January Transfer Window - 2023

[MWARLEY2]

11 minutes ago, KMitch said:

I think part of the frustration with regards to transfer fees paid out is that while we have top 4 owners in terms of their net worth, we aren't exactly throwing around money like it lately.  We spent a lot of money our first season back in the Prem (needed to because we had a tiny squad after promotion), but since then we're basically mid-table with our spending since.  During our first 2 seasons back in the Prem (19/20-20/21) we were 4th in the league in terms of total transfer spend and number 1 in terms of total net spend.  The past two seasons show quite differently...  We've been 9th in total fees spent in the last two seasons and 15th in net spend, and that includes the Grealish money.  Sure, maybe there were doubts with regard to Gerrard's managerial skills this summer and funds were held back, but something has changed and we aren't throwing money around like other clubs with "poorer" ownership.  Maybe FFP is hamstringing us more than we know or maybe we're seeing problems were there are none, but the one thing that is clear is that spending habits have changed recently.  

We bring in so little revenue compared to rhe top 6 that sometimes it can feel that we are not spending.  But if Chelsea can bring in 320 mill worth of talent for every say 80 million we can bring in , then it shows how **** up the system is. 

 

 

[Podster]

What worries me is we are 12 days in to January and we made 1 lowish cost signing. We should have had players signaled out ready to approach before the transfer window opened. But no, and here we are AGAIN talking about signing players that want a new club because they dont get enough game time at the clubs they play for , we dont need cast offs, we want players who are going to move usup a level.

 

[S-Platt]

1 hour ago, Pissflaps said:

The quality of the player isn't necessarily directly related to the transfer fee paid.

You would think given the money villa waste on players that this would be an accepted fact by now!

Yep or the quality of the player depends on the coach/manager and system they play in.

Bissouma for instance everyone wanted him now looks crap under Conte.

Most players Man Utd waste money on like Sancho.

If you have a proper coach with a plan then he will buy the players for his system.

We now have the proper coach so whoever he wants is fine by me.  Pay pennies or over the odds he will make them look class.

[Steero113]

7 minutes ago, Podster said:

What worries me is we are 12 days in to January and we made 1 lowish cost signing. We should have had players signaled out ready to approach before the transfer window opened. But no, and here we are AGAIN talking about signing players that want a new club because they dont get enough game time at the clubs they play for , we dont need cast offs, we want players who are going to move usup a level.

 

The value of the signing has no bearing on the quality. 

Kamara was free for example. 

Let’s judge Moreno in a few weeks from now, I think you’ll be pleasantly suprised. 

EDIT: Also, please indicate to me which players we have been linked with that get no game time at their clubs? Deulofeu is critical to Udinese, as is Guendouzi to Marseille. They start every single game for their clubs. 

 

Edited January 12, 2023 by Steero113

[gwi1890]

5 minutes ago, Podster said:

What worries me is we are 12 days in to January and we made 1 lowish cost signing. We should have had players signaled out ready to approach before the transfer window opened. But no, and here we are AGAIN talking about signing players that want a new club because they dont get enough game time at the clubs they play for , we dont need cast offs, we want players who are going to move usup a level.

 

We’ve acted quickly in previous windows and got plenty wrong.

[paul514]

39 minutes ago, KMitch said:

I think part of the frustration with regards to transfer fees paid out is that while we have top 4 owners in terms of their net worth, we aren't exactly throwing around money like it lately.  We spent a lot of money our first season back in the Prem (needed to because we had a tiny squad after promotion), but since then we're basically mid-table with our spending since.  During our first 2 seasons back in the Prem (19/20-20/21) we were 4th in the league in terms of total transfer spend and number 1 in terms of total net spend.  The past two seasons show quite differently...  We've been 9th in total fees spent in the last two seasons and 15th in net spend, and that includes the Grealish money.  Sure, maybe there were doubts with regard to Gerrard's managerial skills this summer and funds were held back, but something has changed and we aren't throwing money around like other clubs with "poorer" ownership.  Maybe FFP is hamstringing us more than we know or maybe we're seeing problems were there are none, but the one thing that is clear is that spending habits have changed recently.  

Thing is FFP exists, the longer you are in the league the more the wage bill inflates and eats the transfer budget.

This is why I am very interested in mitigating risk by signing people who can be moved on easily because you haven't gone mad on wages for them from the start and because they are at an age for easy resale.

Singings that are 25 and under fit that category, signings that are 29 are not.

People on here have moaned at me in the past saying things like it isn't your money etc and my response has always been that we have the best chance we have ever had to build something here and eventually the owners will get fed up of being burnt and lower the investment, its just bad business.

[paul514]

11 minutes ago, S-Platt said:

Yep or the quality of the player depends on the coach/manager and system they play in.

Bissouma for instance everyone wanted him now looks crap under Conte.

Most players Man Utd waste money on like Sancho.

If you have a proper coach with a plan then he will buy the players for his system.

We now have the proper coach so whoever he wants is fine by me.  Pay pennies or over the odds he will make them look class.

not sure about he will make them look class but the longer he is about and the more players we trade the more the transfers will look like hits than misses.

[messi11]

Linked with Danilo from Palmeiras. Another Target of Nottingham Forest 

Maybe a Guendouzi alternative 

[duke313]

14 minutes ago, paul514 said:

Thing is FFP exists, the longer you are in the league the more the wage bill inflates and eats the transfer budget.

This is why I am very interested in mitigating risk by signing people who can be moved on easily because you haven't gone mad on wages for them from the start and because they are at an age for easy resale.

Singings that are 25 and under fit that category, signings that are 29 are not.

People on here have moaned at me in the past saying things like it isn't your money etc and my response has always been that we have the best chance we have ever had to build something here and eventually the owners will get fed up of being burnt and lower the investment, its just bad business.

What, like Traore, Guilbert and Wesley?

[Aston_Villan4]

30 minutes ago, duke313 said:

What, like Traore, Guilbert and Wesley?

You can argue that these are also losses at this point in time:

Sanson was 26 when we signed him. Close enough so I'm counting him, lol.

Watkins was 24

Buendia was 24

Bailey was 23

Nakamba was 23

 

Not a big loss but negative gains were:

Trez and Engels who we signed at 24

 

Edited January 12, 2023 by Aston_Villan4

[Marka Ragnos]

1 hour ago, Podster said:

What worries me is we are 12 days in to January and we made 1 lowish cost signing. We should have had players signaled out ready to approach before the transfer window opened. But no, and here we are AGAIN talking about signing players that want a new club because they dont get enough game time at the clubs they play for , we dont need cast offs, we want players who are going to move usup a level.

 

This is exactly what we did with Moreno. It wasn't broadcast on News at 10 but that's what did happen. No doubt he's not the only player Villa's scouts have been surveilling since November and December and perhaps before. 

54 minutes ago, paul514 said:

Thing is FFP exists, the longer you are in the league the more the wage bill inflates and eats the transfer budget.

This is why I am very interested in mitigating risk by signing people who can be moved on easily because you haven't gone mad on wages for them from the start and because they are at an age for easy resale.

Singings that are 25 and under fit that category, signings that are 29 are not.

People on here have moaned at me in the past saying things like it isn't your money etc and my response has always been that we have the best chance we have ever had to build something here and eventually the owners will get fed up of being burnt and lower the investment, its just bad business.

I mean, that's a great policy. Who can seriously doubt you on that? Still, it's a policy idea, not a straitjacket, and when a square peg to the policy appears, who nonetheless is a round peg for another aspect of our squad, ie a great opportunity arises, we need to make exceptions. Moreno is that.

Edited January 12, 2023 by Marka Ragnos

[Aston_Villan4]

55 minutes ago, paul514 said:

Thing is FFP exists, the longer you are in the league the more the wage bill inflates and eats the transfer budget.

This is why I am very interested in mitigating risk by signing people who can be moved on easily because you haven't gone mad on wages for them from the start and because they are at an age for easy resale.

Singings that are 25 and under fit that category, signings that are 29 are not.

People on here have moaned at me in the past saying things like it isn't your money etc and my response has always been that we have the best chance we have ever had to build something here and eventually the owners will get fed up of being burnt and lower the investment, its just bad business.

It's pretty balanced right now. It just looks worse because some of our 25 and under players are not at all panning out. But a mix of youth and experience is not necessarily a bad thing.

[thunderball]

If you sign 29 y.o. You pay bigger salaries and don’t expect a sell on fee, but you expect a certain level of quality and consistency and you expect instant impact to get you further faster, the pay off being Europe sooner. Europe = a bigger choice of player and more money to make you more sustainable, and importantly less risk of losing players to bigger teams (in Europe).

Its ok but it’s a gamble.

[PerryBarrPet]

13 minutes ago, thunderball said:

If you sign 29 y.o. You pay bigger salaries and don’t expect a sell on fee, but you expect a certain level of quality and consistency and you expect instant impact to get you further faster, the pay off being Europe sooner. Europe = a bigger choice of player and more money to make you more sustainable, and importantly less risk of losing players to bigger teams (in Europe).

Its ok but it’s a gamble.

It certainly is a gamble but what’s the alternative ? Low risk mediocrity for as long as the fans will fall for it? HDE comes to mind.

[thunderball]

4 minutes ago, PerryBarrPet said:

It certainly is a gamble but what’s the alternative ? Low risk mediocrity for as long as the fans will fall for it? HDE comes to mind.

I think we have to add consistency, quality and maturity as we have a decent age balance already. We are not in a position to take chances.

[PerryBarrPet]

1 minute ago, thunderball said:

I think we have to add consistency, quality and maturity as we have a decent age balance already. We are not in a position to take chances.

Yes we do need to add consistency etc. but I see this as part of the growth cycle outlined in your previous post. In fact these additions will help to push us forward. 

[I Make Pies]

It's not just FFP. We have the new £100m+ North Stand to budget for. I don't know whether that is included in the FFP calculation or not as they have changed the rules recently, but it is certainly a lot of money to find. At least we are not £760m in the red like Everton are with their new stadium.

I have a feeling these value signings are going to be the norm in the short term, but once these youngsters start coming through that should put us in a stronger position financially. It may take a few years though before the academy investment pays off.

[burchy]

3 minutes ago, I Make Pies said:

It's not just FFP. We have the new £100m+ North Stand to budget for. I don't know whether that is included in the FFP calculation or not as they have changed the rules recently, but it is certainly a lot of money to find. At least we are not £760m in the red like Everton are with their new stadium.

I have a feeling these value signings are going to be the norm in the short term, but once these youngsters start coming through that should put us in a stronger position financially. It may take a few years though before the academy investment pays off.

It already is with Cashwuemeka, granted we didn’t want to lose him but he still made the club £18m

[I Make Pies]

True, we did get a good fee and the number of decent youngsters coming through should increase with the added investment so maybe we can get closer to Man City's or Chelsea's youth factories in the coming years. Man City made approximately £55m this summer from selling academy prospects who aren't good enough for them.

[KMitch]

1 hour ago, Marka Ragnos said:

This is exactly what we did with Moreno. It wasn't broadcast on News at 10 but that's what did happen. No doubt he's not the only player Villa's scouts have been surveilling since November and December and perhaps before. 

Agreed.  Negotiating terms for players isn't like ordering something from Amazon and they show up on your doorstep a few days later...  We've been keeping tabs on targets and talking to agents since Emery arrived, I'm betting.  Moreno was probably the easiest to get over the line due to his age and others we've been pursuing (like possibly Joao Felix and Marcus Thuram) might be on their way to other teams instead.