Morpheus Posted October 25, 2012 Share Posted October 25, 2012 Its a ridiculous statement - as there is no way you could possibly know whether David Moyes would have got us Champions League Football. You have no clue how it could have turned out. On the other foot, I have no possible way of knowing whether he wouldn't either. Overall its a stupid thing to say. Based on what he has achieved with Everton i would say its more than plausible that he would have got us into the Champions League by now given the funding O'Neill received and it would only be a stupid thing to say if it was an impossibility. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coda Posted October 25, 2012 Share Posted October 25, 2012 I'm struggling to see what relevance Moyes and the Champions League has to this thread. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KjParton Posted October 25, 2012 Share Posted October 25, 2012 I'm struggling to see what relevance Moyes and the Champions League has to this thread. I agree. Paul Lambert is our current manager and I doubt Moyes will ever manage this club. I think its important we start getting behind the team instead of slating our manager 8 games into a 38 game season... 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raver50032 Posted October 26, 2012 Share Posted October 26, 2012 Nah, stick with Lambert. Who needs the bitter toffee-managing Gremlin anyway? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Woodytom Posted October 26, 2012 Share Posted October 26, 2012 Based on what he has achieved with Everton i would say its more than plausible that he would have got us into the Champions League by now given the funding O'Neill received and it would only be a stupid thing to say if it was an impossibility. He wouldnt have got us champions league football. What would have happened would be this.. Hed of spent a load of money though the media would consistently highlight he has spent nothing. 20m this calendar year for example. We would have consistently come 7th or 8th with some higher as well as lower positions. We would have won nothing We would have had to contend with dirty players kicking and elbowing the opposition with no punishment whatsoever and the media would somehow convince 99% of the world that we had the greatest manager ever to live. Lets give Lambert a chance FFS. 8 games!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Woodytom Posted October 26, 2012 Share Posted October 26, 2012 In fact, doing a little research.....The myth that David Moyes is doing anything more than a good job (which I have to give him credit for of course. Cos lets face it - he is doing a good job). However..... Since 2003 - Everton stand 10th in the premier league big spenders table. There average position since that time is 8th. Applaudable but hardly worth the superlatives he receives. A few good seasons, matched by some bad ones and the others hovering just about (slightly above in fairness) where they should be. And no trophies. Its a media myth. In Lambert I trust. Not that wed be getting Moyes anyhow Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morpheus Posted October 26, 2012 Share Posted October 26, 2012 Forgetting of course that Moyes has already qualified for the Champions League with Everton and one more point. What squad would you prefer to have representing Villa. The one that we have now built and dismantled by a succession of managers, or the one built at Everton over the same period of time by Moyes? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Papillon Posted October 26, 2012 Share Posted October 26, 2012 Think it is kind of smalltime to disrespect David Moyes and his work at Everton. 1) He has been at the club for several more years than the average manager in the Premier League 2) He got them into Champions League qualifiers only to be extremely unlucky to meet a very good Villarreal at the time - how many outside the top 4-5 have managed that since 1992? 3) He never bitches about it and he never says stuff like "you never know in the future" about his own employment, stability is real key for such clubs I would say what he has accomplished is the absolute maximum Paul Lambert could do at Villa, and odds are that he will never do it. Would I want Moyes here now instead of Lambert? Not at all, him starting a new job and doing everything from scratch is never a good idea. Do I have faith in Lambert? Yup, I really like the guy and I hope he will develop something to be proud of here, but to think Moyes' job is something worth trashtalking is just daft IMO. We have outspent Everton over the last 5 years I would reckon, still they are beating United and are currently 4th, we are going to struggle with 15th at best as it seems. So calm down and be realistic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Woodytom Posted October 26, 2012 Share Posted October 26, 2012 Think it is kind of smalltime to disrespect David Moyes and his work at Everton. 1) He has been at the club for several more years than the average manager in the Premier League 2) He got them into Champions League qualifiers only to be extremely unlucky to meet a very good Villarreal at the time - how many outside the top 4-5 have managed that since 1992? 3) He never bitches about it and he never says stuff like "you never know in the future" about his own employment, stability is real key for such clubs I would say what he has accomplished is the absolute maximum Paul Lambert could do at Villa, and odds are that he will never do it. Would I want Moyes here now instead of Lambert? Not at all, him starting a new job and doing everything from scratch is never a good idea. Do I have faith in Lambert? Yup, I really like the guy and I hope he will develop something to be proud of here, but to think Moyes' job is something worth trashtalking is just daft IMO. We have outspent Everton over the last 5 years I would reckon, still they are beating United and are currently 4th, we are going to struggle with 15th at best as it seems. So calm down and be realistic. I never did trashtalk his job? Did you not see the bit where I put - 'I cant argue that hes doing a good job'? Totally agree with you regarding us v Everton. However that has more to do with how abysmal we are. Arguably, one of the worst teams I have seen in prem history over the last 2 or 3 years. Truly appauling. All I am saying is - Does the job Moyes has done at Everton deserve the over the top credit that it gets? Nobody ever says - 'Yeah thats all well and good - but he hasnt won anything in that time' Its almost like there is no negative with him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KjParton Posted October 26, 2012 Share Posted October 26, 2012 i am also not denying Moyes has done a good job at Everton. I just think its a bit stupid to think if we had Moyes he would have definitely got us Champions league... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stevo985 Posted October 26, 2012 VT Supporter Share Posted October 26, 2012 i am also not denying Moyes has done a good job at Everton. I just think its a bit stupid to think if we had Moyes he would have definitely got us Champions league... Me too. It's making an assumption that good manager + more money = better manager Which isn't always the case. I would bet that if we'd never got MON, and someone else had come in and failed to get us CL, some people would say "MON would definitely have gotten us CL" I happen to think Moyes is a great manager and actually he very well might have got us CL. But stating it as a certainty is wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NIVillan Posted October 26, 2012 Share Posted October 26, 2012 Based on what he has achieved with Everton i would say its more than plausible that he would have got us into the Champions League by now given the funding O'Neill received and it would only be a stupid thing to say if it was an impossibility. Could be that he is a perfect fit for Everton and the way they work. He hasnt a record of buying top playes but has a record of buying players that get you 5th/6th. I think he is a great manager but Everton is Everton and we are Villa. Two different clubs which can have two different reactions to Moyes style of management Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morpheus Posted October 26, 2012 Share Posted October 26, 2012 i am also not denying Moyes has done a good job at Everton. I just think its a bit stupid to think if we had Moyes he would have definitely got us Champions league... No it isn't stupid. My statement is based on how well he has done at Everton given less funding than he would have with us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morpheus Posted October 26, 2012 Share Posted October 26, 2012 Could be that he is a perfect fit for Everton and the way they work. He hasnt a record of buying top playes but has a record of buying players that get you 5th/6th. I think he is a great manager but Everton is Everton and we are Villa. Two different clubs which can have two different reactions to Moyes style of management Moyes would have built us very much in the same way as he did at Everton. Who was going to stop him from doing that? Randy? Moyes would certainly have been given the same amount of control as O'Neill with one difference. He wouldn't have purchased players on a nudge and wink from other players (Sidwell-Shorey). He wouldn't have been stupid enough to put put the likes of Beye on 40 grand per week, or Heskey on 65 grand per week. Moyes would have purchased the same players as he has at Everton and with the budget afforded by Lerner when he first came to our club, might have even bettered the present squad at Everton? One thing i'm sure of. If Moyes had come to our club at the same time MON did, we certainly wouldn't have the poor squad we have now or indeed our concerns over relegation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sharkyvilla Posted October 26, 2012 Share Posted October 26, 2012 Moyes would have built us very much in the same way as he did at Everton. Who was going to stop him from doing that? Randy? Moyes would certainly have been given the same amount of control as O'Neill with one difference. He wouldn't have purchased players on a nudge and wink from other players (Sidwell-Shorey). He wouldn't have been stupid enough to put put the likes of Beye on 40 grand per week, or Heskey on 65 grand per week. Moyes would have purchased the same players as he has at Everton and with the budget afforded by Lerner when he first came to our club, might have even bettered the present squad at Everton? One thing i'm sure of. If Moyes had come to our club at the same time MON did, we certainly wouldn't have the poor squad we have now or indeed our concerns over relegation. True. The one thing I would say is that Lambert seems to be building his squad in a similar way to how Moyes has done it with good footballers who he knows have good attitude. Once we can field an XI full of them then we will get similar results but we still have a long way to go on that front. Lambert wasn't going to be able to do that in one window and Moyes wouldn't have been able to do it for us this summer either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CI Posted October 26, 2012 Share Posted October 26, 2012 This is a long term project. Staying up this year is the key, then we can really build something similar to what Moyes has done. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AVFCforever1991 Posted October 26, 2012 Share Posted October 26, 2012 Actually a good post CI. Agreed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ciggiesnbeer Posted October 26, 2012 Share Posted October 26, 2012 I dont understand why we are talking about other clubs managers. SAF or Mourinho might have got us in the CL too. Shrug. They are not here, Lambert is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KjParton Posted October 26, 2012 Share Posted October 26, 2012 It's all good saying "x manager" would have definitely got us champions league - We will never know. At the moment we have Lambert as our manager and we need to back him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CI Posted October 26, 2012 Share Posted October 26, 2012 Actually a good post CI. You seem surprised ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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