Sam3773 Posted December 27, 2015 Share Posted December 27, 2015 The last three seasons from this point onwards we got 18, 19 and 23 points. We don't need Champion's league form at all, we just need to do slightly better than we did when we came 17th, 15th and 15th. Difficult, but far from impossible with the right investment in January. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VillaChris Posted December 27, 2015 Share Posted December 27, 2015 2 hours ago, Richard said: Well let me help you out and put that hope back in the box. we are further behind now than when Garde joined us we have not won in 17 games thats four months ago meaning in the second half of the season we have to win around 8 games and draw five or six, that's top 6 form and the last time we hit top six form was six years ago with a vastly superior team the last two times we have been bottom at Christmas we have gone down How do you think we'd do if we went down Richard, you seem reasonably connected with people in the club given the breaking of transfers each summer. What do you think the strategy would be, would Lerner drop the asking price for a takeover significantly, would we try to keep the French lot or sell them on and sign championship standard players? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VillaForever1970 Posted December 27, 2015 Share Posted December 27, 2015 1 minute ago, VillaChris said: How do you think we'd do if we went down Richard, you seem reasonably connected with people in the club given the breaking of transfers each summer. Dont encourage the nonsense please, no more connected than the postman who delivers to VP. People seem to have their favourites, one manager is allowed time another is not; its very tiring hopefully when we're relegated the now now now fans will decrease. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
markavfc40 Posted December 27, 2015 Share Posted December 27, 2015 10 minutes ago, VillaForever1970 said: hopefully when we're relegated the now now now fans will decrease. I don't think we have too many of these do we mate in fairness. We haven't won a trophy in almost twenty years and have been in and around the relegation places for the last 6 seasons yet over 38k turned up yesterday to watch a side bottom of the league and 10 points adrift of safety. In the main we are hardly a demanding bunch hoping for over night success. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Demitri_C Posted December 27, 2015 Share Posted December 27, 2015 2 hours ago, dont_do_it_doug. said: Sure. But it won't be "top 6 form" because getting into the top 6 takes 38 games, not 20. I don't doubt it's a monumentally difficult task and most likely beyond us now. But say the implausible does happen and we win the next 2 and close the gap to 5 points, as an example. Do we suddenly switch to talking about needing top 12 form? No, because it's silly. IMO of course. West Ham were there for the taking yet we failed (yet again) to win. I have no problem with those thinking we will stay up but I think your going to be disappointed the 9 points also is on the basis the other sides dont pickup any points again very unlikely.we need a miracle and i dont see it at all. we had to pickup a in in either of our last two yet we didnt deliver (again) 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dont_do_it_doug. Posted December 27, 2015 Share Posted December 27, 2015 It was our best performance of the season yesterday against an injury hit midtable team at home. And we still couldn't win. Not because of the referee, not because of the tactics, not because of bad luck, not because we didn't 'click' but simply because we're not good enough. We don't have enough quality. People can talk about numbers, form, runs, confidence, improvements all they like, we're never all going to agree. There are, almost admirable, people on here who will truly believe it's possible until it becomes mathematically not. There are others who will feel we're doomed even if we win five in a row as it'd be unsustainable form. But to me, form comes from quality and we have very little. Something impressive needs to happen in the January transfer window to make me change my mind. We didn't win yesterday because we couldn't finish. No other reason. There is a distinction between performance and result. Our performance yesterday against a solid top 8 side was good enough to win us the game. When was the last time we could say something like that? Sunderland at home was the last time we deserved to win a game over 90 minutes, but they're as bad as we have been. Worse at the time. I agree that we desperately need a reliable striker. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dont_do_it_doug. Posted December 27, 2015 Share Posted December 27, 2015 Sure. But it won't be "top 6 form" because getting into the top 6 takes 38 games, not 20. I don't doubt it's a monumentally difficult task and most likely beyond us now. But say the implausible does happen and we win the next 2 and close the gap to 5 points, as an example. Do we suddenly switch to talking about needing top 12 form? No, because it's silly. IMO of course. West Ham were there for the taking yet we failed (yet again) to win. I have no problem with those thinking we will stay up but I think your going to be disappointed the 9 points also is on the basis the other sides dont pickup any points again very unlikely.we need a miracle and i dont see it at all. we had to pickup a in in either of our last two yet we didnt deliver (again) The 9 points is based on being 9 points better than those teams. I made that as clear as I could. Again, thank you for the patronising concern. You put Charlie Austin or a player of that ilk on the end of those chances yesterday and you don't think we win? Yes, it might well be too late. No harm in giving it a go though is there. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
markavfc40 Posted December 27, 2015 Share Posted December 27, 2015 6 minutes ago, dont_do_it_doug. said: You put Charlie Austin or a player of that ilk on the end of those chances yesterday and you don't think we win? Yes, it might well be too late. No harm in giving it a go though is there. I agree you put in Austin or if we still had Benteke in the side then we win that game comfortably yesterday. I hope we do give it a go in January but I think to have any hope of Lerner splashing the big money needed either in fees, wages or likely both we need to win the next two games and be with in a handful of points of safety and then have a realistic hope of staying up. Without that then I don't see Lerner gambling. As you said earlier these next two games are huge. And some in fact. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Demitri_C Posted December 27, 2015 Share Posted December 27, 2015 30 minutes ago, dont_do_it_doug. said: The 9 points is based on being 9 points better than those teams. I made that as clear as I could. Again, thank you for the patronising concern. You put Charlie Austin or a player of that ilk on the end of those chances yesterday and you don't think we win? Yes, it might well be too late. No harm in giving it a go though is there. Patronising?? Really?? Think your reading too much into my post but I was merely pointing out some facts to support my reasoning. No need to get defensive When someone questions you. it is abit hard to visualise that as we may play differently with a Charlie Austin up top so I can't comment on that. I base my opinion on the crap we have all had to watch since the season began. We can't win one league game so how on earth are we going to win 10 like garde thinks we need? Let's not forget we have one of the worst goal differences in the league as well. So we need to not only win games but we need to score goals something we are failing miserably on. like I said above I have no objection to those who feel we stay up, just in return those who don't think we will should not be labelled doom merchants either. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dont_do_it_doug. Posted December 27, 2015 Share Posted December 27, 2015 Just now, Demitri_C said: Patronising?? Really?? Think your reading too much into my post but I was merely pointing out some facts to support my reasoning. No need to get defensive When someone questions you. it is abit hard to visualise that as we may play differently with a Charlie Austin up top so I can't comment on that. I base my opinion on the crap we have all had to watch since the season began. We can't win one league game so how on earth are we going to win 10 like garde thinks we need? Let's not forget we have one of the worst goal differences in the league as well. So we need to not only win games but we need to score goals something we are failing miserably on. like I said above I have no objection to those who feel we stay up, just in return those who don't think we will should not be labelled doom merchants either. Sorry Dem, I'm just sick of being told how disappointed I'm going to be when we're relegated. I'm a 32 year old Villa fan. I wasn't talking about the crap we've had to watch since the season began, I'm talking about here and now. I think looking back at this point is a futile exercise and hopefully the ghost of Tim Sherwood can be banished once and for all tomorrow afternoon. I don't think anybody legitimately thinks we will stay up. I don't. I think we will go down, perhaps I haven't made that clear enough. If anyone does think that it is a display of admirable confidence, one I hope the players are going with. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Demitri_C Posted December 27, 2015 Share Posted December 27, 2015 33 minutes ago, dont_do_it_doug. said: Sorry Dem, I'm just sick of being told how disappointed I'm going to be when we're relegated. I'm a 32 year old Villa fan. I wasn't talking about the crap we've had to watch since the season began, I'm talking about here and now. I think looking back at this point is a futile exercise and hopefully the ghost of Tim Sherwood can be banished once and for all tomorrow afternoon. I don't think anybody legitimately thinks we will stay up. I don't. I think we will go down, perhaps I haven't made that clear enough. If anyone does think that it is a display of admirable confidence, one I hope the players are going with. No worries mate. I understand, for the record I would 100% love to be proven wrong. I hope your right, but I think the problem stems before sherwood. we have been in a rotten state for too long now. declining every season. is there something behind the scene? the players harmony at the club? but there is something definitely wrong at this club Unfortunately the players no belief attitude seems to be rubbing on some of us fans as well and I am definitely guilty of falling into that crowd.If they started winning and showed us something then I think people would maybe not have that perception . 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dont_do_it_doug. Posted December 27, 2015 Share Posted December 27, 2015 21 minutes ago, Demitri_C said: No worries mate. I understand, for the record I would 100% love to be proven wrong. I hope your right, but I think the problem stems before sherwood. we have been in a rotten state for too long now. declining every season. is there something behind the scene? the players harmony at the club? but there is something definitely wrong at this club Unfortunately the players no belief attitude seems to be rubbing on some of us fans as well and I am definitely guilty of falling into that crowd.If they started winning and showed us something then I think people would maybe not have that perception . It's not any one thing, it's the culmination of nearly a decades worth of mismanagement at almost every single level. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Demitri_C Posted December 27, 2015 Share Posted December 27, 2015 1 minute ago, dont_do_it_doug. said: It's not any one thing, it's the culmination of nearly a decades worth of mismanagement at almost every single level. That we can agree on!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bose Posted December 27, 2015 Share Posted December 27, 2015 If we manage to win the next two matches we'll have the same amount of points as Leicester had after the same amount of matches last season. Six games later they had amassed four more points. This is far from over. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grasshopper Posted December 27, 2015 Share Posted December 27, 2015 I'm hoping we wont go down it is possible to stay up (still) if ours and at least 3 other teams results go in our favour. so I will remain optimistic and believe its possible with that I will commit myself 100% to believing. i'll have to wait till its proved that we are down as not to believe anymore the point about being disappointed either now or later is irrelevant to me personally because 1) I'll be devastated anyway now or later 2) I will get over it and "go again" 3) there are many things in my life that both disappoint me and make me extremely happy. So getting 1 factor in life kicked where it hurts will only make other good things sweeter 4) I think/hope we can have happier times at AVFC one day as I'm 54 in march I can only hope/wish it to be in my lifetime. having said that, I've been a fan who has seen relegation to Div 3, Promotion to Div 2 & Div 1. 4 League cup wins. 1 Div 1 Champion & the Eurooean cup win. So I feel priveledged anyway. UTV VTID Grasshopper 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Demitri_C Posted December 27, 2015 Share Posted December 27, 2015 7 minutes ago, bose said: If we manage to win the next two matches we'll have the same amount of points as Leicester had after the same amount of matches last season. Six games later they had amassed four more points. This is far from over. But didnt they beat man united in one of thei games prior by scoring five goals? Can you imagine us even scoring 2 goals let alone 5! I just think they hit a poor run of form and were not a poor side unlike us Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HAL Posted December 27, 2015 Share Posted December 27, 2015 I still think there is a slight change of us staying up but we need a striker not matter what the amount of chances our players are passing up to win games is crazy . + rudy cant even get headed shots on target Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jareth Posted December 27, 2015 Share Posted December 27, 2015 Going on the last two games I think the players do have some belief that they can compete in games. Just need that one win for them to believe they can actually win games. This is a long way from where Sherwood left them, in quite a short amount of time so hats off to Remi if he can keep it going. Just need to replace about 5 players in Jan with quality upgrades and we have a shot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VillaForever1970 Posted December 27, 2015 Share Posted December 27, 2015 5 hours ago, markavfc40 said: I don't think we have too many of these do we mate in fairness. We haven't won a trophy in almost twenty years and have been in and around the relegation places for the last 6 seasons yet over 38k turned up yesterday to watch a side bottom of the league and 10 points adrift of safety. In the main we are hardly a demanding bunch hoping for over night success. True we don’t have many, we still have muppets who want a new manager after 5 mins same with players. I’m hoping people are a little more level headed in the championship. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HanoiVillan Posted December 27, 2015 Share Posted December 27, 2015 8 hours ago, Dr_Pangloss said: Wow, this is far too logical to be in this thread mate, well done. What I don't quite understand is this notion that we are 'improving' and that this will bode well for 'next season'. Firstly, to be improving in what is almost certainly a relegation season is very much scant consolation in my opinion. Secondly, there's a very, very high chance that any half way decent performer will be off if/when we do go down. I'd wager quite a lot of money that the likes of Ayew, Veretout, Gil, Traore, Richards, Amavi (OK depends on how long the guy will be out) and even Gana will stick around. Most of these players probably have relegation release clauses in place, so we won't even recoup what we spent on them. Point being, we will not be in good shape if/when we go down, it will be a total disaster and whatever 'improvements' made under Garde this season, will not carry over for next season, because a lot of this team will not be here anyway and we will be back to square one. This doesn't make sense to me. Surely 'us being less shit' is worth it for aesthetic reasons if nothing else. I mean, given the choice, I'd rather go down not being humiliated every week. If we want to get better - and yes, that does include next season, because not all of our players will be leaving - then we need to improve. What's more, if we went down having played well over the second half of the season, and we decided we wanted to keep the manager because he was doing well, then that would help with transfer business in the summer. We'd look like a well-run team relegated by previous shit management who were now righting their course and a good bet for coming back up. If we are just dogshit all year then of course we'll look like a crisis club and there will be an impact to that. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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