Awol Posted November 16, 2015 Share Posted November 16, 2015 (edited) 12 minutes ago, Chindie said: I don't doubt this but it would be interesting to see what they defined as 'foiling an attack'. The term conjures up images of guys getting raiding as they're soldering the wires to the c4, whereas I'd suspect that the more accurate take would be that they've picked up a load of guys who popped up on a list as having looked at dodgy material the intelligence services have flagged. It doesn't remove the great standard of work GCHQ and co are doing but probably ranks down the threat mentally when it's actually more often than not picking up guys that present a risk rather than an imminent threat. The Security Service are more inclined to watch, observe and record plotters for as long as possible until the risk is considered too great to let them continue their preparation. This allows them to gather more evidence and increase the likely hood of prosecution, in addition to hopefully exposing more of their network over time. That unfortunate business with Irish Republicanism gave the UK a very good grounding in this sort of thing. The one good thing for us about Paris is Cameron and Co. finally having their hands forced in terms of funding for our foreign and domestic intelligence services, which were both (moronically) cut following the London Olympics. Edited November 16, 2015 by Awol speoling 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TrentVilla Posted November 16, 2015 Moderator Share Posted November 16, 2015 23 minutes ago, Chindie said: I don't doubt this but it would be interesting to see what they defined as 'foiling an attack'. The term conjures up images of guys getting raiding as they're soldering the wires to the c4, whereas I'd suspect that the more accurate take would be that they've picked up a load of guys who popped up on a list as having looked at dodgy material the intelligence services have flagged. It doesn't remove the great standard of work GCHQ and co are doing but probably ranks down the threat mentally when it's actually more often than not picking up guys that present a risk rather than an imminent threat. I think the numbers being quoted should surely counter this view, 7 threats in 12 months. I think it is fair to assume that there have been more than 7 instances or groups of individuals picked up by the intelligence services based on this criteria including limpid! Personally I take it to mean things a little more significant when they use they talk about foiling plots against the UK. Given there is an accusation that May and co will use any excuse they can to invade civil liberties, don't you think they would be inflating that figure a bit higher than 7? Not that they'd have to do so based on the definition you are attributing to the number. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TrentVilla Posted November 16, 2015 Moderator Share Posted November 16, 2015 Meanwhile we are set to increase our security personnel across our agencies by 1900. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
omariqy Posted November 16, 2015 Share Posted November 16, 2015 Out of interest how many people have been convicted of said incidents say over the last 5 years? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
choffer Posted November 16, 2015 VT Supporter Share Posted November 16, 2015 Just now, omariqy said: Out of interest how many people have been convicted of said incidents say over the last 5 years? Getting convictions is such an antiquated idea. We just disappear these people nowadays. ;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TrentVilla Posted November 16, 2015 Moderator Share Posted November 16, 2015 Just now, omariqy said: Out of interest how many people have been convicted of said incidents say over the last 5 years? A fair question, I don't know the answer but will take a look and see if its out there. I would though imagine that convictions don't follow in all cases as I'd imagine its possible to foil an attack without securing a conviction. I also imagine that we never even hear about some of the cases. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TrentVilla Posted November 16, 2015 Moderator Share Posted November 16, 2015 2 minutes ago, omariqy said: Out of interest how many people have been convicted of said incidents say over the last 5 years? https://www.mi5.gov.uk/home/about-us/what-we-do/the-threats/terrorism/international-terrorism/arrests-and-convictions.html Actually, that was quite easy to find and quite definitive I think. [quot]The cases below represent notable terrorist convictions since the beginning of 2002. Counter terrorism statistics relating to arrests and their outcomes are published by the Home Office. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Awol Posted November 16, 2015 Share Posted November 16, 2015 1 hour ago, TrentVilla said: I think its far too easy to blame geography. Yes there is little to stop people crossing a border but there is also little to stop people crossing the sea in boats, I mean people swim it its that close. I think its far more down to the security services than luck. Just on the point about crossing the channel (smuggling) it's really not easy at all. UK maritime domain awareness is very, very good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LxYoungAVFC Posted November 16, 2015 Share Posted November 16, 2015 (edited) 2 hours ago, Awol said: Uh huh. So a CIA black op', or Mossad? Please elaborate why you exclude these possibilities. Not referrig to quote: The Police in my city (Bern) are patrolling with machine guns today. Does this mean I should be scared? Edited November 16, 2015 by LxYoungAVFC Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YGabbana Posted November 16, 2015 Share Posted November 16, 2015 23 minutes ago, YGabbana said: A person is going to commit mass murder, takes his passport with him. Seems legit Uh huh. So a CIA black op', or Mossad? Nope, but maybe they are guessing who carried out the attacks as 1 of them blew himself up but the passport survived lol. Wernt 2 of them french citizens? Why would they need to carry passports with them anywhere. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gharperr Posted November 16, 2015 Share Posted November 16, 2015 (edited) Pretty good from a news presenter how you do yt vids on this site? Edited November 16, 2015 by limpid fixed embed. use the prompts on the screen to remove formating, or "paste without formating" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YGabbana Posted November 16, 2015 Share Posted November 16, 2015 2 hours ago, Awol said: Uh huh. So a CIA black op', or Mossad? Please elaborate why you exclude these possibilities. Not referrig to quote: The Police in my city (Bern) are patrolling with machine guns today. Does this mean I should be scared? Because he knows everything. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snowychap Posted November 16, 2015 Share Posted November 16, 2015 (edited) 3 minutes ago, YGabbana said: Wernt 2 of them french citizens? Why would they need to carry passports with them anywhere. They'd likely be carrying their national identity cards (if anything), I'd have thought. Edited November 16, 2015 by snowychap Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snowychap Posted November 16, 2015 Share Posted November 16, 2015 12 minutes ago, LxYoungAVFC said: The Police in my city (Bern) are patrolling with machine guns today. Does this mean I should be scared? Anyone wandering about carrying machine guns makes me feel rather uneasy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blandy Posted November 16, 2015 Moderator Share Posted November 16, 2015 17 hours ago, chrisp65 said: just checked back through my diary, yep, wasabi You've been horse-radishalised 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TrentVilla Posted November 16, 2015 Moderator Share Posted November 16, 2015 23 minutes ago, Awol said: Just on the point about crossing the channel (smuggling) it's really not easy at all. UK maritime domain awareness is very, very good. I'm sure it is but surely people and/or goods can and do enter the UK regularly either through ports or other means. Is that not how most imported drugs reach our shores? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VILLAMARV Posted November 16, 2015 Share Posted November 16, 2015 and I always thought it was diplomatic immunity....... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Awol Posted November 16, 2015 Share Posted November 16, 2015 56 minutes ago, YGabbana said: Because he knows everything. Meow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Awol Posted November 16, 2015 Share Posted November 16, 2015 1 hour ago, LxYoungAVFC said: Please elaborate why you exclude these possibilities. Because I'm not mental. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blandy Posted November 16, 2015 Moderator Share Posted November 16, 2015 2 minutes ago, Awol said: Because I'm not mental. You seem very sure about that :) 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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