Manager Paul Lambert

[MagicMushroom]

 

 

Or could it have been that Man U simply played the rest of the game in 1st gear, a period in which we still failed to score?

 

 

Not true.

 

Fergie was having a right tantrum with his team during the second half, and its why he subbed Rooney.

 

When you go in 3-0 up at half time, you are actually thinking game over and job done, so its difficult sometimes, to keep that momentum for the second half. Some of thier key players (Rooney) had switched off mentally.

 

Getting tighter to Rooney and filling the midfield just compounded that, since they were finding less space.

 

To assume they were told to take it easy, is plain wrong. Besides, most of us had written this game off beforehand, so its not as if it were unexpected. Sunderland is the game to judge.

 

 

You say not true, I say absolutely true. They had already won, they didn't fear us and just took the foot off the pedal. If it was Arsenal or City they would have continued, but they don't have the urge to destroy us the same way and most were probably thinking about which club they were going to the same evening.

 

Besides, even at half pace they created a sitter for Kagawa and a pretty good chance for Rooney (twice) from outside the box after some nice play by Van Persie. Not that it matter from last night, but it matters in the long run as we actually have a shot at finishing better than Wigan in terms of GD.

 

 

 

 

I have no problems with all that or in bits morph said, other than the notion they had been "told" to go easy at half time. Fergie was absolutely going ape with some of his players for sloppy balls and not picking up the momentum.

 

Bringing on KEA just compounded it, be leaving less space.

 

TBH, i dont think the result would of been any different if we had started the game with an extra midfielder!

[VillaForever1970]

Personally think he is doing okay with what is the equivalent of a promoted team all season.

Lambert brought those players though..

Personally think he is doing okay with what is the equivalent of a promoted team all season.

Lambert brought those players though..

So he could have bought the equivalent amount that were better quality?

Could have bought less of more quality and had an even smaller squad i suppose.

Personally think he is doing okay with what is the equivalent of a promoted team all season.

Lambert brought those players though..

Personally think he is doing okay with what is the equivalent of a promoted team all season.

Lambert brought those players though..

So he could have bought the equivalent amount that were better quality?

Could have bought less of more quality and had an even smaller squad i suppose.

[itdoesntmatterwhatthissay]

It is so frustrating isn't it.

 

I personally blame Lambert for being so slow to react to the changes needed in the team; yesterday was a write off but we don't do ourselves any favours playing the likes of Bennett.

 

Is  every other possible player injured? Lichaj still out?

 

3 at the back, Bannan playing so often and with no protection, Bennett...worst player in the league playing in a very important position, Weimann spending his game time on the wing supporting not leading the line, Carruthers dropped and not approached after disciplined, Johnson/others not being in an among the squad a little more, N'Zog not allowed to do what he is good at until very late in the season, not replacing Petrov/Warnock properly (loans?!!!), losing KMAC and the very slow introduction of Baker...it's been a year where Lambert flexed his muscles and showed he was boss; and it might cost us hugely.

 

The good is numerous too; we play good football, players are technically improved, some great signings, getting Delph to look like a good Championship player sometimes Prem, young players continue to look driven and he has had a positive affect on the fans.

 

I hope we stay up and he stays, he has potential, but I feel he spent too much time thinking his way was best instead of securing our future and developing his own style.

 

Even Fergie admits to getting it wrong and evolving with his team/the game; Lambert might have taken too long to realise this valuable trait in management and if we go down he has to bear that failure as his decisions have cost us very valuable points.

[Dante_Lockhart]

Some people really do wear tinted specs don't they?

 

We don't have some divine right to have a team full of superstars. We had a moment of buying players, paying the wages, and getting a bit of glory back at the club following consecutive top 6 finishes, but then due to going about it the wrong way we suffered. We were losing money as a club, players were getting paid ridiculous wages for sitting on the bench, we couldn't sell some of them on etc...

 

Lambert came in to a club needing an overhaul, I know this, you know this. Expecting him to sign big names on big contracts was naive. He had to get the wage bill down, AND replace some players going out.

 

This year was a transition year. The aim was to avoid relegation. Granted, we're teetering there at the moment but if we do survive the drop then he has done his job, our finances would have hopefully been stabilised and we can push on next season.

 

Lambert cannot be held accountable for the mistakes this club and board have made over the last 5 seasons.

[itdoesntmatterwhatthissay]

Some people really do wear tinted specs don't they?

 

We don't have some divine right to have a team full of superstars. We had a moment of buying players, paying the wages, and getting a bit of glory back at the club following consecutive top 6 finishes, but then due to going about it the wrong way we suffered. We were losing money as a club, players were getting paid ridiculous wages for sitting on the bench, we couldn't sell some of them on etc...

 

Lambert came in to a club needing an overhaul, I know this, you know this. Expecting him to sign big names on big contracts was naive. He had to get the wage bill down, AND replace some players going out.

 

This year was a transition year. The aim was to avoid relegation. Granted, we're teetering there at the moment but if we do survive the drop then he has done his job, our finances would have hopefully been stabilised and we can push on next season.

 

Lambert cannot be held accountable for the mistakes this club and board have made over the last 5 seasons.

 

But he can be held to account for his tactics, player choice and man management.

 

Whatever happens within your club you need to adapt to the job you take; he didn't get that memo until he went 4 at the back but by that time many easy games had gone.

 

Management is a balance; the board have shown huge inexperience but the manager has shown slow evolution. 

[Big_John_10]

Lambert cannot be held accountable for the mistakes this club and board have made over the last 5 seasons.

Lambert has added to these mistakes with some awful purchases, poor formation choices and putting together the worst defence I've ever seen at the club.

He's not blameless in this mess at all.

[Morpheus]

 

 

 

Or could it have been that Man U simply played the rest of the game in 1st gear, a period in which we still failed to score?

 

 

Not true.

 

Fergie was having a right tantrum with his team during the second half, and its why he subbed Rooney.

 

When you go in 3-0 up at half time, you are actually thinking game over and job done, so its difficult sometimes, to keep that momentum for the second half. Some of thier key players (Rooney) had switched off mentally.

 

Getting tighter to Rooney and filling the midfield just compounded that, since they were finding less space.

 

To assume they were told to take it easy, is plain wrong. Besides, most of us had written this game off beforehand, so its not as if it were unexpected. Sunderland is the game to judge.

 

 

You say not true, I say absolutely true. They had already won, they didn't fear us and just took the foot off the pedal. If it was Arsenal or City they would have continued, but they don't have the urge to destroy us the same way and most were probably thinking about which club they were going to the same evening.

 

Besides, even at half pace they created a sitter for Kagawa and a pretty good chance for Rooney (twice) from outside the box after some nice play by Van Persie. Not that it matter from last night, but it matters in the long run as we actually have a shot at finishing better than Wigan in terms of GD.

 

 

 

 

I have no problems with all that or in bits morph said, other than the notion they had been "told" to go easy at half time. Fergie was absolutely going ape with some of his players for sloppy balls and not picking up the momentum.

 

Bringing on KEA just compounded it, be leaving less space.

 

TBH, i dont think the result would of been any different if we had started the game with an extra midfielder!

 

Mate never said that the Man U players 'had been told to go easy at half time.'

 

Its just that its natural thing for teams who are three up to take their foot of the gas a little as they feel they have already won the game and that was my original point.

[Big_John_10]

Lambert brought those players though..

So he could have bought the equivalent amount that were better quality?

Could have bought less of more quality and had an even smaller squad i suppose.

So there's no better lb in world football for the money we spent on bennet?

No better midfield player than Kea for the money we spent on him?

Was he forced to sell James Collins.

When it looks like its going well its considered a project and lambert is a great manager with a long term plan.

When its going bad the same old excuses are put out there.

Lambert's in a great position with some on here. Keep us up he's amazing, relegate us not his fault.

[TRO]

There are clearly area's of improvement....

 

....but its clear the defensive side of our game has not in improved in general, we are still shipping goals for fun.

 

when its a team game its hard to single players out, But Bennet is a source of problem.

 

He's not the only one but some of his errors, beggar belief.

 

I have seen Mourinho and Ferguson haul players off there and then for some errors that they are clearly uncomfortable with.

 

Managers have to make it clear what they will or won't expect, leaving players on is tantamount to acceptance.

 

you sometimes have the be cruel to be kind.... "Nice Bunch of lads" and " we will go again" lines is taking this club down.

Edited April 23, 2013 by TRO

[Pelle]

 

 

 

 

Or could it have been that Man U simply played the rest of the game in 1st gear, a period in which we still failed to score?

 

 

Not true.

 

Fergie was having a right tantrum with his team during the second half, and its why he subbed Rooney.

 

When you go in 3-0 up at half time, you are actually thinking game over and job done, so its difficult sometimes, to keep that momentum for the second half. Some of thier key players (Rooney) had switched off mentally.

 

Getting tighter to Rooney and filling the midfield just compounded that, since they were finding less space.

 

To assume they were told to take it easy, is plain wrong. Besides, most of us had written this game off beforehand, so its not as if it were unexpected. Sunderland is the game to judge.

 

 

You say not true, I say absolutely true. They had already won, they didn't fear us and just took the foot off the pedal. If it was Arsenal or City they would have continued, but they don't have the urge to destroy us the same way and most were probably thinking about which club they were going to the same evening.

 

Besides, even at half pace they created a sitter for Kagawa and a pretty good chance for Rooney (twice) from outside the box after some nice play by Van Persie. Not that it matter from last night, but it matters in the long run as we actually have a shot at finishing better than Wigan in terms of GD.

 

 

 

 

I have no problems with all that or in bits morph said, other than the notion they had been "told" to go easy at half time. Fergie was absolutely going ape with some of his players for sloppy balls and not picking up the momentum.

 

Bringing on KEA just compounded it, be leaving less space.

 

TBH, i dont think the result would of been any different if we had started the game with an extra midfielder!

 

Mate never said that the Man U players 'had been told to go easy at half time.'

 

Its just that its natural thing for teams who are three up to take their foot of the gas a little as they feel they have already won the game and that was my original point.

 

 

It's also kind of natural that the best team in the league by a mile looking to seal the title at the home ground will beat the team fighting for survival. Even by 3 goals. It's not like we're used to beat them or even get a point at ot in the past. 2 wins in 30 years. Not many more draws.

 

Doesn't mean we have a great team and that Lambert is a god of any kind, just that complaining about yesterday's result and blaming Lambert and the players is kind of ridiculous. Not more than complaining about them being worse than one of the best teams in the world.

[TRO]

There are clearly area's of improvement....

 

....but its clear the defensive side of our game has not in improved in general, we are still shipping goals for fun.

 

when its a team game its hard to single players out, But Bennet is a source of problem.

 

He's not the only one but some of his errors, beggar belief.

 

I have seen Mourinho and Ferguson haul players off there and then for some errors that they are clearly uncomfortable with.

 

Managers have to make it clear what they will or won't expect, leaving players on is tantamount to acceptance.

 

you sometimes have the be cruel to be kind.... "Nice Bunch of lads" and " we will go again" lines is taking this club down.

 

ps The speed in which we conceded the first goal is where naivety runs riot.

[Eames]

 

Lambert brought those players though..

So he could have bought the equivalent amount that were better quality?

Could have bought less of more quality and had an even smaller squad i suppose.

So there's no better lb in world football for the money we spent on bennet?

No better midfield player than Kea for the money we spent on him?

Was he forced to sell James Collins.

When it looks like its going well its considered a project and lambert is a great manager with a long term plan.

When its going bad the same old excuses are put out there.

Lambert's in a great position with some on here. Keep us up he's amazing, relegate us not his fault.

 

 1) Possibly - but may be not. We don't know if Bennett was 1st choice or 15th choice do we.

2) See above.

3) No probably not forced but it was absolutely the right decision and Vlaar IMO is better.

4) Yes - it is a project, he is a good manager and there will be a long term plan (we don't know what it is because we are not privvy to it, but its there)

5) Excuses? No, haven't seen many of those, just attempts to explain to the doom mongers or the overly negative that things are more promising than last season despite the similar position.

6) If he keeps us up he's not "amazing" and I haven't seen anyone say that. He would be doing his job. If he relegates us it wont solely be his fault but he will be culpable.

 

BJ and Morph - let me introduce you to nuance which is a concept that you both appear to be incapable of dealing with. Nothing is black and white, shades of grey and all that.

[Zatman]

 

Lambert cannot be held accountable for the mistakes this club and board have made over the last 5 seasons.

Lambert has added to these mistakes with some awful purchases, poor formation choices and putting together the worst defence I've ever seen at the club.

He's not blameless in this mess at all.

 

 

cant agree with awful purchases part. He had a small budget to rebuild the squad and has got valus on nearly all hsi signings. Who could he have got better than KEA, Vlaar and Bowery for the money they were bought for?

[PaulC]

What awful purchases has Lambert made?  Benteke, Lowton and Westwood have all been successes. Vlaar, Bennett had difficult starts but have looked better lately.

El Ahmadi played well last night but I know that's not enough, Holman maybe and Sylla haven't seen enough of him to judge yet.

Edited April 23, 2013 by PaulC

[MagicMushroom]

 

 

 

you sometimes have the be cruel to be kind.... "Nice Bunch of lads" and " we will go again" lines is taking this club down.

 

 

 

TBF, i doubt he says those things on the training pitch. Worst thing he could do, is publicly humiliate one of those youngsters.

[Big_John_10]

BJ and Morph - let me introduce you to nuance which is a concept that you both appear to be incapable of dealing with. Nothing is black and white, shades of grey and all that.

Oh this crap again.

Seems to the new thing to post to dismiss any opinion you don't agree with.

3) No probably not forced but it was absolutely the right decision and Vlaar IMO is better.

Why was it the right decision? I'm also struggling to see how Vlaar is a better player.

Excuses? No, haven't seen many of those, just attempts to explain to the doom mongers or the overly negative that things are more promising than last season despite the similar position.

Then you're not reading a lot of the posts. Injuries, limited funds, Lerner, MON etc.. Plenty of excuses have been made to take blame from the manager.

6) If he keeps us up he's not "amazing" and I haven't seen anyone say that. He would be doing his job. If he relegates us it wont solely be his fault but he will be culpable.

Agree completely with the 2nd part. But there have been people who have claimed it would be an amazing achievement, one even said he should be knighted if he keeps us up.

[Stevo985]

 

BJ and Morph - let me introduce you to nuance which is a concept that you both appear to be incapable of dealing with. Nothing is black and white, shades of grey and all that.

Oh this crap again.

Seems to the new thing to post to dismiss any opinion you don't agree with.

 

Similar to labelling anything you don't agree with as "excuses"

[Big_John_10]

Benteke, Lowton and Westwood have all been successes. Vlaar, Bennett had difficult starts but have looked better lately.

For me Benteke and Guzan have been a success.

Westwood has looked good but he's still not at the level where he's making a huge difference in games.

Lowton looks ok and like westwood has plenty of potential but there's no way any of our defenders can be classed as a success.

Bennetts been awful, Sylla has done very little, KEA has not been good enough, Dawkins was a waste of time and Bowery has done ok in the odd rare appearance.

BJ and Morph - let me introduce you to nuance which is a concept that you both appear to be incapable of dealing with. Nothing is black and white, shades of grey and all that.

Oh this crap again.

Seems to the new thing to post to dismiss any opinion you don't agree with.

Similar to labelling anything you don't agree with as "excuses"

Have the things I mentioned not been used as an excuse for our poor performances this season?

[Stevo985]

They're not excuses. They're reasons. It's context. It's people trying to have a discussion about something rather than just declaring everything awful all the time.

it's people trying to find explanations for performances that might not revolve purely around the manager's incompetence.

 

It might surprise you, but not everyone blames every last thing on Paul Lambert. Dismissing their reasons behind this as excuses is doing exactly what you yourself have complained about in the past. It's dismissing others' opinions because they differ from your own.

[BOF]

They're not excuses. They're reasons. It's context. It's people trying to have a discussion about something rather than just declaring everything awful all the time.

it's people trying to find explanations for performances that might not revolve purely around the manager's incompetence.

 

It might surprise you, but not everyone blames every last thing on Paul Lambert. Dismissing their reasons behind this as excuses is doing exactly what you yourself have complained about in the past. It's dismissing others' opinions because they differ from your own.

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