villa89 Posted April 17 Share Posted April 17 1 hour ago, magnkarl said: If only we had a pre-Iraq Blair to go to the Yanks and get them to wake up like he did with Bosnia. It's up to EU\UK\Norway to keep Ukraine in this until the U.S election. The US will be forever stained for this. I don't think the republicans would listen to anyone from Europe telling them what to do when it comes to Ukraine. It has been up to EU/UK/Norway to help Ukraine but, In my opinion, a lot of those countries don't realise the seriousness of the situation and have been much too slow to take action. Putin was right about them, they are more concerned with getting re-elected than doing anything useful and they've learned nothing from two world wars in Europe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mandy Lifeboats Posted April 17 Share Posted April 17 4 hours ago, chrisp65 said: But why would a dozen of the richest most industrialised nations on the planet, faced with an enemy that is walking distance away, have got themselves so reliant on the U.S. for their defence? We haven't become reliant on the US for defence. France, UK, Poland, Italy, Spain and Portugal are all able to defend themselves. What we can't do is defend ourselves AND support Ukraine AND keep our economies going at the same level. Would the UK public vote for a party proposing a 1p increase in tax to arm Ukraine? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
magnkarl Posted April 17 Share Posted April 17 (edited) 1 hour ago, Mandy Lifeboats said: We haven't become reliant on the US for defence. France, UK, Poland, Italy, Spain and Portugal are all able to defend themselves. What we can't do is defend ourselves AND support Ukraine AND keep our economies going at the same level. Would the UK public vote for a party proposing a 1p increase in tax to arm Ukraine? France and Poland maybe. The US just briefed our MOD that our armed forces will take 10 years to get to where they're in good working order again. We've cut our tank, ship and airframe fleet since like forever. Spain and Portugal? Maybe.. The Nordics are capable too, especially with Finland and Sweden joining NATO and the money they're putting into their air fleet and armament. Edited April 17 by magnkarl Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mandy Lifeboats Posted April 17 Share Posted April 17 2 hours ago, magnkarl said: France and Poland maybe. The US just briefed our MOD that our armed forces will take 10 years to get to where they're in good working order again. We've cut our tank, ship and airframe fleet since like forever. Spain and Portugal? Who do you think is an actual threat to the UK (or Spain and Portugal)? Russia had Ukraine surrounded on 3 sides and had a bigger and better equipped army. Do you really think they could defeat Poland, Germany, Belgium, Netherlands and France and then stage an invasion of the UK? The UK is exceptionally well defended based upon our geographical position and the allies we have. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
magnkarl Posted April 17 Share Posted April 17 (edited) So Russia has found a way to strangle pro-Ukrainian channels on youtube by spamming the report buttons with bots. Reporting From Ukraine has been taken down, so has Arthur Rehi, Combat Veteran Reacts, Denys Davidov+++. The biggest tech company in the world can't spot a bot attack? Jesus Christ on a bike. I think both the EU and US need to seriously look into how autocratic regimes are playing big techs' algorithms. Edited April 17 by magnkarl Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Genie Posted April 17 Share Posted April 17 44 minutes ago, magnkarl said: So Russia has found a way to strangle pro-Ukrainian channels on youtube by spamming the report buttons with bots. Reporting From Ukraine has been taken down, so has Arthur Rehi, Combat Veteran Reacts, Denys Davidov+++. The biggest tech company in the world can't spot a bot attack? Jesus Christ on a bike. I think both the EU and US need to seriously look into how autocratic regimes are playing big techs' algorithms. I assume this is temporary and they’ll sort it out fairly quickly Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BleedClaretAndBlue Posted April 17 Share Posted April 17 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Panto_Villan Posted April 17 Share Posted April 17 Yeah, Johnson is saying he’ll be calling a vote on the aid package on Saturday - really hope he holds his nerve and Trump doesn’t start demanding the vote be cancelled. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
magnkarl Posted April 18 Share Posted April 18 (edited) 13 hours ago, Genie said: I assume this is temporary and they’ll sort it out fairly quickly Doesn't appear to be, none of the content creators can get through to google, they're being stonewalled by AI-chatbots. The Russian Dude (pro Ukraine Russian dissident) was also taken down. It appears that Google have just let it slip, a bit like twitter. It's now just a place where bad-faith regimes can play the rules to their advantage and try to force the conversation away from their own horrible conduct. Expect that the bots went into overdrive now that the US are about to give Ukraine massive capability. Yesterday Russia bombed the Chernihiv hospital, killing at least 10. The usual suspects who are extremely vocal on Palestine are deathly silent on Russia. Edited April 18 by magnkarl Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tinker Posted April 18 VT Supporter Share Posted April 18 What a mess, unbelievable that evil people can dictate their will on a nation and then hide it from the world with bots. Makes me wonder where its all going to end, it ain't looking pretty on multiple fronts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrisp65 Posted April 18 Share Posted April 18 2 minutes ago, tinker said: What a mess, unbelievable that evil people can dictate their will on a nation and then hide it from the world with bots. Makes me wonder where its all going to end, it ain't looking pretty on multiple fronts. It’s true, but it’s also the case that in reality the more things change the more they stay the same. History is always written by one side, the side that’s winning. Be it bots on twitter, pathe news, newspaper reporting, Shakespearean plays, or a tapestry. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villa89 Posted April 18 Share Posted April 18 10 minutes ago, tinker said: What a mess, unbelievable that evil people can dictate their will on a nation and then hide it from the world with bots. Makes me wonder where its all going to end, it ain't looking pretty on multiple fronts. What's unbelievable is that western countries, after two world wars, are just standing by and letting it happen. China must be rubbing their hands and already planning all the new land they can steal with little opposition. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tinker Posted April 18 VT Supporter Share Posted April 18 It's the political swing right in the west that's the real concern, pro putin politicians are gaining traction in the old Eastern block. It's points to conflict, I just hope we keep our aircraft carriers out of harms way because from what I have heard/read they are very vulnerable and very unreliable. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Genie Posted April 18 Share Posted April 18 If Trump gets back in it’ll set the Western world back about 30 years I fear. It shouldn’t even be a discussion, the fact it’s a real risk is a terrifying state of affairs. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjmooney Posted April 18 VT Supporter Share Posted April 18 1 hour ago, magnkarl said: The usual suspects who are extremely vocal on Palestine are deathly silent on Russia. We've always been told that Russia are The Bad Guys, so it's only what we expect from them. But we've also been told for years that Israel are The Good Guys. A hard habit to break, apparently. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
magnkarl Posted April 18 Share Posted April 18 (edited) 16 minutes ago, mjmooney said: We've always been told that Russia are The Bad Guys, so it's only what we expect from them. But we've also been told for years that Israel are The Good Guys. A hard habit to break, apparently. If only Ukraine got 1/10th of the reporting and mass frenzy that Gaza gets in the West the war would be over in summer last year.. But I guess that was Putin's plan all along when he invited Hamas to the Kremlin. Someone else took the spotlight and appear to be outplaying the West at their own propaganda-game. Edited April 18 by magnkarl Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villa89 Posted April 18 Share Posted April 18 Ukraine is already yesterday's news. Putin is playing the long game as the media cycle moves on quickly. Gaza will soon slip on to pages four and five too. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
magnkarl Posted April 19 Share Posted April 19 (edited) Patriot or FrankenSAM-200 on the prowl. Edited April 19 by magnkarl 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
magnkarl Posted April 20 Share Posted April 20 Sure all those people fell out of windows, really.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
magnkarl Posted April 20 Share Posted April 20 The Democrats are roasting the Republicans to hell in congress right now, it's about to go to a vote. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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