VillaForever1970 Posted January 2, 2013 Share Posted January 2, 2013 How can we go from shite in 3 and a half games to pretty decent in one half? Surely something more than youngsters being random and Swansea turning shit? Sme paedo proof players this month please Lambo. When the hell is Concrete Ron back? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AVFC-Prideofbrum Posted January 2, 2013 Share Posted January 2, 2013 (edited) Well I did say I'd hoped we'd go 4-4-2 play with more width and more direct and we certainly did that to an extent. We didn't get the ball into the box from wide areas at all that often, mainly down to the lack of good possession in good areas which was difficult to come by but for the first time going forward in a while we did seem to have more of a plan which I thought we have lacked going forward recently. It was hardly a plan of great intelligence but hitting Benteke early as soon as we got the ball with Weimann gambling every time and wingers getting closer looking for lay off just meant we seemed more comfortable in what was trying to be achieved. Defence is the major issue but with the lack of quality, I can accept that to an extent. Chris Herd would do well to be a CB in any top half championship side never mind Premiership while Clark at best is just about good enough for where we are, Stevens championship at best as well. CB, CM, WG need most in January, get rid of a couple clearly not doing it if we can and with a positive result vs Southampton and all our returning injuries, I'll be very encouraged of a really good finish to the season Edited January 2, 2013 by AVFC-Prideofbrum 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raver50032 Posted January 2, 2013 Share Posted January 2, 2013 Great point. We can't rely on teams missing chances though. Today sounded like it should have been over after 20 mins. Yeah - this 'it should have been all over after 20 minutes' is starting to sound a bit familiar. Our win at Anfield started like that... and we shot ourselves in the foot at the Bridge after Chelsea had the pepper-pot out straight away. Maybe it's just luck? Certainly can't rely of other teams faltering early doors - we need to be shutting them out and frustrating them better. On the face of it, a good point yesterday - but oh so 'teasing' to lose that goal in injury time. At least the rot got stopped. Up the Villa. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R.I.C.O. Posted January 2, 2013 Share Posted January 2, 2013 Yes, a point away from home can turn things around, better to have something to build on than yet another defeat. If we'd have lost yesterday the pressure on Lambert would have been pretty untenable (even the BBC are now starting to use the same deflated Lambert image after every Villa result). A few wise experienced heads will allow for more stability and less headless chicken displays. Whether or not we go for these kinds of players is another matter - but they are definitely needed! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ryanvilla_1994 Posted January 2, 2013 Share Posted January 2, 2013 I still have faith in Lambert but my patience will be tested if he doesn't get us some good, experienced players this month. Good point yesterday anyway and good to stop the rot. Shame we couldn't hang on though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VillaCas Posted January 2, 2013 Share Posted January 2, 2013 (edited) To put what is happening into some sort of context I looked at the points return under McL and under PL to see if there are any trends. I used a 5-match rolling average of points return (the same method most commonly used for "current form" calculation) to more easily identify movement The trends for McL's first half of the season started ok but declined as games progressed, his second half season started from a poor position and got even worse. PL's first half season took over from that very poor position and gradually improved from a dismal .4 points return per game up to almost 1.8 points per game before the Chelsea debacle. We have since gone on an extremley bad run and the most current form shows .8 pts per game - relegation form. The question is - should the general improvement that we saw under PL up until the Chelsea game be taken as indicative of how the season might progress or should we just look at the last four games and draw conclusions from that and predict that improvement peaked at the Liverpool game and is on it's way back down? I'm still backing PL to succeed and for the small improvements we saw up to Chelsea to resume - I know other think differently Chart shows rolling 5 match average points return under PL with trendline Edited January 2, 2013 by VillaCas Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
omariqy Posted January 2, 2013 Share Posted January 2, 2013 Surely any decision you make on Lambert will be based on where we end up at the end of the season not on if he buys experience or not? I said from the beginning that I think we will have ups and downs and finish between 10th and 14th. I would take 14th now and a league cup win! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BOF Posted January 2, 2013 Moderator Share Posted January 2, 2013 It'll be interesting to see how he prioritises the Bradford and Southampton games. Merson made the point on Soccer Saturday that the Saints game is now 100 times bigger than the cup game and this makes his team selections awkward. Do you risk going out to a League 2 side by putting a weakened team out against them? Or do you go into both games with the same team and hope they're not too tired on the Saturday*. *remember you don't necessarily need to be tired, you just need to be more tired than Southampton. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mantis Posted January 2, 2013 Share Posted January 2, 2013 It'll be interesting to see how he prioritises the Bradford and Southampton games. Merson made the point on Soccer Saturday that the Saints game is now 100 times bigger than the cup game and this makes his team selections awkward. Do you risk going out to a League 2 side by putting a weakened team out against them? Or do you go into both games with the same team and hope they're not too tired on the Saturday*. *remember you don't necessarily need to be tired, you just need to be more tired than Southampton. I'd put out a wakened team against Bradford in the first leg. At least then you've got the chance of turning it round in the second leg. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VillaCas Posted January 2, 2013 Share Posted January 2, 2013 I'd put out a wakened team against Bradford in the first leg. At least then you've got the chance of turning it round in the second leg. I agree - it almost doesn't matter because I feel there is not a lot of difference between our second string and our first To put what is happening into some sort of context I looked at the points return under McL and under PL to see if there are any trends. I used a 5-match rolling average of points return (the same method most commonly used for "current form" calculation) to more easily identify movement The trends for McL's first half of the season started ok but declined as games progressed, his second half season started from a poor position and got even worse. PL's first half season took over from that very poor position and gradually improved from a dismal .4 points return per game up to almost 1.8 points per game before the Chelsea debacle. We have since gone on an extremley bad run and the most current form shows .8 pts per game - relegation form. The question is - should the general improvement that we saw under PL up until the Chelsea game be taken as indicative of how the season might progress or should we just look at the last four games and draw conclusions from that and predict that improvement peaked at the Liverpool game and is on it's way back down? I'm still backing PL to succeed and for the small improvements we saw up to Chelsea to resume - I know other think differently Chart shows rolling 5 match average points return under PL with trendline I've managed to upload the chart - let's hope that the improvement in points return up to the Liverpool game resumes Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sutherland Posted January 2, 2013 Share Posted January 2, 2013 It'll be interesting to see how he prioritises the Bradford and Southampton games. Merson made the point on Soccer Saturday that the Saints game is now 100 times bigger than the cup game and this makes his team selections awkward. Do you risk going out to a League 2 side by putting a weakened team out against them? Or do you go into both games with the same team and hope they're not too tired on the Saturday*. *remember you don't necessarily need to be tired, you just need to be more tired than Southampton. I see what you are saying mate but the team we started with against swansea was Guzan, Lowton, Clark [c], Bennett, Herd, Weimann, Delph, Stevens, Westwood, Benteke, Albrighton maybe benteke aside, Is it possible for us to start with a weaker 11 than that?.. Serious question like... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mantis Posted January 2, 2013 Share Posted January 2, 2013 I see what you are saying mate but the team we started with against swansea was Guzan, Lowton, Clark [c], Bennett, Herd, Weimann, Delph, Stevens, Westwood, Benteke, Albrighton maybe benteke aside, Is it possible for us to start with a weaker 11 than that?.. Serious question like... Of course. Guzan, Lowton, Clark, Bennett, Westwood, Benteke and maybe even Weimann would all make it into our best 11 right now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villaglint Posted January 2, 2013 Share Posted January 2, 2013 It'll be interesting to see how he prioritises the Bradford and Southampton games. Merson made the point on Soccer Saturday that the Saints game is now 100 times bigger than the cup game and this makes his team selections awkward. Do you risk going out to a League 2 side by putting a weakened team out against them? Or do you go into both games with the same team and hope they're not too tired on the Saturday*. *remember you don't necessarily need to be tired, you just need to be more tired than Southampton. Yep I'm with Sutherland - we have major injuries and our team is really down to the bare bones. Lambert has pretty much zero choice as to who he plays in defence at the moment, same upfront. He has literally one or two options in midfield but realistically they are all of a similar quality so don't really see any one set being weaker than the others. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BOF Posted January 2, 2013 Moderator Share Posted January 2, 2013 Sutherland, as Mantis says, that was effectively our first string at the time. I'm not trying to subjectively discuss what is or isn't a weak or strong line-up. I'm on about the number of first choicers in it. If you take it as read that the team against Swansea was our strongest at the time (and there's no reason to assume otherwise. We were trying to win a league game after all) then the discussion becomes - do you fill the team v Bradford with players who don't normally feature for the first team. Whether you or I believe them to be weaker or not is irrelevant to the discussion. I believe the best thing to do is for Lambert to first pick the team he would play against Southampton; as that game is clearly the priority; then you decide which of them can't manage 2 games in 4 (or whatever it is) days due to fatigue/injury and adjust them accordingly. For example, if it's right that Vlaar will be back for Southampton then there's an example of someone I'd definitely not risk against Bradford. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mattyp_avfc Posted January 2, 2013 Share Posted January 2, 2013 (edited) For the 2 cups games personally I think we should be giving a chance too, Jordan Graham, Jack Grealish, Callum Robinson, Samir Carruthers, Daniel Johnson (Back from yeovil I think), Dan Williams and maybe Benji Seigrist... that would let us rest a couple of players for the league. EDIT Obviously not all at the same time Edited January 2, 2013 by Mattyp_avfc Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sutherland Posted January 2, 2013 Share Posted January 2, 2013 Of course. Guzan, Lowton, Clark, Bennett, Westwood, Benteke and maybe even Weimann would all make it into our best 11 right now. So looking at our squad taking into account, who is out injured or out on loan ect-ect, Lamberts first choice weakest 11 right now is?.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chappy Posted January 2, 2013 Share Posted January 2, 2013 I wouldn't play a weakened team against Bradford, we have 4 days in between that and the Soton game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard Posted January 2, 2013 Share Posted January 2, 2013 I see what you are saying mate but the team we started with against swansea was Guzan, Lowton, Clark [c], Bennett, Herd, Weimann, Delph, Stevens, Westwood, Benteke, Albrighton maybe benteke aside, Is it possible for us to start with a weaker 11 than that?.. Serious question like... Look at that team there. The most expensive player there is Fabian Delph Total cost £24M for that team and that is being generous. I do not believe the combined weekly wages for that lot would be much above £120K per week , I cant believe we still have money issues Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nath182 Posted January 2, 2013 Share Posted January 2, 2013 For the 2 cups games personally I think we should be giving a chance too, Jordan Graham, Jack Grealish, Callum Robinson, Samir Carruthers, Daniel Johnson (Back from yeovil I think), Dan Williams and maybe Benji Seigrist... that would let us rest a couple of players for the league. EDIT Obviously not all at the same time No way should that happen, I understand the league should be priority due to our current shit form but we should be putting out as strong a team as possible for both legs of the Bradford game (don't really care about the FA Cup, we would probably be better off out of that at this point). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mantis Posted January 2, 2013 Share Posted January 2, 2013 I'd give Bowery a run out in the next two games. Benteke definitely needs a rest. So looking at our squad taking into account, who is out injured or out on loan ect-ect, Lamberts first choice weakest 11 right now is?.. Well, the likes of Bowery, Ireland, El-Ahmadi, Lichaj and Given didn't start that game and I'd say they're all weaker than the players we put out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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