smetrov Posted April 24, 2013 Share Posted April 24, 2013 We are seventeenth. We have been at the lower end of the table for most of the season and we are currently fighting a relegation battle. Last season we also were threatened with relegation. What exactly have i made up and this progression you speak of, does it actually show in league position and points compared to last year? Are you still going to be spouting this rubbish if we are relegated? Your constant tactic is to ignore the point posters make and reply to a fantasy point that only exists in your own mind Let me be clear - I'm not claiming that we are Bayern Munich and that we are taking the football world by storm, I am merely pointing out that, whilst last season we started off averagely and gradually declined, getting worse as the season progressed. This season, we have started poorly and gradually improved. Improvement does not mean that we get relentlessly better week by week - it means that the general trend is upwards. Obviously we had an appalling Christmas period, but even taking that into account the trend is very very clearly upwards We are of course still 17th - that is because we started so badly (intially carrying on the trend from last season). Form for 2013 is mid-table and shows obvious progression. Who would you rather have playing the last four games of the season - McL's declining squad from last week or PL's current improving squad - I know which one I'd choose The improvement is marginal - we have recently beaten Reading QPR Stoke West Ham Welcome though those victories are - for me the don't represent a new dawn, - Had we been able to beat Fulham and Liverpool - 2 average sides, they maybe you would have point - but we didn't - as soon as we went ahead - we were pegged back with 15 minutes. Pretty much guarantee - that if we take the lead v sunderland -, they will equalize - unless, as I have said previously its after 75 minutes, then we may hold on Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nabby Posted April 24, 2013 Share Posted April 24, 2013 As long as that form of beating teams near us continues we will be fine .. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CI Posted April 24, 2013 Share Posted April 24, 2013 It's feasible that we can beat Sunderland Norwich and Wigan. They are crap sides and if we can't beat sides such as this there's not much point being in this division. I have seriously not enjoyed this season much and would rather not go through this experience again Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zatman Posted April 24, 2013 Share Posted April 24, 2013 and with Norwich safe they may be on the beach when we play them With the Lambert factor I think they'd take the first flight back. Basically I don't think there's any scenario where Norwich are on the beach playing us. I agree Brian, I'd say they would only be delighted to finish ahead of us number one and number do anything to relegate us. The place will be hoping as well, probably a sell out. Similarly Swansea play Wigan and hopefully they will have same fire people expecting from Norwich Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BOF Posted April 24, 2013 Moderator Share Posted April 24, 2013 Similarly Swansea play Wigan and hopefully they will have same fire people expecting from NorwichNah, I think that wound is well healed by now. Although I hope you're right. I just don't think the needle between Martinez and Swansea's fans will be anything like ours. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kurtsimonw Posted April 24, 2013 Share Posted April 24, 2013 If Spurs and Arsenal beat them, which is obviously not asking an awful lot, then 4 points for us until the end of the season will probably be enough. That'd mean Wigan have to beat us on the final day, plus get a minimum 4 points vs WBA/Swansea. I wish I'd stop looking at the fixtures left because it's driving me mad. Part of me thinks if Norwich beat Stoke this weekend then as Norwich are safe they wouldn't be as tough an opponent, but then obviously there's the Lambert factor. I think come 10pm Monday night a lot of things will have changed, hopefully for the better for us. A win + Wigan loss would be absolutely massive, particularly if Norwich beat Stoke also as it would drop them back in the shit and Sunderland too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zatman Posted April 24, 2013 Share Posted April 24, 2013 Similarly Swansea play Wigan and hopefully they will have same fire people expecting from Norwich Nah, I think that wound is well healed by now. Although I hope you're right. I just don't think the needle between Martinez and Swansea's fans will be anything like ours. im sure they would still like to get 1 over on him. hopefully in our case Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BOF Posted April 24, 2013 Moderator Share Posted April 24, 2013 As I say, I hope you're right. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villa-revolution Posted April 24, 2013 Share Posted April 24, 2013 It's feasible that we can beat Sunderland Norwich and Wigan. They are crap sides and if we can't beat sides such as this there's not much point being in this division. I have seriously not enjoyed this season much and would rather not go through this experience again If staying in this division means having to go through this experience again next season, BRING IT ON!! 1. Because it means we have survived. 2. Because logic from this therefore dictates that a similar experience means we would also survive again next season. Finally, i'm sure few posters have enjoyed this season unless they are masochists. There is absolutely no positives in relegation. None! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morpheus Posted April 24, 2013 Share Posted April 24, 2013 We are seventeenth. We have been at the lower end of the table for most of the season and we are currently fighting a relegation battle. Last season we also were threatened with relegation. What exactly have i made up and this progression you speak of, does it actually show in league position and points compared to last year? Are you still going to be spouting this rubbish if we are relegated? Your constant tactic is to ignore the point posters make and reply to a fantasy point that only exists in your own mind Let me be clear - I'm not claiming that we are Bayern Munich and that we are taking the football world by storm, I am merely pointing out that, whilst last season we started off averagely and gradually declined, getting worse as the season progressed. This season, we have started poorly and gradually improved. Improvement does not mean that we get relentlessly better week by week - it means that the general trend is upwards. Obviously we had an appalling Christmas period, but even taking that into account the trend is very very clearly upwards We are of course still 17th - that is because we started so badly (intially carrying on the trend from last season). Form for 2013 is mid-table and shows obvious progression. Who would you rather have playing the last four games of the season - McL's declining squad from last week or PL's current improving squad - I know which one I'd choose I actually don't use any tactics on here and that is something you have made up in your own head. I also don't ignore points posters are making, as i respond to them with facts which i have done again replying to your post. The progression you speak of and shown statistically in you chart hasn't transpired into enough points in four months to move us away from the relegation zone where we have been for the majority of the season and that is the reality. If the table you put so much faith in still shows progression even though we are relegated will you still state the team has progressed under Lambert? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
roonst83 Posted April 24, 2013 Share Posted April 24, 2013 Similarly Swansea play Wigan and hopefully they will have same fire people expecting from Norwich Nah, I think that wound is well healed by now. Although I hope you're right. I just don't think the needle between Martinez and Swansea's fans will be anything like ours. im sure they would still like to get 1 over on him. hopefully in our case Interesting thing about this game is Swansea like to keep the ball, and they can do that well. Wigan also like to keep the ball and knock it around - so it'll be interesting to see who is better at retaining possession. Wigan did very well against Man City but they'll expect to have to go at Swansea more which may make the game pretty open. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BOF Posted April 24, 2013 Moderator Share Posted April 24, 2013 Swansea aren't great away from home. I think the draw is the best we can hope for there. I'd be amazed if Wigan lost that one given what's at stake and where they're playing it.If anyone is on the beach now it's Swansea. They've won their cup, they've secured Europe for next season and they have mid-table safety. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jayEm Posted April 24, 2013 Share Posted April 24, 2013 We will beat Norwich. They leave so much space for attackers to run into, so our quartet will have a field day. As we did in December- also at Carrow Road. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaulC Posted April 24, 2013 Share Posted April 24, 2013 If Wigan produce performances at home like they did against Newcastle and Norwich then I see no reason why Swansea cant beat them. Wigan are poor at home! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VillaCas Posted April 24, 2013 Share Posted April 24, 2013 You tried to argue we'd improved right before our Xmas period using a select amount of games and ignoring the fact it was officially the worst start to a premiership season we'd ever had. Firstly, I didn't take a "select amount of games", I simply took all the games since the start of the season? Secondly, the upward trend was actual not fictional - we made a terrible start but then the average points return clearly increased on the run-up to Xmas. I hoped that that improvement would be maintained but that was sadly not the case and our performances were shocking over Xmas. Since then average points return has again clearly been on an upwards trend. I think we all get that you think everything and everyone is shit but even you can't argue that the average points return is trending upwards - if we can maintain this it bodes well for next season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VillaCas Posted April 24, 2013 Share Posted April 24, 2013 The improvement is marginal - we have recently beaten Reading QPR Stoke West Ham Welcome though those victories are - for me the don't represent a new dawn, - Had we been able to beat Fulham and Liverpool - 2 average sides, they maybe you would have point - but we didn't - as soon as we went ahead - we were pegged back with 15 minutes. Pretty much guarantee - that if we take the lead v sunderland -, they will equalize - unless, as I have said previously its after 75 minutes, then we may hold on I don't recall that I said that this represents a new dawn - my only point was that whilst last season we started averagely and gradually got worse, the trend this season is the opposite On your other point, we are 17th (perhaps slightly higher on current form) so of course we can only hope to beat those teams around us. We would need to improve considerably to be confident of beating teams like Liverpool consistently. This is our home(blue) and away(red) form adjusted by league position - clearly we do better against the worst teams. Incidentally, the chart suggests that if we might get 5 points from our remaining games (perhaps 7 if we just take our current form which is better) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sne Posted April 24, 2013 Share Posted April 24, 2013 There have been improvements during the second half of the season, but as you can see looking at the stats or the league table those improvents have been minute and not enough (imo) to claim we have turned a corner. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
briny_ear Posted April 24, 2013 Share Posted April 24, 2013 (edited) That graph that keeps popping up looks a bit like a very drunken man desperately trying to walk a straight line in order to get home. Depending on which way he lurches next, he will either stumble safely into his front door or end up in the gutter. And that just about sums up where we are at present. You can draw a line through the middle of any graph and call it a trend but that's only a statistical technicality. In the real world, we are at real risk of slumping to relegation but everyone has their fingers crossed we won't. And the idea that it "bodes well for next season" makes me chortle a bit. Unless we can seriously sort out some large structural weaknesses in the squad we are most likely in for another wibbly wobbly stagger home again. Edited April 24, 2013 by briny_ear 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smetrov Posted April 24, 2013 Share Posted April 24, 2013 The improvement is marginal - we have recently beaten Reading QPR Stoke West Ham Welcome though those victories are - for me the don't represent a new dawn, - Had we been able to beat Fulham and Liverpool - 2 average sides, they maybe you would have point - but we didn't - as soon as we went ahead - we were pegged back with 15 minutes. Pretty much guarantee - that if we take the lead v sunderland -, they will equalize - unless, as I have said previously its after 75 minutes, then we may hold on I don't recall that I said that this represents a new dawn - my only point was that whilst last season we started averagely and gradually got worse, the trend this season is the opposite On your other point, we are 17th (perhaps slightly higher on current form) so of course we can only hope to beat those teams around us. We would need to improve considerably to be confident of beating teams like Liverpool consistently. This is our home(blue) and away(red) form adjusted by league position - clearly we do better against the worst teams. Incidentally, the chart suggests that if we might get 5 points from our remaining games (perhaps 7 if we just take our current form which is better) Wot you mean the above average liverpool - who in there next 2 games failed to beat west ham and reading ? - they may have a fine history - but in 2013 they are average as they come. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
briny_ear Posted April 24, 2013 Share Posted April 24, 2013 Dunno, I think Liverpool have had a bit more bite in recent games. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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