The Randy Lerner thread

[DCJonah]

On 26 March 2016 at 00:31, DCJonah said:

I've no idea how old you are but we have a generation of fans who think football started in 92 Who believe we have a right to be in the top division. They take it for granted and when we do hit hard times as every club does its hyperbole of the clubs destroyed! And actually your post just proves that. 

I don't think the clubs destroyed. I think it could be the most enjoyable season in years next year in the championship.

But any success we might get certainly won't be sweeter because we've been relegated. 

It's an absolute disgrace that we're going down as one of the worst teams in the history of the league. 

[DCJonah]

I think as fans we do have a right to expect to be in the top league. We have a history of top-flight football and throughout the premier league years we've made more money than that majority of others. Nothing to do with my age or when I believe football began. 

I still maintain being relegated because of lerner will not make any success sweeter. It just makes me want rid of this cretin sooner. Any success we gave after lerner will be sweeter without his presence tainting it. 

[Woodytom]

I'm a firm believer in 'without the sour, you can't appreciate the sweet'. 

That's not to say I want sour. It just means that if/when we ever win the prem, we will appreciate more than say man utd fans.

[mykeyb]

Why would Lerner sell for less money in the summer?

[jon_c]

7 hours ago, DCJonah said:

I think as fans we do have a right to expect to be in the top league. We have a history of top-flight football and throughout the premier league years we've made more money than that majority of others. Nothing to do with my age or when I believe football began. 

I don't believe fans of ANY club have the right to expect top flight football.

[DCJonah]

14 minutes ago, jon_c said:

I don't believe fans of ANY club have the right to expect top flight football.

Why?

Staying in the premier league for a club like ourselves should be an easy task. It's not a challenge and should never have been one. Because of that I think we have every right to have expected it.  

[krisagg75]

i remember leaving highbury in 81 with my brother and talking about how 10 years ago we were in the third div and now we were champions.having gone through the tommy doc/vic crowe days it did make the good times feel better.

[Heretic]

7 hours ago, Woodytom said:

I'm a firm believer in 'without the sour, you can't appreciate the sweet'. 

 

'You have to take the bitter with the sour' is Krulak's replacement for 'Proud history, bright future.'

[Woodytom]

2 hours ago, DCJonah said:

Why?

Staying in the premier league for a club like ourselves should be an easy task. It's not a challenge and should never have been one. Because of that I think we have every right to have expected it.  

Expecting something surely takes the fun out of the sport?

How bored are we all with the same teams at the top year in year out?

That's why this season's much more exciting. We're not appreciating how exciting it is because villa are Sooooooooooooooooooo **** shit!! 

We're entering April and there's a genuine chance that leicester spurs and west ham could be in the champions league. I think it's great for the game, and why we should encourage, not necessarily the unexpected so to say, but healthy competition from all teams.

[dukes]

7 hours ago, mykeyb said:

Why would Lerner sell for less money in the summer?

Depends how much free cash he has, if he doesn't fancy propping up the club for a few more years then it's better for him to cut his losses and accept a lower fee now.

if we don't come straight back up then the value of the club will drop in any case as turnover will be much reduced, so it's all about how much of a risk he might want to take. 

The money in Villa is from the Lerner Family fund though I think, so maybe he won't want to risk any more than the £250M that has already been spent.

[HanoiVillan]

7 hours ago, DCJonah said:

Why?

Staying in the premier league for a club like ourselves should be an easy task. It's not a challenge and should never have been one. Because of that I think we have every right to have expected it.  

But it isn't really, is it? There are 7 or 8 clubs with much higher incomes than ourselves, who finish ahead of us basically every year. That leaves around a dozen finishing positions in the rest of the league, of which 25% lead to relegation. That's actually a fairly difficult challenge, especially when 'every year, forever' is the timescale required to achieve it in. 

[Jareth]

4 hours ago, dukes said:

Depends how much free cash he has, if he doesn't fancy propping up the club for a few more years then it's better for him to cut his losses and accept a lower fee now.

if we don't come straight back up then the value of the club will drop in any case as turnover will be much reduced, so it's all about how much of a risk he might want to take. 

The money in Villa is from the Lerner Family fund though I think, so maybe he won't want to risk any more than the £250M that has already been spent.

I agree, Lerner has known nothing but losses over 10 years - even if he was a wild optimist I imagine he looks at Villa and simply wants to cut his losses rather than try to make any money - he doesn't know how to do that.

[PussEKatt]

Lerner is an idiot.Imagine spending that much money on any investment and not bothering to check how it is doing.

[Villarocker]

11 hours ago, PussEKatt said:

Lerner is an idiot.Imagine spending that much money on any investment and not bothering to check how it is doing.

Shiiiiiit, now I know why my missus always moans at me for not showing her enough concern! 

[DCJonah]

On 28/03/2016 at 04:22, HanoiVillan said:

But it isn't really, is it? There are 7 or 8 clubs with much higher incomes than ourselves, who finish ahead of us basically every year. That leaves around a dozen finishing positions in the rest of the league, of which 25% lead to relegation. That's actually a fairly difficult challenge, especially when 'every year, forever' is the timescale required to achieve it in. 

And before Lerner we were making more money than and usually finishing much higher than most. 

It's become a challenge because of the way Lerner has run the club. It should never have happened. 

[DCJonah]

On 26/03/2016 at 23:17, Woodytom said:

Expecting something surely takes the fun out of the sport?

How bored are we all with the same teams at the top year in year out?

That's why this season's much more exciting. We're not appreciating how exciting it is because villa are Sooooooooooooooooooo **** shit!! 

We're entering April and there's a genuine chance that leicester spurs and west ham could be in the champions league. I think it's great for the game, and why we should encourage, not necessarily the unexpected so to say, but healthy competition from all teams.

I think there's levels of expectations and your examples this season are right. 

I don't think expecting us to stay up each year ruins the excitement. There's lots that can happen to teams that survive. 

 

[Danwichmann]

2 minutes ago, DCJonah said:

And before Lerner we were making more money than and usually finishing much higher than most. 

It's become a challenge because of the way Lerner has run the club. It should never have happened. 

We were heading for relegation under Ellis, do you remember O'Leary's last season?! We were dreadful then as well. That 0 3 defeat at Doncaster is still as bad as I've seen. 

Lerner may be totally useless, but let's not kid ourselves that everything was smelling of roses before he turned up. 

[DCJonah]

2 hours ago, Danwichmann said:

We were heading for relegation under Ellis, do you remember O'Leary's last season?! We were dreadful then as well. That 0 3 defeat at Doncaster is still as bad as I've seen. 

Lerner may be totally useless, but let's not kid ourselves that everything was smelling of roses before he turned up. 

One season doesn't fully show the picture. Yes Doug had to go and we were on the brink of relegation. But before Lerner we made more money than most teams and usually finished higher than most teams. 

In the premiership era it should not be difficult to keep a club like ours in the league. When clubs like ourselves are relegated it's considered a massive **** up by people in charge and players for that very reason. 

Edited March 29, 2016 by DCJonah

[Danwichmann]

The last 4 years of Ellis we finished 16th, 6th, 10th and 16th. One decent season, one mediocre one. It is not a case of one season showing the full picture. We had been sliding for a long time. The infamous players letter critising Ellis? I can't remember the accounts at the time, maybe we were making money, but we weren't spending it! Eirik Bakke?! Lerner coming in halted the slide and gave us a bounce for quite a few years. What has happened since is a continuation of the downward path we were already treading. None of that makes Lerner blameless, he clearly is not, but we were shit before, it's not something unique to the Lerner era.

It should be possible to keep a big club like Villa in the Premier League, but it's hardly unique is it? Newcastle, Sunderland, West Ham, Leeds, Man City are all big clubs who have been relegated, the last two to League 1. Yes, it we have **** up in going down, but Lerner isn't the only owner to do it.

None of this is a defense of Lerner, he's got to go and the sooner the better. But we should keep a bit of perspective.

[DCJonah]

Where's the lack of perspective. I haven't said we're the only club. If course other clubs have **** up and failed resulting in relegation. What's that got to do with us?

The fact Newcastle made mistakes that resulted in relegation doesn't change the fact that teams like us and them should be able to survive each year. 

As you point out, even at the end of Doug's reign when we were a shambles we still survived. Doesn't that show how difficult it actually is to relegate a club like ourselves?