Dave J Posted August 23, 2018 Share Posted August 23, 2018 8 hours ago, Stevo985 said: You’d probably be thinking “there’s no way I’d be playing as well at DM as that guy” Whelan is a good player. How he’s got this reputation of being crap amongst some of our fans is baffling. Think your getting a tad mixed up here - That Whelan fella can of course do a limited task to the best of his ability and deserves some credit in doing so - but I can't see how this elevates him into the Good player category ? thats my view anyhow for what it's worth Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Demitri_C Posted August 23, 2018 Author Share Posted August 23, 2018 1 hour ago, KSV said: I dont think Mile was that bad.. one bad header that led to a chance but other than that i thought he did ok....... Chester looked shaky imo. I dont mind Mile as an emergency fill in.. but we cant possibly be planning on using him there all season. I am guessing Bruce sees him as one of the few in the squad that can dominate in the air (which he does).. just needs to tidy his game... may need time to adjust to the new position so he may still with him. My bigger concern is the fullback situation. I would like a proper left back and right back for once. Targett on loan and De Laet (why is he being snubbed after being one of the most impressive in pre season). Credit where credit is due though and i thought we out passed and outplayed Brentford. Better passing %..more shots on goal.. more possession.. better chances etc. Our main issue is.. we always cross.. ( 46 v 16 granted we had more possession but only 10 more long balls than them) we need to play through the middle more.. when we did that and found Kodjia/Grealish/McGinn combined.. we looked dangerous. Mate he was bad, he struggles with the passing aspect, the thing is when he makes mistakes like this in cm you have two cbs to cover you. when he is at cb it causes us all kinds of problems. Bruce needs to start playing elmo at rb and move axel to cb alongside chester. Jedinak can do a job as a sub for the last 10-15. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sne Posted August 23, 2018 Share Posted August 23, 2018 9 hours ago, LakotaDakota said: Most attacking performance of the season so far against a team many were likening to Barcelona & saying we would be torn to pieces. Averaging 2 points per game & scoring more than 2 goals per game, Undefeated & still gets slaughtered... Bunch of miserable cnuts Anyone likening Brentford to Barcelona has guaranteed never seen Barcelona play. Or alternatively never seen Brentford play They might be more like Barcelona than say "The crazy gang " Wimbledon side, but that's about it. Obviously I'ts wrong to judge a team from 1 performance but they looked like any given lower league side. Being able to string together 2 passes once in a while doesn't make you Barcelona. Anyway, it was an encouraging performance from us apart from the self made defensive mess. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stevo985 Posted August 23, 2018 VT Supporter Share Posted August 23, 2018 1 hour ago, Dave J said: Think your getting a tad mixed up here - That Whelan fella can of course do a limited task to the best of his ability and deserves some credit in doing so - but I can't see how this elevates him into the Good player category ? thats my view anyhow for what it's worth Not mixed up. But thanks for your input as always. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stevo985 Posted August 23, 2018 VT Supporter Share Posted August 23, 2018 2 hours ago, Kiwivillan said: Last 9 league games Whelan has started 9 undefeated. 7 wins 2 draws 20 goals for 6 against 5 clean sheets. 1 game was 45 mins 1 x 60 the rest 80-90. Can we put to bed the idea Thor is a better holding mid. Whelan is the best we have Yep. I think it's one of these signings where he started off badly, and that has cemented people's opinion of him. Some people can't look beyond their initial impression of the guy. He is probably our best DM. I think Jedinak on his day is better, but Whelan is more consistent. 94% passing accuracy as well last night. 3 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vive_La_Villa Posted August 23, 2018 Share Posted August 23, 2018 I wonder if Steve Bruce and our coaching staff who see Axel in training day in day out are the right people to judge whether he could do a better job than Jedinak at the back. Or do you reckon the villatalk faithful that have seen him play their against Yeovil know better? But on a serious note I’m not confident with Jedinak at the back and Axel on the right.. But calls to play Axel at the back are purely based on wishful thinking that he will be better then Jed. ive seen nothing in his defending to suggest he would be. I didn’t even think Jed was that bad yesterday. anyway the answer is a new centre half and a new left back. Anything else will be makeshift and will cost us promotion. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vive_La_Villa Posted August 23, 2018 Share Posted August 23, 2018 8 minutes ago, Stevo985 said: Yep. I think it's one of these signings where he started off badly, and that has cemented people's opinion of him. Some people can't look beyond their initial impression of the guy. He is probably our best DM. I think Jedinak on his day is better, but Whelan is more consistent. 94% passing accuracy as well last night. Whelans ok. He can do a job he just hasn’t got the legs to play week in week out. That’s what was happening last season and he struggled for it. At that point he became a scapegoat to some and there’s no going back from that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stevo985 Posted August 23, 2018 VT Supporter Share Posted August 23, 2018 3 minutes ago, Vive_La_Villa said: I wonder if Steve Bruce and our coaching staff who see Axel in training day in day out are the right people to judge whether he could do a better job than Jedinak at the back. Or do you reckon the villatalk faithful that have seen him play their against Yeovil know better? But on a serious note I’m not confident with Jedinak at the back and Axel on the right.. But calls to play Axel at the back are purely based on wishful thinking that he will be better then Jed. ive seen nothing in his defending to suggest he would be. I didn’t even think Jed was that bad yesterday.. This all day long. It's just the classic "we don't know if he's any good so we'll just assume he's better than what's there" Tuanzebe has shown nothing to suggest he's ready to be our first choice CB. Jedinak isn' good enough either, but I'd trust him over Tuanzebe every day of the week. Axel has potential but he's not there yet by a long shot. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sne Posted August 23, 2018 Share Posted August 23, 2018 3 minutes ago, Vive_La_Villa said: I wonder if Steve Bruce and our coaching staff who see Axel in training day in day out are the right people to judge whether he could do a better job than Jedinak at the back. Or do you reckon the villatalk faithful that have seen him play their against Yeovil know better? But on a serious note I’m not confident with Jedinak at the back and Axel on the right.. But calls to play Axel at the back are purely based on wishful thinking that he will be better then Jed. ive seen nothing in his defending to suggest he would be. I didn’t even think Jed was that bad yesterday. anyway the answer is a new centre half and a new left back. Anything else will be makeshift and will cost us promotion. Wonder why those hacks at Man U see him as a CB and not a RB? But more importantly wonder why we loaned him at all? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stevo985 Posted August 23, 2018 VT Supporter Share Posted August 23, 2018 1 minute ago, Vive_La_Villa said: Whelans ok. He can do a job he just hasn’t got the legs to play week in week out. That’s what was happening last season and he struggled for it. At that point he became a scapegoat to some and there’s no going back from that. I'm not sure I agree. I mean I do agree that he can't play every game. But he didn't last season. He had a bad start to the season and he had a couple of bad games around xmas if I remember correctly. But other than that he was rotated with Jedinak and did well pretty much every time he played. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keyblade Posted August 23, 2018 Share Posted August 23, 2018 Steve makes it hard for himself. He's clearly capable of getting the team to play like that but is too cautious more often than not. If we played like this most weeks I'm sure the fans would he fully onside. This is the kind of football that wins promotion. We'd have a packed Villa Park every time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vive_La_Villa Posted August 23, 2018 Share Posted August 23, 2018 Just now, Stevo985 said: I'm not sure I agree. I mean I do agree that he can't play every game. But he didn't last season. He had a bad start to the season and he had a couple of bad games around xmas if I remember correctly. But other than that he was rotated with Jedinak and did well pretty much every time he played. I remember a period when jed was injured and he played quite a few games in a row. This was in 2017. That’s when high profile errors started to sneak in to his game. He wasn’t awful like some make out. Just not quite at it. My memory is hazy though. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vive_La_Villa Posted August 23, 2018 Share Posted August 23, 2018 3 minutes ago, sne said: Wonder why those hacks at Man U see him as a CB and not a RB? But more importantly wonder why we loaned him at all? Those are two different questions. Probably loaned him for his versatility. Also he probably is meant to be a centre back. But that doesn’t mean he is ready to start there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sne Posted August 23, 2018 Share Posted August 23, 2018 Just now, Vive_La_Villa said: Those are two different questions. Probably loaned him for his versatility. Also he probably is meant to be a centre back. But that doesn’t mean he is ready to start there. If the loan is for his and Man U's long term benefit and nothing more I'd say we cancel it. We have much more pressing needs than a utility RB who isn't trusted to play in his natural position. Bring in Kalas or someone who can actually play where he is needed. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vive_La_Villa Posted August 23, 2018 Share Posted August 23, 2018 2 minutes ago, Keyblade said: Steve makes it hard for himself. He's clearly capable of getting the team to play like that but is too cautious more often than not. If we played like this most weeks I'm sure the fans would he fully onside. This is the kind of football that wins promotion. We'd have a packed Villa Park every time. I think the players have to also take responsibility. There is no way Bruce would set them up at home to sit back and not press players. It makes no sense. At times we see the players just not at it. Slow, predictable and sloppy. Bruce doesn’t make them play like that. It must be as frustrating for him as it is for us. He needs to try and get the best out of them every game. But it’s not just a tactical issue in my opinion. I’m not a fan of Bruce but the way some fans go on about him you’d think he is controlling the team with a joypad. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaveAV1 Posted August 23, 2018 Share Posted August 23, 2018 1 hour ago, Demitri_C said: Mate he was bad, he struggles with the passing aspect, the thing is when he makes mistakes like this in cm you have two cbs to cover you. when he is at cb it causes us all kinds of problems. Bruce needs to start playing elmo at rb and move axel to cb alongside chester. Jedinak can do a job as a sub for the last 10-15. Agreed, except for the last sentence. I’m not sure I want a dodgy cb for the last 10-15 minutes when we’re under the cosh. If anything that’s the time to bring him on as a replacement/extra defensive cm. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vive_La_Villa Posted August 23, 2018 Share Posted August 23, 2018 1 minute ago, sne said: If the loan is for his and Man U's long term benefit and nothing more I'd say we cancel it. We have much more pressing needs than a utility RB who isn't trusted to play in his natural position. Bring in Kalas or someone who can actually play where he is needed. I don’t think it is though. I think he has been bought in as a squad player but has found himself playing every game because our business isn’t done yet and we are light in key positions. This has led to a lot of rotation. By the end of next week I expect him to be on the bench and on that basis he is a very good squad player to have. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stevo985 Posted August 23, 2018 VT Supporter Share Posted August 23, 2018 1 minute ago, Vive_La_Villa said: I remember a period when jed was injured and he played quite a few games in a row. This was in 2017. That’s when high profile errors started to sneak in to his game. He wasn’t awful like some make out. Just not quite at it. My memory is hazy though. YEah that was probably around christmas so you might be right there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JuanCrablo24 Posted August 23, 2018 Share Posted August 23, 2018 (edited) I think our defense will get better given time. Playing people out of position doesn’t help, but I think the main issue was spending all pre season experimenting with 3 at the back, only to revert back to a traditional 4 at the back once the season started. It has put us weeks behind in terms of preparation and being a solid defensive unit. Edited August 23, 2018 by JuanCrablo24 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRO Posted August 23, 2018 Share Posted August 23, 2018 (edited) 11 hours ago, Dick said: Deserved to win that. Hard to do so when the ref is against you. No fault on Bruce, other than a few mistakes (IMO). They were bloody lucky. They were bloody quick in everything they do....even in thought...so proactive. quite impressed with them. However, we would have won that bar poor defending. Edited August 23, 2018 by TRO Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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