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Misguided, Kante is far more mobile than Whelan, the comparisons are ridiculous.

Whelan, if I was going to compare him to anyone I would put him as a bit of a mash up of Busquets' awareness, Edgar David's tenacity, Pirlo's calmness on the ball and a young Roy Keane's ability to break through the lines.

 

 

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3 hours ago, omariqy said:

For 65 Minutes yesterday I saw what I wanted from Bruce all along. Yesterday proved that we have the players to play that kind of football against the better teams. I don't expect it every week but even if we played it in half of our games across the season I think we would be 'there or thereabouts' in terms of promotion. Bruce mentioned that he has been working on the team to be more expansive and it showed. Once we get the new wingers in we can hopefully create more chances.

I don't mind players out of position but it is so obvious that Jedi should not play CB that it needs to be changed. I thought Axel did really well at RB bar his missed header against Watkins. 

I agree 100%. I think McGinn has contributed to this, at least yesterday Bruce trusted him and Whelan in midfield and could give Jack a more free role. It makes much of a difference to have the third midfielder in front of the mid two, instead of having a holding midfielder behind the mid two. Except Jedi in defence, the only real issue I had with yesterday's set up was that Elmo played as the wide forward. I think the wingers/wide forwards in this formation must be attacking players/goal scorers, otherwise too much relies on the sole forward. Hopefully Bolasie or El Gahzi will fill that role. 

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10 hours ago, vreitti said:

I thought they were quite shit tbh. I just don't see what all the fuss is about. Perhaps I'm blind, or it might be that seeing us actually resemble a football team for once, may have clouded my perception on the night. We indeed gifted them the goals due to poor defending as you say. 

Personally I don't think that was a true reflection of Brentford - I have seen them play much much better than this.

was this down to us ? or an off day at the office who knows- fair result and I don't think we particularly learned too much from this game. The Jedi - is the force with debate aside ?

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What i'm baffled about is how so many blames the ref for why we didn't win that game.

I mean really? We need the ref to be on our side to win a home game against Brentford? How far we have fallen as a club, truly sad.

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4 minutes ago, villalad21 said:

What i'm baffled about is how so many blames the ref for why we didn't win that game.

I mean really? We need the ref to be on our side to win a home game against Brentford? How far we have fallen as a club, truly sad.

No. We don't NEED the ref. We showed that we could have won that game easily, but not taking our chances and defensive errors cost us.

But when the ref misses an obvious red card and the man who should have been sent off scores both goals for the opposition, then obviously the ref has influenced the outcome of the match.

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12 hours ago, Stevo985 said:

Yep.

I think it's one of these signings where he started off badly, and that has cemented people's opinion of him. Some people can't look beyond their initial impression of the guy.

He is probably our best DM. I think Jedinak on his day is better, but Whelan is more consistent.

94% passing accuracy as well last night.

Definitely a better option than Jedinak imo.

Regarding the bolded bit, and sorry for going OT, i fear this may also be the case with goalkeeper.

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After nearly 2 years in charge Bruce seems to have completely changed his tune after the Brentford game. Now he is saying he wants to play exciting football and that he feels energy and pace are what's needed. Has he had an epiphany or do you think the new owners have told him that we need to be more entertaining? ?????

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14 minutes ago, Made In Aston said:

After nearly 2 years in charge Bruce seems to have completely changed his tune after the Brentford game. Now he is saying he wants to play exciting football and that he feels energy and pace are what's needed. Has he had an epiphany or do you think the new owners have told him that we need to be more entertaining? ?????

We've played like that before. We just struggle to do it consistently. I don't think that Bruce coaches us to play poorly. 

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10 minutes ago, PatrickCousens said:

We've played like that before. We just struggle to do it consistently. I don't think that Bruce coaches us to play poorly. 

Indeed. I am not sure where this worldview comes from that Bruce sits around all day plotting how to make us lose and play badly. I mean he may get it wrong a lot but he very clearly wants us to play well and wants us to win.

 

Incidentally I am looking forward to the cries of "he is flailing" when he plays 3 at the back later in the season , just like he told us he was going to during pre season.

 

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36 minutes ago, Made In Aston said:

After nearly 2 years in charge Bruce seems to have completely changed his tune after the Brentford game. Now he is saying he wants to play exciting football and that he feels energy and pace are what's needed. Has he had an epiphany or do you think the new owners have told him that we need to be more entertaining? ?????

He might have read my post in the Johnny Kodja thread about playing with more fluency to suit Kodja's game.  :D

In all seriousness it was a refreshing change to see despite the result and hopefully Brucie has turned a corner whether by choice or by force, it's a welcomed change either way.  

RIP Bruceball.

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4 minutes ago, AvfcRigo82 said:

He might have read my post in the Johnny Kodja thread about playing with more fluency to suit Kodja's game.  :D

In all seriousness it was a refreshing change to see despite the result and hopefully Brucie has turned a corner whether by choice or by force, it's a welcomed change either way.  

RIP Bruceball.

One swallow and all that.....I’m really not convinced that this type of performance will become the new norm. Bruce, IMO, is carrying out the wishes of NSWE by trying to implement a totally different style of play. This is not his normal philosophy and I cannot agree that he has been trying this since last October!!! Bruce prefers a more cautious approach: always has, always will and he has quickly said after the game that this new style leaves us more open at the back.....I can almost hear his inner voice crying at the thought. 

Bruce is going against his natural game only to satisfy the requirements of the new owners. Bruce wound never have signed El Ghazi....prior to the match last night he called him ‘another body to use’ before being more effusive with his praise after the game. I know which comments were more close to his actual thoughts.....

Still needs to go, for me. This faux attacking intent doesn’t wash with me I’m afraid. He has failed in his time here in terms of the principal objective of any manager - results. He must be replaced for the club to progress and develop a real identity. 

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58 minutes ago, PatrickCousens said:

We've played like that before. We just struggle to do it consistently. I don't think that Bruce coaches us to play poorly. 

Yeah, I hear it's the players.

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1 hour ago, villalad21 said:

What i'm baffled about is how so many blames the ref for why we didn't win that game.

I mean really? We need the ref to be on our side to win a home game against Brentford? How far we have fallen as a club, truly sad.

You are baffled ?

You are not familiar with football fans ( and Managers, and Players, and Pundits, and ex- refs) blaming Refs for why they didn’t win a game ?

Im baffled !

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1 hour ago, Made In Aston said:

After nearly 2 years in charge Bruce seems to have completely changed his tune after the Brentford game. Now he is saying he wants to play exciting football and that he feels energy and pace are what's needed. Has he had an epiphany or do you think the new owners have told him that we need to be more entertaining? ?????

He said at the start of the season he wanted more energy and pace.

He said in a September last season he wanted less caution and for the players to assert themselves much more ( his reasoning being there was no longer the need for the caution he’d introduced to prevent - in his view - free fall.

His comments last September corresponded to a change in approach, and his comments this season have done the same.

If the new owners have told him anything about how to play they should clear off - as I’m sure he would’ve done had they done so !

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42 minutes ago, terrytini said:

He said at the start of the season he wanted more energy and pace.

He said in a September last season he wanted less caution and for the players to assert themselves much more ( his reasoning being there was no longer the need for the caution he’d introduced to prevent - in his view - free fall.

His comments last September corresponded to a change in approach, and his comments this season have done the same.

If the new owners have told him anything about how to play they should clear off - as I’m sure he would’ve done had they done so !

So you do t think it’s the manager’s job to carry out the wishes of the owners? Steve Bruce has referenced the owners desires in various interviews recently. He has openly said that they want to go for younger players. Don’t misunderstand me, I don’t think they are telling him who to pick and overseeing training, but they are within their rights to give a broad overview of what they’d like to achieve. 

I’m not saying they are the reason we played the way we did on Wednesday, in fact I’m happy to give Bruce the credit for that. I think he correctly identified that we have weaknesses at the back which Brentford were very capable of exploiting and decided that attack was the best form of defence. Long may that continue, although we do need in my opinion, at least one cb and a left back. 

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2 hours ago, PatrickCousens said:

We've played like that before. We just struggle to do it consistently. I don't think that Bruce coaches us to play poorly. 

While I am Long term Bruce out.  I saw a different flow on Tuesday.  I hope it continues.   The notion that he was deliberately tried to coach us to play badly is absurd on its face.  Have you seen anyone here claim that?  Or is this just a baseless and gratuitous slam at those who haven’t been pleased with our play?

no need to answer, we can discuss Bruce and the match.  Why do you think it took Bruce nearly 2 years working for us to play like this, that last night we suddenly did?   (Those were his words “that we have been trying to play this way for 2 years.”)

i was glad to see it, but don’t fully understand why the sudden and clear change on the field.  Any theories?

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18 minutes ago, srsmithusa said:

While I am Long term Bruce out.  I saw a different flow on Tuesday.  I hope it continues.   The notion that he was deliberately tried to coach us to play badly is absurd on its face.  Have you seen anyone here claim that?  Or is this just a baseless and gratuitous slam at those who haven’t been pleased with our play?

no need to answer, we can discuss Bruce and the match.  Why do you think it took Bruce nearly 2 years working for us to play like this, that last night we suddenly did?   (Those were his words “that we have been trying to play this way for 2 years.”)

i was glad to see it, but don’t fully understand why the sudden and clear change on the field.  Any theories?

I think he has been made aware of the amount of criticism of our play.

I think we all need to be equally aware of the possible trade off....we seem to be conceding goals too.....early days, we will have to see.

We did attack more on Wed, but I am not sure the attack is good enough, to ignore defence....not yet anyway.

It would be nice to do both.....but winning is the objective.

Its not boring games or exciting games that will get us up.....its wins and points.

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15 hours ago, omariqy said:

For 65 Minutes yesterday I saw what I wanted from Bruce all along. Yesterday proved that we have the players to play that kind of football against the better teams. I don't expect it every week but even if we played it in half of our games across the season I think we would be 'there or thereabouts' in terms of promotion. Bruce mentioned that he has been working on the team to be more expansive and it showed. Once we get the new wingers in we can hopefully create more chances.

I don't mind players out of position but it is so obvious that Jedi should not play CB that it needs to be changed. I thought Axel did really well at RB bar his missed header against Watkins. 

You might not expect us to play that way every week, but there's no harm in us attempting to play that way every week.

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1 hour ago, TRO said:

I think he has been made aware of the amount of criticism of our play.

I think we all need to be equally aware of the possible trade off....we seem to be conceding goals too.....early days, we will have to see.

We did attack more on Wed, but I am not sure the attack is good enough, to ignore defence....not yet anyway.

It would be nice to do both.....but winning is the objective.

Its not boring games or exciting games that will get us up.....its wins and points.

We know it's wins and points that will get us up, but has we found to our cost last season, when the emphasis is on caution we allow the opposition to impose themselves. Fortune favours the brave, we're the biggest club in the league, we shouldn't be fearful of any team. You can play on the front foot without neglecting the defence. We need to keep the momentum of Wednesday night, being too cautious  isn't going to help us do that.

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11 hours ago, villalad21 said:

What i'm baffled about is how so many blames the ref for why we didn't win that game.

I mean really? We need the ref to be on our side to win a home game against Brentford? How far we have fallen as a club, truly sad.

It's always the ref's fault when we don't win. You shouldn't be baffled, amused, maybe, but never baffled.

Edited by sheepyvillian

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