CannockVillan Posted January 5, 2015 Share Posted January 5, 2015 We've tried the counterattacking style and it worked for a while and still does when teams come and attack us. Unfortunately that stopped working when teams realised that was our sole tactic, most likely cause Lambert didn't have the belief that his squad was good enough so tried to shore things up and play on the counter. Teams wised up and sat back. He seems to have a squad that he has more confidence in defensively (shown by the decent defensive record we have). Still struggling going forward but the ball retention does two things. It puts less pressure on our defenders, the constant deluge isn't there anymore and we know that opposition can't score when we have the ball. The next stage has to be more incisiveness in attack. Increase the speed of thought and movement from our attacking play and we'll create more. Part of the problem for me is Gabby. On his day he is unplayable but so like many of our players their days are few and far between. Gabby is a statue in the majority of his games. He does not move unless it's a ball over the top for him to chase and he then always surprises me every time by not picking up the ball in his mouth and bringing it back! He's one dimensional due to his being solely a speed merchant with no footballing brain. We need more movement in the top three to create the space. It's not all about signing a creative midfielder (although I believe we really need one). It's a team game and its just as much a problem caused by a static strike force as it is by the lack of creativity in midfield. Defenders need to be pulled about by the strikers to create space for others otherwise they end up staying in their rigid defensive formation which, as we are seeing time and time again, is hard to break down. Better movement, quicker play. Who is training our players in terms of their attacking play? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lmarsha_926 Posted January 5, 2015 Share Posted January 5, 2015 Houllier also got £24 million to buy a top player, Lambert wont get that Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
omariqy Posted January 5, 2015 Share Posted January 5, 2015 We could do with a young Frank Lampard. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dodgyknees Posted January 5, 2015 Share Posted January 5, 2015 Houllier also got £24 million to buy a top player, Lambert wont get that No, he has done well to get a better player for 7m. Unfortunately, Lambert only has one plan and that is to get the ball to Benteke... but when we have three narrow central mids, two 'wingers' who come in field and then two full backs further forward, there is no space to play/pass the ball, too many cooks, which is down to tactics. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NIVillan Posted January 5, 2015 Share Posted January 5, 2015 The new passing is good in that we keep the ball and are more solid as a defensive unit. What we don't have is the Cowans type player who can play the defensive splitting pass, like he used to for Platt. The mystical number 10. Or the Merson type who would take a game by scruff of the neck and get the players around him to play. Suarez did this at Liverpool and also helped by banging in the goals. They are struggling now as they dont have that catalyst. Weinman is the one of the players I defiantly want a replacement for. If he is the best finisher at the club then we are doomed. Gabby just hasnt progressed as a player since O'Neil left. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the_sun_never_sets Posted January 5, 2015 Share Posted January 5, 2015 Question: Do you think this new tactic will work well against the top 10 sides or so who may actually set out to attack us... keeping the ball may frustrate them and we can then exploit the space? so far we'v eonly played it against weaker opposition... that said the top teams are there for a reason... I think we need to move the ball quickly from defense to attack and then play short passes between the attacking players rather than short passes through the team... 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mic09 Posted January 5, 2015 Share Posted January 5, 2015 Question: Do you think this new tactic will work well against the top 10 sides or so who may actually set out to attack us... keeping the ball may frustrate them and we can then exploit the space? so far we'v eonly played it against weaker opposition... that said the top teams are there for a reason... I think we need to move the ball quickly from defense to attack and then play short passes between the attacking players rather than short passes through the team... thats my thought exactly. With extra space our new style might prove effective against the big boys The new passing is good in that we keep the ball and are more solid as a defensive unit. What we don't have is the Cowans type player who can play the defensive splitting pass, like he used to for Platt. The mystical number 10. Or the Merson type who would take a game by scruff of the neck and get the players around him to play. Suarez did this at Liverpool and also helped by banging in the goals. They are struggling now as they dont have that catalyst. Weinman is the one of the players I defiantly want a replacement for. If he is the best finisher at the club then we are doomed. Gabby just hasnt progressed as a player since O'Neil left. The only problem is that Benteke doesnt seem to want to make a run... unless Andi plays up top with him? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smetrov Posted January 5, 2015 Share Posted January 5, 2015 Question: Do you think this new tactic will work well against the top 10 sides or so who may actually set out to attack us... keeping the ball may frustrate them and we can then exploit the space? so far we'v eonly played it against weaker opposition... that said the top teams are there for a reason... I think we need to move the ball quickly from defense to attack and then play short passes between the attacking players rather than short passes through the team... Did it work against swansea ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stevo985 Posted January 5, 2015 VT Supporter Share Posted January 5, 2015 Question: Do you think this new tactic will work well against the top 10 sides or so who may actually set out to attack us... keeping the ball may frustrate them and we can then exploit the space? so far we'v eonly played it against weaker opposition... that said the top teams are there for a reason... I think we need to move the ball quickly from defense to attack and then play short passes between the attacking players rather than short passes through the team... thats my thought exactly. With extra space our new style might prove effective against the big boys I'm not so sure myself. Usually if you play better teams at their own game you get beat. I'd be happy to see us play a more counter attacking style again against those teams. However, what the possession will help with is holding onto a lead against teams like that, if we were to go a goal up. We should hopefully be passing the ball around a bit more, allowing us to move up the pitch, rather than hoofing it back to them every time we get the ball. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jacketspuds Posted January 5, 2015 Share Posted January 5, 2015 We could do with a young Frank Lampard. We could do with Frank Lampard Snr right about now. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rob182 Posted January 5, 2015 Share Posted January 5, 2015 I don't understand why Lambert seems reluctant to try something in between the two completely different tactics we've used this season. 'Hoofball' has its benefits, as we have one of the best big strikers around and it's a useful way to occasionally bypass better opposition midfielders or can act as an alternate plan. Playing a patient passing game also has its benefits, as it tires the opposition and, as the saying goes, 'if you control the ball, you control the score'. However, since changing to the new passing game, it seems obvious that Lambert has asked the players to never (or very rarely) result to playing longballs. There have been times when we've been under a massive amount of pressure at the back, and a hoof to Benteke would have been fine. Also, against Palace and Blackpool, if the passing game doesn't work for 70-80 minutes (or less!), a few longballs up to Benteke could have provided a breakthrough (quicker than it happened, in the case of the Blackpool game). I'm still 'with' Lambert. Just. (Mainly because of the financial restraints thrust upon him, and the fact that wanting him out seems pointless when he's just signed a new deal). But I find myself questioning his tactics too often, lately. Something in between the two styles would suit us down to the ground, in my opinion. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobzy Posted January 5, 2015 Share Posted January 5, 2015 Question: Do you think this new tactic will work well against the top 10 sides or so who may actually set out to attack us... keeping the ball may frustrate them and we can then exploit the space? so far we'v eonly played it against weaker opposition... that said the top teams are there for a reason... I think we need to move the ball quickly from defense to attack and then play short passes between the attacking players rather than short passes through the team... Did it work against swansea ? Absolutely yes. We were much the better side against Swansea - undone by a moment of brilliance (mixed with poor goalkeeping imo) and our own, standard, wastefulness. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rob182 Posted January 5, 2015 Share Posted January 5, 2015 Oh dear bobzy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobzy Posted January 5, 2015 Share Posted January 5, 2015 We could do with a young Frank Lampard. We could do with Frank Lampard Snr right about now. I'd take the middle Frank Lampard too. Oh dear bobzy. What now? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rob182 Posted January 5, 2015 Share Posted January 5, 2015 Nothing wrong with your post bobzy, just you saying that the new tactic worked against Swansea I can see where you're coming from. We played well, and probably had the better chances. But I still think the overall measure of whether a tactic works, is whether you win, lose or draw. Of course that doesn't take everything into account, and individual errors take away from the effectiveness of the tactic, but I think there were other tactics we could have used that could have resulted in us winning, as it was only Swansea and we have largely the same players that we've had for years (when we have beaten them previously, IIRC). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobzy Posted January 5, 2015 Share Posted January 5, 2015 Ok, yes, I guess it didn't work because we lost I think it's probably been the best performance since Leicester - certainly the best of the last 4 games and, ironically, the only game we've lost in those games. We should've scored through either Weimann or Benteke (if not both). Alas... 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kingman Posted January 5, 2015 Share Posted January 5, 2015 Houllier also got £24 million to buy a top player, Lambert wont get that I wouldn't trust Lambert with the remote to the telly! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sexbelowsound Posted January 5, 2015 Share Posted January 5, 2015 Houllier also got £24 million to buy a top player, Lambert wont get that I wouldn't trust Lambert with the remote to the telly! I'm sure if you gave him the chance he would pick a cracking movie for you too watch. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
omariqy Posted January 5, 2015 Share Posted January 5, 2015 What do you expect when he has been given a 3 in 1 remote from Argos rather than a LG Magic Remote like the rest of the top 10? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lmarsha_926 Posted January 5, 2015 Share Posted January 5, 2015 Last 8 games: 95 Shots, 31 on target, 32% on target, 5 goals, 16% conversion rate, 54% average possession, 82% pass success.We might need to work on our finishing Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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