Ratings and Reactions: Villa 0-4 Tottenham

[Delphinho123]

Whilst this may well have been our B team, it was also full of Paul Lambert's summer signings.

 

It is concerning to say the least that none of the players we bought in the summer look as if they are going to improve us. 

 

As many posters have said, we are a Benteke/Agbonlahor/Delph injury away from being f****d this season, and one of them is already crocked.

 

Worrying times. But then, if you only spend 10-15m on 6 players or so, you can't expect too much.

 

Angry.

[momo]

 

Remember. Spurs got to where they are now by buying cheap young players from the lower leagues and abroad. Some made it, like Bale and Walker, others were sold for a profit and replaced with better players from abroad. Villa needed a reset, and are doing now what spurs tried to do a few years earlier. UTV!!!

 Funny that the players you mention were signed for a combined 11.5, Bale 7m, and Walker 4.5. Only Kozak's fee was more than Walkers this summer, and under Lamber only 2 players have been signed for more than 4m.  We are actually spending a lot less then Spurs spent to get where they are now.  They were buying in the 4 - 10 million bracket, but still spent 16m on Bent and  12m on Berbertov.

 

Kozak and Okure were about 4m to 7m...so that is comparable. Remember that English players have inflated prices, so I would put them in the same bracket. Also, Benteke cost a bit, and I expect 90% of the players Lambert has bought, to be sold with profit. Even the academy players that don't make the first team are sold with a profit combined. This is very much Spurs-like. Or Dortmund....

Edited September 25, 2013 by momo

[The_Lions_Roar]

We were finishing 6th while Spurs were midtable just a few years ago.

Now their reserves cost more than our first team. What the **** happened.

They bought bale

Where were the spurs fan sat last night?

[lp_villa830]

Most disappointing aspect of our play last night was that their seemed to be little effort put in to actually disrupt Spurs play. We just sat off them and allowed them to take control. I don't think we won a 50/50 all night.

Albrighton the only player to come away with any credit for me.

[Shillzz]

Seeing as I made the effort to go up and watch the game yesterday, I should probably give some ratings:

 

Lambert: The team made a lot of sense, everyone playing in position, and everyone who needed game time getting it. He rewarded Bacuna's last performance with a start in his favoured position and gave Baker some much needed game time.

 

Steer: 6 - Would have been an 8 but for their third goal. For a young goalkeeper fresh out of Norwich's youth side, he did well for most of the evening. You can see he's not particularly confident (or able) with his feet, but he does make a good shot stopper.

 

Lowton: 4 - As much as it pains me to say it, this was another under par performance from Lowton. It wasn't as disastrous as the Newcastle game, but he offered little going forward and was guilty of giving Tottenham too much respect in his own third.

 

Vlaar: 5 - Was a fairly typical Vlaar performance, some good interceptions and calm on the ball. But ultimately we conceded 4, and while 3 of the goals were down the other end, and hence difficult to see, he shouldn't have allowed the shortest man on the pitch to nod home a floated ball for the first.

 

Baker: 6 - A couple of last ditch tackles gives his performance the edge of Vlaar's. He's unlucky not to be playing at the moment, but his time will come.

 

Bennet: 7 - Put in a gritty performance against the £30m man from Lazio. Added some much needed physicality to his play and used the ball well going forward. It's going to take some time to shake off the escape goat tag, but this will go some way to doing so. If he carries on in this vein then he'll soon be pushing Luna for a starting spot.

 

KEA: 6 -  For some reason Karim seems to be getting a fair few adverse ratings on here, but I don't agree. He was incredibly tenacious in the first half, chasing down every ball like it was the European cup final. He wasn't exquisite in possession, but no one was. A lot of people seem to be recognising that we weren't pressuring Spurs so much in the second half, and I think this was largely due to Karim's absence.

 

Bacuna: 6 - A useful performance, and certainly better than his last appearance in midfield. He wasn't great, but this was another performance that shows he has a bright future with the club. I like him.

 

Sylla: 6 - Deployed as the deepest member of a 3 man midfield in the first half, and was pretty quiet, largely owing to Tottenham's 442 formation I suspect. He came alive in the second half as he gained confidence. For much of the second half he was our best player, putting in the kind of performance that endeared him to fans at the tail end of last season. Got a little too cocky for their 4th, but he was the only person capable of making anything happen.

 

Tonev: 5 - I fear poor Tonev may have been reading VillaTalk before he stepped out onto the harrowed turf last night. His confidence looked absolutely shot and he was the quieter of our 2 wingers for much of the evening. He came alive for a 5 minute spell in the second half when he had a rasping shot saved by Friedel and managed to beat a couple of Spurs defenders down the line. He definitely does have some ability, but it needs to be nurtured by Lambert.

 

Albrighton: 6 - A good perfomance from Albrighton that should see him promoted to first reserve for either of the wide forward positions. Showed a willingness to take people on and get crosses into the box. Had Benteke been playing then I suspect Albrighton may have notched himself an assist or two.

 

Kozak: 5 - Not a poor performance, but he didn't do a great deal either. Won some good flick ons, but was left far too isolated by the width of Albrighton and Tonev. This signing all of a sudden makes a great deal more sense. Libor looks far more capable of leading the line than Helenius, and with Benteke now out for 4-6 weeks, he's going to be needed, hence his half time substitution.

 

Subs

 

Bowery: 3 - I've tried not to be harsh with the ratings, but Jordan offered very little. Helenius did all the running upfront with little or no support from his strike partner. He doesn't look capable at this level, unfortunately. 

 

Helenius: 5 - I didn't think Helenius was particularly good last night if I'm being brutally honest. He has some good close ball control, but he doesn't have the physical presence to play upfront without Kozak or Benteke. I can see why Lambert tried him with Bowery, but unfortunately for Helenius, Bowery didn't do him any favours. He looks a little short on confidence at the minute, but that wasn't the easiest of games for him to come into.

 

Robinson: 5 - Showed some good glimpses during his time on the field, and would probably have had an Albrightonesque performance if he's have been played from the start.

[andymac12345]

Holy overreaction Batman!

 

Did you really think we were going to go the whole season without at least one thrashing?

 

These things happen and let's face it we were never gonna win that cup anyway. We will bounce back, I'm sure of it.

 

We've shown enough in our opening five games to prove we won't be whipping boys again this season.

 

Keep the faith.

UTV

Edited September 25, 2013 by andymac12345

[coda]

It was bad but it was no Doncaster Rovers.

[andymac12345]

Also people slating Lambert's signings already? 

 

Wasn't everyone raving about Bacuna last week? Didn't Kozak come on and make an immediate impact? Hasn't Okore been really steady before his injury? 

 

Even El Ahmadi who was poor at times last season seems to have come good.

 

Christ, some of the things people come out with at times is embarrassing. 

 

STOP BEING SO NEGATIVE!

[The_Lions_Roar]

No gabby, weimann, guzan or benteke, I could understand people being negative if we lost with those players.

[Electric Avenue]

Decided not to post last night when I got home from game as I needed to get my emotions in check.

This morning I am sat at work very angry. I thought we'd got over half arsed performances and players not giving a shit.

That was one big rip off last night, cost me over £80 all told for that wanky bollocks performance.

[Villastine]

Get a grip people.

 

Spurs have one of the strongest squads in the Premier League. Of their "reserve" starting 11 last night 9 of them would walk into our first team and most of them would improve it drastically.

 

Our aim for this season is surely to avoid a relegation battle. This was a chance to give our squad players some action and hopefully they will gain something from the game time.

 

It was vital Lambert took this chance to test them against Premier League opposition.

 

We will revert back to our staring 11 against Citeh and set up to counter attack as they come in search of 3 pts. Hopefully we can get something out of the game.

 

As for ratings etc., I think Bennet, Baker and Albrighton looked OK.

[Shillzz]

By the way - I agree with the positive outlook, but we're still allowed to discuss the match, that's why this topic exists.

 

You can't discuss last night's match sensibly without recognising that we weren't very good.

[blandy]

The positives, the thing that made me angry, what happened and the negatives - in that order.

 

Most of the positives were on the pitch - I thought Bennett had a really good game, Bacuna looked like a player with a future, KEA worked his socks off in the first half and the team gave it their all - quality wise, this was Championship against Premier league, but you can't knock some of ours for effort. Steer made a couple of good saves, Sylla, Vlaar,Baker and Lowton were solid enough and for the most part they gave it their all.

 

Just after half time, the decision not to award a penalty absolutely incensed me - there are two question that need an answer for a penalty to be awarded - was it in the box and was it a foul? Well, it was in the box, no doubt about that. For me, pulling shorts is a foul, same as pulling shirts - so the simple question was did he pull Helenius's shorts? If the answer to that is yes, then it's a penalty. Helenius's shorts ended up around his knees. Absolute balls up by a referee who was too amused by a player with his shorts pulled down to remember he was a referee. Don't get me wrong, Spurs would have gone on to win, but it would have made for a much more interesting evening - particularly as there's a pretty strong case for a red card.

 

What happened on the night in the end was that we ran out of steam - we worked like trojans in the first half and were a little unlucky to go in behind to the late goal - by the end we were knackered and a bigger, stronger, quicker, fitter Spurs squad looked like they could play all night. They were the better side throughout, but we kept ourselves in it and just needed the luck we didn't get to make a better fist of it.

 

For me, the worst thing about the evening was 22,750 - The 4,000 Spurs fans in their end sang "Your support is **** shite" and "Your ground's too big for you" and they were right on both counts - I'm sick of the excuses, there are two million people within range of our ground - the support we pull in is shit. I went on my own - I'm half responsible , this club needs us dragging people along with them, take a mate, someone you work with, your missus, your nan or your dog, we need to start getting people into the habit of backing their team - I bet the Royal was packed. I was embarrassed. This isn't a better fan claim, if you couldn't make it fair enough, there ought to be someone who can, the Geordies, the Mackems and the Scousers can pack em in, if this game had been at White Hart Lane it would've been full - where are our fans?

 

The Chairman needs to invest, a club within its means doesn't have the support to live in our division - but we've got to have something to offer a buyer and a ground with 17,000 Villa fans in it (there were Spurs fans everywhere) isn't going to encourage anyone.

 

We're got a good manager, and a smattering of good players, there's still a chance we can get this right, but I'm wondering if enough people care.

 

I'm annoyed. I may change my mind on some of this. It's not 4-0 that does it. It's not shit referees. It's not being mocked in an empty ground by the rest of the league, it's that they're right.

 

And I really really hate Jermaine Defoe.

Good post. On the attendance, I think you're wrong, in part. I think when a club doesn't win home games regularly, and it goes on for years, people stop paying to go. It doesn't matter where the club is, geographically. London or the North East. I think when prices are completely out of kilter with the "offering" people just won't go.

I think season ticket holders won't shell out extra.

I think, when paul Lambert said on Saturday that the league was the priority, it was confirmation, if needed, that with the injuries etc. we'd play a weak side.

If the fans of a club who are 2nd in the league, with a currently very good side and squad want to sing songs about a club or its fans, that have been scuffling around the bottom of the league for a few years, who cares. We'd do the same to them if the roles were reversed. 

[PaulC]

4-0 is a harsh scoreline.  Both teams put out second string line-ups. Only Vlaar and KEA could be considered starters from that line-up. With Spurs strenght in depth it's not surprising their second string hammered ours, but really this should never have been a hammering and the last two goals only came because we were chasing a game we should have been chasing!

 

Steer - 5 - Solid until the third goal which he should have stopped confortably.

Lowton - 3 - Poor again, Bacuna looks the better option.

Vlaar - 5 - got pulled out of position a number of times by great movement from Defoe and slick pass and move footie from spurs. Didn't make any major errors though!

Baker 6 - Best defender for us tonight, looking like a solid premier league CB.

Bennett - 6 - Second best defender for us tonight, all spur most dangerous move came from our right, our left was very stingy today.  Probably should start ahead of Luna.

El-Ahmadi - 4 - Poor today, rightly subbed at half time. 

Sylla - 5 - tried his best, tried to make things happen but was at fault for the fourth tottenham goal.

Bacuna -5 - Worked hard but his interplay is not upto scratch, to often passed to no one!

Albrighton - 6.5 - MOM, best Villa player by far, worked hard, always looked like he could make something happen, unfortunately couldn't find that telling ball, a few matches would help him.

Tonev - 6 - Had a hard time against Kyle Walker, looked lively though, but like the rest of our forwards often found himself isolated.

Kozak - 5 - Did nothing, but had nothing to feed off!

Bowery - 4 - Lacks quality, but works hard!

Helenius - 5.5 - Should've won a penalty, looks a trick player and needed some support.

 

I think Lowton needs to go back to the bench, and KEA is too negative. Would be happy to see Sylla and Bennett come into the team, Bacuna at right back and Delph back in the midfield.  Albrighton looks a viable alternative to Weimann and Tonev needs time.  Man City will be tough, but its the kind game we could thrive in. If KEA is in the team he should be played as a holding midfielder where he negativity is a requirement!

 

Great post!!!

[pacbuddies]

 

 

lot of over reactions here, it was spurs reserves but just look at their squad, we were not at full strength either by a long shot.

yes they had more quality over the pitch but they have just spent a metric fuckton of money.

And against all but one team this season prior to us they scraped a win by a single goal.

Our Jan2013 form is coming early this season, City are going to wallop us. I just don't understand how anyone can find anything positive about this squad other than Benteke? We could go down this season, I am already thinking who is worse than us already.

 

That was a Villa second/third team out there.  Have some perspective.  There is zero chance Villa will go down.

 

A Villa second/third team out there!

 

So does that mean that Lambert has been spunking our money on players for the reserves when we really needed players for the first team because he bought Hellenius, Kozak, Tonev, Baccuna, Sylla, Bowery, Bennett, Vlaar, Lowton, Steer and Al Ahmadi all of who featured in this game and most of them have played before and will undoubtedly play again this season?

[the_sun_never_sets]

On the plus sude maybe city will now underestimate us and play their third team and we'll hold on for a 1-1

[andymac12345]

By the way - I agree with the positive outlook, but we're still allowed to discuss the match, that's why this topic exists.

 

You can't discuss last night's match sensibly without recognising that we weren't very good.

 

Good point, I saw half 2/3 of the game on a stream and we looked clueless throughout. However I've seen people jump to illogical conclusions such as 'we are awful' 'the new signings are awful', 'we haven't improved'. Yet go back a few weeks when we gave Arsenal a seeing to on their own turf people were in nothing but awe of the squad.

 

Just a bit of balance is needed. Lambert has already proven to me that he knows exactly what he's doing and his unrelenting belief in his ability squad gives me confidence. Last season for example, he'd knew we'd pull ourselves together and we did...in some style. I have no doubt he got up this morning and knows exactly what he needs to do to get us back on track. 

[andymac12345]

I just want to see some fight. We always allow teams like Tottenham to walk all over us.

I wish people would stop thinking just because it's Tottenham, that it's a reason to let a result like tonight slide.

 

Teams like Tottenham? So Arsenal could be included in that list?

 

But wait we beat them....Spurs are way ahead of where we want to be right now and let's face it both sides fielded their reserves so the real result was AVFC Reserves 0-4 Spurs Reserves 

[Nigel]

He was fouled in the box whether he played on or not. He shot high and wide because HIS SHORTS WERE DOWN AROUND HIS KNEES.

Agreed, and people wonder why diving is so prevalent!

[bodlod]

Not sure if this has been mentioned but the ref last night was Jon Moss, who also handed us that double penalty screwing at Man City last season. He's now on my Phil Dowd/Kevin Friend list of refs to 'keep an eye on'.

 

It would help if he came out and explained how one of the clearest fouls in the history of football wasn't given, but that will never happen.