VillaJ100

[OutByEaster?]

Just now, VillaJ100 said:

We should tell BCC to F off, build the station ourselves, charge every bluenose an additional tariff to use it, buy Aston hall, buy all the low quality housing surrounding like Doug should have decades ago and do what we want

BCC aren't an obstacle at all - the planning permission we've got doesn't include the need for the station.

[Follyfoot]

22 minutes ago, Lord Willard said:

Only if it’s in the city centre 

This presents somewhat of a problem

[Follyfoot]

22 minutes ago, stewiek2 said:

That'll piss the noses off. Means we can go drinking in town...

 

Mate.

Only if we have a special match day pass, which we can present upon enquiry. Remember they are buying all of Birmingham so we will be a tenant at Best

Edited December 19, 2023 by Follyfoot

[OutByEaster?]

7 minutes ago, mykeyb said:

The increase in costs have made this unaffordable. Perhaps our 100 million project is now 125 or 130 million, then the loss of income for the 2 years adds on another 12 to 15 million and all of a sudden that's 150 million which needs to be found with the increase in revenue taking 15 years to pay back........he is right to have a look at it.

I think the cost of construction will be a massive driver - I noticed that the BBC paused their plans for their new regional HQ in Birmingham earlier this week and I read somewhere that the cost of steel in big constructions is eight times what it was around the time of the pandemic. I'm sure we could afford to do it, but whether it's good value at the moment is another question.

Does anyone know when the planning permission expires?

[StewieGriffin]

Quote

"Number one, we talk about Villa Park being a fortress. It is true. There is no better home advantage than at Villa Park and I think it would be a bad idea to tear down one of the stands for a two year period while we are playing like we are." 

So... we should get a bigger stand/capacity when we aren't very good?  

Who/what is the marker on when we aren't playing like we currently are? Emery? NSWE? Heck?

If we get a reality check against Sheffield United on Friday do we think "f**k it, do it" ?

Something not quite right here (more something we arent going to be told as opposed to something nefarious)

[OutByEaster?]

3 minutes ago, StewieGriffin said:

So... we should get a bigger stand/capacity when we aren't very good?  

More importantly, does this mean that if we can stay as quiet as Fulham they'll build us a new stand?

 

[StewieGriffin]

23 minutes ago, OutByEaster? said:

I hope we don't end up looking back on today as one of those moments where a chance to be 'bigger' and take a step forward was lost.

 

Perhaps if/when it gets built too late, we can name it the Juninho-Keane-Izzett-Falcao Stand

[HanoiVillan]

21 minutes ago, Chindie said:

They will be going in dry.

 

[OutByEaster?]

I think in terms of our immediate future - Villa Park is slightly bigger than Stamford Bridge and generates a helluva lot more income than Villa Park - I suspect we're going to end up doing a lot more of what they do.

 

[nick76]

1 minute ago, OutByEaster? said:

More importantly, does this mean that if we can stay as quiet as Fulham they'll build us a new stand?

 

or Liverpool.  That was one of the quietest grounds I’ve heard against Man U the other day…none of the KOP/Anfield roar.