The Chairman Mao resembling, Monarchy hating, threat to Britain, Labour Party thread

[darrenm]

@Bickster - yes, my point exactly. Why should she have them all?

@peaceful solution with IS... They want to take over lots of countries that belong to other people. Short of "we surrender", there's not much to talk about. It's this kind of thing for me where JC moves from eccentric but endearing to, 'beyond the sun'. 

There's that box I was referring to

Fair enough Darren, I nominate you to go and lead these peace negotiations. Save them the trouble and dress in orange.

 

I don't profess to know the answer, I just think pouring fuel on the fire without fully understanding the ramifications and exhausting all peaceful solutions is a bad idea.

They're not the first terrorists to chop people's heads off. They're just the first ones to do it on TV.

[TrentVilla]

can someone tell me what the crack is with this jeremy corbyn.

Well he says he wants a peaceful solution to the issue of ISIS so crack might just be the issue.

You don't want a peaceful solution? You'd rather people died that didn't have to?

Yes that is exactly it. I don't want a peaceful solution and I want people to die, as many as possible.

Or alternatively I'm a little more realistic about the prospects for a peaceful solution to the issue of ISIS and unlike the new leader of the opposition I've long since stopped think that if I wish really really hard for something it will happen.

It's guerilla warfare. You can't just bomb them into submission, that only creates sharper splinters. There's no easy solution but blind luck and stepping away from the red button has kept us out of nuclear winter so far.

I'm not sure that anyone including AWOL thinks we can bomb them into submission but we can't invite them over to Number 10 for a cup of green tea, a chat and a treaty though either. There can't be a peaceful solution to the issue of ISIS unless we turn our back on the who thing and leave them to it and hope they settle with half of the Middle East as their patch.

I guess it worked for Chamberlain...

Edited September 12, 2015 by TrentVilla

[tonyh29]

6000 plus people have joined the Labour Party today since the announcement of the result

I remember similar posts on VT about masses  joining up when Unite put Ed in charge ... Still didn't win him an election 

[mjmooney]

6000 plus people have joined the Labour Party today since the announcement of the result

I remember similar posts on VT about masses  joining up when Unite put Ed in charge ... Still didn't win him an election 

Ed didn't lose because of policies, he lost because of his voice and his face. Sad, but true. For whatever reason, people seem to find JC more attractive. That's modern politics.

[tonyh29]

can someone tell me what the crack is with this jeremy corbyn.

Until someone comes along to correct me, he's someone who's a bit more of an old skool lefty red socialist Labour politician, rather than the current crop of right, blue, conservative, Tory clones which the Labour party has been pushing since New Labour.

But as well as being like the Labour of old, he also has some modern ideas which are quite progressive and are akin to the kind of things the Greens are pushing, but are quite scary to people who (I would consider) aren't fighting very hard to get out of their limited thinking box.

The current system of government in the UK is that the 2 major parties have various friends in the media who they can call up to attack anyone and the public just lap it up, therefore someone who isn't part of this protection racket hasn't really got a hope. The same goes for big businesses and the banks too, they've got every reason to fear someone who isn't part of their agenda.

It's why, unfortunately, he probably hasn't got a hope of winning the next election. The papers will dig up every scraping of every bone of every skeleton in every closet he has, unless he scratches a few backs quickly - promises to get something like TTIP through or something like that.

Although they've already painted him as nigh on Hitler's right hand man and he's come through it so perhaps people aren't so ready to be duped by the media these days.

Just my thoughts anyway. The British identity is quite socialist in my opinion so we naturally sway left. The majority of people want the good side of socialism, with a healthy dose of liberalism and with just a little bit of conservatism. We want to play fair, no-one gets a free ride, but no-one should be left in the gutter if they fall over. Modern Tory policies seem to be to kick as many people over into the gutter as possible, then stand on them so they can't get up, because they've only got themselves to blame for being down there.

I'm curious that you think the British are socialist at heart and yet haven't elected a socialist government since Wilson in 74  (and even that is debatable )

[tonyh29]

6000 plus people have joined the Labour Party today since the announcement of the result

 

I remember similar posts on VT about masses  joining up when Unite put Ed in charge ... Still didn't win him an election 

 

Ed didn't lose because of policies, he lost because of his voice and his face. Sad, but true. For whatever reason, people seem to find JC more attractive. That's modern politics.

it was more a comment that we had new  members joining labour in droves previously rather than a comment on the policies so it's a bit early for Corbyn to start measuring for curtains at number 10

 

for Ed I think despite everything he had a chance of being PM right up until that last TV debate where he refused to admit labour got it wrong on spending and then you literally saw it disappear in the blink of an eye .....well that and his Moses moment with the stone 

Edited September 12, 2015 by tonyh29

[chrisp65]

Aah that stone, a sublime mix of The Thick Of It and Spinal Tap.

Was it ever found? Last I heard some Irish Villa fan had it under his patio for safe keeping.

 

[tonyh29]

I suppose the burning question now is who is the next PM .... Boris , Osborne or May ?

When Cameron stands down before the next election, you mean?

yep the next leadership election but without the £3 to sabotage a party entry fee 

You know that if you removed every single one of the three pound votes, he still won

that might be as much down to the fact only 48% of affiliate members voted ... But it doesn't take away that the vote was sabotaged , why i even know of one person in this thread who doesn't support labour and yet paid his £3 (not me I should add)  ... Think of the amount of time and effort that must have gone into vetting people

Edited September 12, 2015 by tonyh29

[HanoiVillan]

Good to see Kendall ruling herself out of any sort of shadow cabinet role.

4% of the vote should tell her everything she needs to know about her vision for light blue labour.

and yet I thought she was the candidate that supporters thought could unite the party and take it forward ?

 

 

 

4%

I think you've confused the words supporters and husband.

She's not married. Fun fact! Until about two months ago, she was dating the actor who played Mr Gilbert in 'The Inbetweeners'. 

[MakemineVanilla]

I thought this was interesting and not entirely irrelevant to the thread.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tTu3gVvm_K8 

And a few clues why Kendal came last.

 

Edited September 13, 2015 by MakemineVanilla

[TrentVilla]

6000 plus people have joined the Labour Party today since the announcement of the result

 

I remember similar posts on VT about masses  joining up when Unite put Ed in charge ... Still didn't win him an election 

 

Ed didn't lose because of policies, he lost because of his voice and his face. Sad, but true. For whatever reason, people seem to find JC more attractive. That's modern politics.

Neither of those things probably helped him but neither did his seeming complete inability to realise that the message on his tablet of stone simply didn't appeal to the electorate and the issues in their lives, perceived or otherwise.

Labour failed on immigration, benefits and the perception which was created in part by the Tory's and their press friends but also by the actions of Labour themselves.

Labour may have increased their vote by 1.2% but they failed to engage the electorate and in particular the swing voters and those who deserted the Lib Dems.

While the Labour Party (plus lots of ringers) have given this guy a landslide victory the last election should show that a further move to the left isn't likely to see a reverse of fortunes.

And I say that as someone who has always voted for Labour.

    

Edited September 13, 2015 by TrentVilla

[norwegianvillain]

Corbyn wants to print money to pay for all his cheap liberal voter baits. Jeezuz. He's clearly aiming for economic illiterates.

[Jarpie]

Edit: Might be a bit off-topic but I saw some people talking why Labour lost, so I thought to throw in another perspective beside Milliband's character and charisma.

I didn't follow british elections closely, but if your elections and the labour party were/are anything like in here, the reason why labour lost could be parallel to why our left party and social democrats got massacred in our elections.

I believe that at least in here big reason why they lost was because the voters weren't buying what they were/are selling. Both left party and the social democrats in here were claiming to be "for the common people" or "working people", but those people do not believe anymore that left party and SDP represent or advocate the things their supposed voting base wants or cares about.

Both parties' politicians comes off as people who are completely divorced from the reality of the "common people", who drink champagne in their multi-million euro houses, and then claim to understand how normal people lives and cares about, when in reality they have no idea at all. They also come off as people who think they know better what other people should think and knows better what's good for them.

Similar thing might've happened in UK with the labour party.

Edited September 13, 2015 by Jarpie

[chrisp65]

Good to see Kendall ruling herself out of any sort of shadow cabinet role.

4% of the vote should tell her everything she needs to know about her vision for light blue labour.

and yet I thought she was the candidate that supporters thought could unite the party and take it forward ?

 

 

 

4%

I think you've confused the words supporters and husband.

She's not married. Fun fact! Until about two months ago, she was dating the actor who played Mr Gilbert in 'The Inbetweeners'. 

I did know that, honestly! I was being flippant and using short hand to suggest 4% was a very small number.

 

[tonyh29]

Good to see Kendall ruling herself out of any sort of shadow cabinet role.

4% of the vote should tell her everything she needs to know about her vision for light blue labour.

and yet I thought she was the candidate that supporters thought could unite the party and take it forward ?

 

 

 

4%

I think you've confused the words supporters and husband.

She's not married. Fun fact! Until about two months ago, she was dating the actor who played Mr Gilbert in 'The Inbetweeners'. 

 

I did know that, honestly! I was being flippant and using short hand to suggest 4% was a very small number.

 

Stef will be after you for not doing your research

I didn't know she wasn't married either if you need company in the corner with the D hat 

Edited September 13, 2015 by tonyh29

[chrisp65]

No, I really did know she wasn't married. I really did know that giant comedian bloke Greg Davies recently split up with her.

It wasn't really a mental picture I wanted, there's quite a size difference.

Happy to wear the old D hat, happy to join you in the corner. But I ain't going down for that one! As it were.

[bickster]

Jebus, that LizWhatserface interview is a complete car crash… the Thick of It in real life

[mjmooney]

Did any of you VT gamblers have a bet on Corbyn when he was 500-1 ?

[VillaChris]

He's not in power so his policies are never going to get implemented.  Maybe this is all part of a Labour ruse?  I suspect he will be a very good foil against Cameron, arguing unashamedly for old Labour values and taking the higher social ground, which a lot of the public will like - including those in Scotland where Labour needs to win seats back to have any chance.  Maybe there is a cunning plan here for him not to actually stand for election, but to do some damage to the Tories and test out which left of centre policies seem most popular with voters.  Then the new - more electable leader - steps in nearer the election, pulling the party back towards the centre, but keeping the left polices that resonated with the electorate.  Just speculating but there is a lot of time between now and the election and this could be a way for Labour to test our where, and how far, they can and should move to the left.  

My argument to that is who on earth is the more, electable leader ready to step in, you've had in this election established names like Burnham and Cooper get trashed just to be the leader of their party, Burnham got a third less votes so can't see who else is out there unless Chuka suddenly decides he's ready to stand in a few years.

[darrenm]

can someone tell me what the crack is with this jeremy corbyn.

Until someone comes along to correct me, he's someone who's a bit more of an old skool lefty red socialist Labour politician, rather than the current crop of right, blue, conservative, Tory clones which the Labour party has been pushing since New Labour.

But as well as being like the Labour of old, he also has some modern ideas which are quite progressive and are akin to the kind of things the Greens are pushing, but are quite scary to people who (I would consider) aren't fighting very hard to get out of their limited thinking box.

The current system of government in the UK is that the 2 major parties have various friends in the media who they can call up to attack anyone and the public just lap it up, therefore someone who isn't part of this protection racket hasn't really got a hope. The same goes for big businesses and the banks too, they've got every reason to fear someone who isn't part of their agenda.

It's why, unfortunately, he probably hasn't got a hope of winning the next election. The papers will dig up every scraping of every bone of every skeleton in every closet he has, unless he scratches a few backs quickly - promises to get something like TTIP through or something like that.

Although they've already painted him as nigh on Hitler's right hand man and he's come through it so perhaps people aren't so ready to be duped by the media these days.

Just my thoughts anyway. The British identity is quite socialist in my opinion so we naturally sway left. The majority of people want the good side of socialism, with a healthy dose of liberalism and with just a little bit of conservatism. We want to play fair, no-one gets a free ride, but no-one should be left in the gutter if they fall over. Modern Tory policies seem to be to kick as many people over into the gutter as possible, then stand on them so they can't get up, because they've only got themselves to blame for being down there.

I'm curious that you think the British are socialist at heart and yet haven't elected a socialist government since Wilson in 74  (and even that is debatable )

Difficult one to answer really. I suppose I think it's mainly because in general people are stupid and the electorate at large have no idea what they're actually voting for.