Russia and its “Special Operation” in Ukraine

[phily85]

8 minutes ago, sidcow said:

Look at him so obedient so well behaved

 

The spaniel looks good too

[chrisp65]

[Genie]

2 hours ago, chrisp65 said:

Can you believe she was our country’s leader?  

[phily85]

6 hours ago, Genie said:

Can you believe she was our country’s leader?  

And we laugh at Putin on horseback

[magnkarl]

13 hours ago, OutByEaster? said:

Why hasn't President Cosplay worn a flamin' suit?

It's not like this was a surprise, he's been on a long flight, he has hotels booked - has he heard about London's crime rate and decided he needed to go with camo?

It's a costume, it's ridiculous and it annoys me more than it should.

Grow up you knob, you're supposed to be running a country, not pulling clothes out of your dress up box to make you look like a soldier.

We don't want you hiding in the forests of Eastern Ukraine with a rifle and a load of grease on your face, your job is to face up to banks and governments and try to agree the deals that will finance the defence of your country, dress for the boardroom like any normal executive. 

Once an actor....

 

(Apologies for that rant, it really, really bugs me - which I know is inconsequential in the face of the actions of Russia and the defence of a nation, but still, it's just weird.)

 

.

 

Here you have Churchill in the U.S asking for aid against the Germans. Does it bug you? Churchill is wearing a romper suit, it isn't even camo, it's effectively a pajama. 

On Zelensky's part, I think he's trying to separate himself from Putin by doing it. The man is at war, he's constantly in briefings and working to help his country. Why should it matter if he wears the same outfit as Putin constantly does?

Also Zelensky actually is built like a brick house, he'd look like Arnold in a suit.

Edited February 9, 2023 by magnkarl

[blandy]

13 hours ago, OutByEaster? said:

Why hasn't President Cosplay worn a flamin' suit?

It's not like this was a surprise, he's been on a long flight, he has hotels booked - has he heard about London's crime rate and decided he needed to go with camo?

It's a costume, it's ridiculous and it annoys me more than it should.

Grow up you knob, you're supposed to be running a country, not pulling clothes out of your dress up box to make you look like a soldier.

We don't want you hiding in the forests of Eastern Ukraine with a rifle and a load of grease on your face, your job is to face up to banks and governments and try to agree the deals that will finance the defence of your country, dress for the boardroom like any normal executive. 

Once an actor....

 

(Apologies for that rant, it really, really bugs me - which I know is inconsequential in the face of the actions of Russia and the defence of a nation, but still, it's just weird.)

He’s spot on to be wearing his now familiar clothes. There’s a very real and valid reason. The whole purpose of his visit is to garner and bolster tangible support from the uk and the wider west. To that end every reminder and signal that his country is being subjected to bombardment, attack, atrocities, war, destruction and horror. So the visual signal to people watching on TV, the general public, us, that this is not a normal visit, but a visit from someone who lives in a bunker, apart from his family, is Russia’s most sought after target for killing or capture in the middle of a war is an important one to help his cause. And what use is a suit to someone, who after his brief visit is going back to his war bunker, going back to meeting his troops?

’kin ell

[sidcow]

Yeah, I think it's actually a genius move to be honest. Every single time he's seen it's a visual reminder that they are at war and fighting for their very existence by an invading vastly superior enemy. 

And taking it from the remote Television pictures to in your face live meetings and appearances actually hammers home that visual key. 

It's theatre but it's a brilliant piece of theatre with a deeply important message behind it.  It is very much not business as usual. 

Here he is in his 2020 visit before they were forced into a war they didn't want, signing a trade deal instead of begging for weapons.  Normal business. 

[Nigel]

1 hour ago, blandy said:

He’s spot on to be wearing his now familiar clothes. There’s a very real and valid reason. The whole purpose of his visit is to garner and bolster tangible support from the uk and the wider west. To that end every reminder and signal that his country is being subjected to bombardment, attack, atrocities, war, destruction and horror. So the visual signal to people watching on TV, the general public, us, that this is not a normal visit, but a visit from someone who lives in a bunker, apart from his family, is Russia’s most sought after target for killing or capture in the middle of a war is an important one to help his cause. And what use is a suit to someone, who after his brief visit is going back to his war bunker, going back to meeting his troops?

’kin ell

I'll add to that by pointing out how it would appear to his troops back in the Ukraine.

Its not a break or a jolly up, rather an enforced leave from the front, that he wants to return to ASAP.

[HKP90]

I don't see any problem with his visit being 'theatre'. It's PR, he knows it, we know it. That doesn't mean it's bad. Zelensky understands far better than Putin that this is an information war as much as a physical one. 

The more he highlights the conditions on the ground, the more pressure, he realises, will descend on the west to support him. 

If he rocks up like everything is normal, wearing a business suit from Saville Row, then he's projecting affluence and normalcy in the media. The situation in Ukraine is not like that, and that's what he has to convey in order to continue bolstering western aid. 

It's a dance he has to do.  

[HKP90]

1 hour ago, blandy said:

He’s spot on to be wearing his now familiar clothes. There’s a very real and valid reason. The whole purpose of his visit is to garner and bolster tangible support from the uk and the wider west. To that end every reminder and signal that his country is being subjected to bombardment, attack, atrocities, war, destruction and horror. So the visual signal to people watching on TV, the general public, us, that this is not a normal visit, but a visit from someone who lives in a bunker, apart from his family, is Russia’s most sought after target for killing or capture in the middle of a war is an important one to help his cause. And what use is a suit to someone, who after his brief visit is going back to his war bunker, going back to meeting his troops?

’kin ell

I just realised you said pretty much the same thing I did, but earlier, so sorry. 

[tonyh29]

...

Edited February 9, 2023 by tonyh29

[Arj Guy]

So week or so ago a video gets posted in this thread of Zelensky essentially calling for WW3 by asking NATO to bomb Russia and not a single person in here condemned it. It instead led to a conversation about how we can’t trust the subtitles or anything on the net. This despite the fact that a quick google search would reveal that he did indeed say it and his aids were forced to damage control. Sums up the state of this thread really

[The Fun Factory]

10 hours ago, Genie said:

Can you believe she was our country’s leader?  

She never was. She cosplayed being our leader for about a month before she was safely escorted out. 

[sidcow]

3 minutes ago, Arj Guy said:

So week or so ago a video gets posted in this thread of Zelensky essentially calling for WW3 by asking NATO to bomb Russia and not a single person in here condemned it. It instead led to a conversation about how we can’t trust the subtitles or anything on the net. This despite the fact that a quick google search would reveal that he did indeed say it and his aids were forced to damage control. Sums up the state of this thread really

I would think you are not being serious but looking at your past posts on this thread it's pretty much all pro Russia so I don't think your "quick google search" is going to be very reliable or terribly well researched.  Most people seem to think it's a pretty obvious fake.

[bickster]

8 minutes ago, Arj Guy said:

So week or so ago a video gets posted in this thread of Zelensky essentially calling for WW3 by asking NATO to bomb Russia and not a single person in here condemned it. It instead led to a conversation about how we can’t trust the subtitles or anything on the net. This despite the fact that a quick google search would reveal that he did indeed say it and his aids were forced to damage control. Sums up the state of this thread really

Pathetic attempt 1/10 must try harder

[NoelVilla]

and NATO bombing Russia will never lead to WW3 anyway. No one is joining Russia in that fight.

[sidcow]

3 minutes ago, NoelVilla said:

and NATO bombing Russia will never lead to WW3 anyway. No one is joining Russia in that fight.

[avfc1982am]

26 minutes ago, Arj Guy said:

So week or so ago a video gets posted in this thread of Zelensky essentially calling for WW3 by asking NATO to bomb Russia and not a single person in here condemned it. It instead led to a conversation about how we can’t trust the subtitles or anything on the net. This despite the fact that a quick google search would reveal that he did indeed say it and his aids were forced to damage control. Sums up the state of this thread really

Did you come on here condemning his actions or debate it? Or are you just coming on here talking shit because others aren't posting what you want to read? I think you need to look at the state of yourself and your stupid comments rather than the state of the thread. The thread you've contributed very little too. 

There is nothing stopping anyone on VT posting if they want to contribute, but to contribute FA and then moan that others aren't discussing certain topics or view points is laughable. 

[avfc1982am]

Ukraine war: Elon Musk's SpaceX firm bars Kyiv from using Starlink tech for drone control - BBC News

SpaceX has limited Ukraine's ability to use its satellite internet service for military purposes - after reports that Kyiv has used it to control drones.

Early in the war, Ukraine was given thousands of SpaceX Starlink dishes - which connect to satellites and help people stay connected to the internet.

But it is also said to have used the tech to target Russian positions with drones - which SpaceX says goes against the service agreement.

Ukraine is yet to comment on the move.

The Starlink technology was "never meant to be weaponised," SpaceX president Gwynne Shotwell said at an event in Washington DC on Wednesday.

She made reference to Ukraine's alleged use of Starlink to control drones, and stressed that the equipment had been provided for humanitarian use.

Unmanned aircraft have played an important role in the war, having been used by Kyiv to search out Russian troops, drop bombs and counter Moscow's own drone attacks.

Russia has also been accused of attempting to jam Starlink signals by SpaceX founder Elon Musk.

Ms Shotwell confirmed that it was acceptable for the Ukrainian military for deploy Starlink technology "for comms", but said her intent was "never to have them use it for offensive purposes".

She said the company had taken steps to "limit" the abilities of the Ukrainian armed forces to use Starlink in an offensive way - without giving further details.

The executive said she could not answer a question on whether these efforts were the cause of outages to the Starlink service late last year.

After invading its neighbour in February last year, Russia quickly looked to close down local internet services and to block social media.

The first Starlink dishes - or terminals - were provided to Ukraine soon after, in an effort to ensure people stayed connected.

They work by connecting to satellites in low-Earth orbit.

As well as the terminals sent directly by the company itself, others have been funded by the foreign governments.

In October, Mr Musk signalled that he could not continue funding Starlink in Ukraine, before rapidly reversing his position.

In a tweet last week, the billionaire again addressed the issue and acknowledged that there was a dilemma at work.

"SpaceX Starlink has become the connectivity backbone of Ukraine all the way up to the front lines. This is the damned if you do part," he wrote.

"However, we are not allowing Starlink to be used for long-range drone strikes. This is the damned if you don't part."

[blandy]

9 minutes ago, avfc1982am said:

Did you come on here condemning his actions or debate it? Or are you just coming on here talking shit because others aren't posting what you want to read? I think you need to look at the state of yourself and your stupid comments rather than the state of the thread. The thread you've contributed very little too. 

There is nothing stopping anyone on VT posting if they want to contribute, but to contribute FA and then moan that others aren't discussing certain topics or view points is laughable. 

I’ll defend @Arj Guyhere, to an extent. Because that video on social media is a good example to use. There are thousands and thousands of clips out there of stuff related to this war. Unless someone speaks Ukrainian, it’s nigh on impossible to tell for yourself if it’s real or faked. So we use the internet to try to find out, or we come across something that points us one way or another. Which source we trust depends on all kinds of factors, including our own personal beliefs and biases. Even trusted outlets get stuff wrong, sometimes. So we end up with an informed, but potentially mistaken understanding of something based on a tiny clip and some Googling. And then we might come on here with that “understanding” and see someone else who has written down their different understanding and see theirs is “wrong”. And then if we are so inclined, we don’t discuss why, we just argue and get no further than thinking worse of each other for it.  If people actually explain why they say what they do on here, we could look at the reasoning and the “research” sources and maybe sometimes we’d end up better informed. Of courses all the fakes out there are intended to take advantage of our not doing that to gain an advantage in the court of public opinion and thus influence the people making decisions on tanks and planes and sanctions and support and the rest of it.