Steve Bruce

[Guest av1]

18 hours ago, BOF said:

Yep, agreed.  And to bring that point and something @OutByEaster? has mentioned elsewhere together for a moment, I think one player and one stroke of (mis-)fortune has been the key to it all.  That player is Keinan Davis.  Not his ability, per se (although he has plenty of that), but the style of forward that he is.  His ability to play with his back to goal, knock a ball down and bring the midfield into the game has singularly transformed this team from being a disjointed front 6 that had a good (but over-worked) defence, into what is now a cohesive attacking force where the quality and goals that we've had in midfield is allowed to do its thing.

We knew the raw materials were there and we couldn't quite figure out how all that quality could be on the same pitch and be 'performing' the way they were early on.  But Davis was a key piece to that jigsaw.

The stroke of luck was that Davis got into the side through someone else's injury, but that is not a stick you can beat Bruce with because history is littered with examples of players seizing their opportunity through someone else's misfortune (Harry Kane says 'Hi').  In fact it's often the best way for a junior to break through.

Couldn't agree more, thats why i think we need to be careful with the lad. We have no one else that can perform the sort of role Davis does, and without sounding like I'm bashing Bruce here, we just don't have natural link between midfield and attack. 

The only other option i guess (once Green and Grealish are fit to provide options on the flank) is Snodgrass at 10. 

[Straggler]

13 hours ago, Rugeley Villa said:

You should support the team whether it's doing well or not. A club like us should never have a decrease in away support because we are having a bad season. Leeds are a great example of staying loyal on the road. As sad as it sounds I was lay in bed with a big stonker last night, not because I was getting some, but because I was excited about the villa for once. I lay there wondering whether Steve was doing the same because it's been a while since things have been going his way. I genuinely want him to be the man who takes us back up. Long way to go yet though. 

Hang on hang on a minute. I know there is a passionate debate going in here, but how do we just skate past this statement? You had a big "stonker" on, you actually thought of Steve Bruce in the same state of arousal and that contributes positively to your happy feelings? I have heard some wild accusations leveled at Bruce but this is a first for me.

I always considered him more a a way of preventing said stonkers but whatever works for you dude. 

[GarethRDR]

44 minutes ago, Ingram85 said:

I'm so indifferent at the moment that its more of a no mans land type deal.

For me, it's a No Man's Sky deal; came in with such grand promise, was largely shite with only fleeting moments of joy but after a lot of time and fiddling, you can at least finally start to see the game coming together.

[sheepyvillian]

12 hours ago, DaveAV1 said:

It seems incredible to me that in just 3 games Steve Bruce has managed to erase the history of the 40 odd previous games. People were so keen to wait and see what happens, but as soon as we experience a small winning streak he is smugly hailed as the messiah. This run of form is now considered to be the way it was all planned and it is bound to continue. I'm afraid that just isn't realistic. Obviously we all hope that the run continues and we get promoted, but there is a bloody long way to go.

SB had longer winning streaks last season and we finished 13th. The encouraging thing is that we are actually playing better football and that encourages me, but only to a level of slight optimism, rather than planning a promotion party. I'm not trying to have a dig, anymore than saying I haven't enjoyed the turn round in style and results, but it will probably be May before we will really know which division we will be playing in next season.

Tell me you put your hard hat on , Dave ?  Nothing like the smell of " Napalm ",in the morning .  

[sheepyvillian]

19 hours ago, BOF said:

Yep, agreed.  And to bring that point and something @OutByEaster? has mentioned elsewhere together for a moment, I think one player and one stroke of (mis-)fortune has been the key to it all.  That player is Keinan Davis.  Not his ability, per se (although he has plenty of that), but the style of forward that he is.  His ability to play with his back to goal, knock a ball down and bring the midfield into the game has singularly transformed this team from being a disjointed front 6 that had a good (but over-worked) defence, into what is now a cohesive attacking force where the quality and goals that we've had in midfield is allowed to do its thing.

We knew the raw materials were there and we couldn't quite figure out how all that quality could be on the same pitch and be 'performing' the way they were early on.  But Davis was a key piece to that jigsaw.

The stroke of luck was that Davis got into the side through someone else's injury, but that is not a stick you can beat Bruce with because history is littered with examples of players seizing their opportunity through someone else's misfortune (Harry Kane says 'Hi').  In fact it's often the best way for a junior to break through.

On point ,great post .

[mattjpa]

18 hours ago, DCJonah said:

Well again, it's you picking a sample of form and calling it promotion form. Funny how promotion form links with a points total and a league position thats isn't in promotion places and an overall points average that won't lead to promotion. But yeah its promotion form. 

So blues win a few games and they're in title winning form and we should be worried about them?

We are in good form, I hope that form leads to promotion winning form. When it does I'll happily acknowledge it. 

 

Im not picking an isolated random period of form though, im picking our last 6 games which now reads won 4 draw 2 and bears much more semblance than the results that preceded it when referring to form. This points per game return extrapolated over a season would see us promoted. If Blues win 6 in a row they are indeed in title winning form, it doesn't mean they will win the title as they more than likely wouldn't be able to maintain it. 

Dont want to sound pedantic but you picked up on my terminology originally which I think is correct. Im talking about form, you are talking about points return so far this season which I agree is not going to get us promoted. Im an optimist when it comes to the Villa but Im living in hope that 4 promotions give SB enough experience to be able to manage a forward momentum (something he hasnt managed up to now ill conceed)

[osmark86]

Bruce admitting that we've been too defensive and our current upswing in form is making me a lot more optimistic than a couple of weeks ago. I think it's fair to still be on the fence about Bruce because of what we have seen up until now, but I think it's equally fair to have faith in him being able to pull off promotion.

I think a lot of us are so used to things not going our way that it could be acting as a filter of pessimism and rightly so. We've debated so much about future scenarios and what decisions should have been taken and what decisions shouldn't have out of frustration.

I'm at a point where I'm just happy to see us win for a change and look like true contenders. Definitely still cautiously optimistic, but at least very pleased to see some sort of signs that we're turning that goddam corner. I mean, it's bound to happen at some point in time (surely) so why not now? Please make it be now Bruce, no more misery

[romavillan]

We'll look like contenders if we play consistently like we did at times against Burton, and manage to be less generous with the ball. 

Deffo happy, so happy to see goals and 3 points happening so much lately, and even if we haven't turned the corner yet then maybe we can see it from here

[TRO]

8 hours ago, DaveAV1 said:

Some people have clearly got carried away, but that's their prerogative. I think you need to reread some of my post TRO, I say I have enjoyed the turn around. Who wouldn't? My fear is that it lacks consistency, but hopefully my fears are unfounded .

maybe there was 2 bits in it?or i miss read it....anyway who cares.....glad your enjoying it.

No one can be sure of future games, we just all..... fans, players, manager have to keep our nerve and drive the thing on.....It won't all be rosey.

Its natural to look over our shoulder a tad, but we need to try and move on and leave the past behind and look forward to the future.

But I totally agree with your sentiment of not getting carried away, its what possibly breeds banana skins....i think it is more powerful to remain gracious too when we get emphatic wins.

Bring it on.

 

[TRO]

 

 

 

 

This is how I see our current situation.

Steve Bruce.....I believe ,what he said ....that he had to set us up to stop the rot, during that time.... 40 odd games many faces have changed in the players and in order to get some balance in the side it has taken time...He ( SB) has had to build his confidence in the players to be able to trust them to carry out his instructions, gleaned from Bodymoor Heath.

I think going in to this season, his team was still lacking balance for various reasons......These are the players i think have made a difference.

Johnstone

He has gradually improved the time he has been with us and is still improving on an incremental basis.......It takes time to work on every aspect of your game, but its clear he has been doing that gradually.

looking a fine keeper.

Terry

Despite his years, which affects his mobility, his reading of the game and situations is invaluable to us....He gives composure to the back four and offers moral support.....calming influence and presence.

Elmohamady

Like all the summer recruits took time to settle.....but now, is adding value to the team....His crosses are meaningful and accurate, his ability to go up for headers and challenge adds value to the business of holding ground and gaining control.

Whelan

Still settling and his passes need to be worked on, has been getting caught a bit in possession, but he breaks up play and disrupts the oppositions ability to steamroller and acts as a platform for our more gifted players to play off......a kinda necessary evil.

Kodjia

He has clearly been missed and his holdup play and possession is a welcome addition to our play, the goals will come as he gets match fitness clearly links well with Adomah, he has clearly being working on his  ability to link with other players in the team...developing in to a class act.

Adomah

Playing with full confidence and clearly enjoys linking with Kodjia.....His movement has come on leaps and bounds and is becoming a real threat in the last third, his running off the ball is impressive too and aids the outlet ball for his team mates.

Davis

Creates this effervescent platform for the whole team, brings in everyone.....is instrumental in us getting forward with more confidence adds that presence that negates the oppositions centre halves  and allows our players a player to play off.

Snodgrass

Still settling and finding his match fitness, shows guile and awareness  his eye for a pass is impressive and it is encouraging other players to make runs, they wasn't making......I think he is a vital piece in the jigsaw and has added crucial balance to the side that  creates the overall team confidence.

 

 Steve Bruce..........With these players finding new found confidence and the introduction of the 4-4-2 along with a  nudge from the fans has encouraged him to play more expansively.Long may it continue.

 

 

 

[Rugeley Villa]

5 hours ago, Straggler said:

Hang on hang on a minute. I know there is a passionate debate going in here, but how do we just skate past this statement? You had a big "stonker" on, you actually thought of Steve Bruce in the same state of arousal and that contributes positively to your happy feelings? I have heard some wild accusations leveled at Bruce but this is a first for me.

I always considered him more a a way of preventing said stonkers but whatever works for you dude. 

It's very normal for me to have these kind of things happen. Venture into off topic a bit more and you will know what I mean 

Bruce IN!

[TRO]

7 hours ago, KHV said:

If we turn up at wolves with a 4-4-2 I think we will be in serious trouble

I think our current set up.....we are capable of beating any team in this league and need to be scared of no one.

However, we do need to have respect for all our opponents and that needs to be instilled in our play.

never underestimate the opposition, it can dump you on your arse.

If we apply ourselves like we should....we should fear no one..

[Straggler]

35 minutes ago, TRO said:

 

 

 

 

This is how I see our current situation.

Steve Bruce.....I believe ,what he said ....that he had to set us up to stop the rot, during that time.... 40 odd games many faces have changed in the players and in order to get some balance in the side it has taken time...He ( SB) has had to build his confidence in the players to be able to trust them to carry out his instructions, gleaned from Bodymoor Heath.

I think going in to this season, his team was still lacking balance for various reasons......These are the players i think have made a difference.

Johnstone

He has gradually improved the time he has been with us and is still improving on an incremental basis.......It takes time to work on every aspect of your game, but its clear he has been doing that gradually.

looking a fine keeper.

Terry

Despite his years, which affects his mobility, his reading of the game and situations is invaluable to us....He gives composure to the back four and offers moral support.....calming influence and presence.

Elmohamady

Like all the summer recruits took time to settle.....but now, is adding value to the team....His crosses are meaningful and accurate, his ability to go up for headers and challenge adds value to the business of holding ground and gaining control.

Whelan

Still settling and his passes need to be worked on, has been getting caught a bit in possession, but he breaks up play and disrupts the oppositions ability to steamroller and acts as a platform for our more gifted players to play off......a kinda necessary evil.

Kodjia

He has clearly been missed and his holdup play and possession is a welcome addition to our play, the goals will come as he gets match fitness clearly links well with Adomah, he has clearly being working on his  ability to link with other players in the team...developing in to a class act.

Adomah

Playing with full confidence and clearly enjoys linking with Kodjia.....His movement has come on leaps and bounds and is becoming a real threat in the last third, his running off the ball is impressive too and aids the outlet ball for his team mates.

Davis

Creates this effervescent platform for the whole team, brings in everyone.....is instrumental in us getting forward with more confidence adds that presence that negates the oppositions centre halves  and allows our players a player to play off.

Snodgrass

Still settling and finding his match fitness, shows guile and awareness  his eye for a pass is impressive and it is encouraging other players to make runs, they wasn't making......I think he is a vital piece in the jigsaw and has added crucial balance to the side that  creates the overall team confidence.

 

 Steve Bruce..........With these players finding new found confidence and the introduction of the 4-4-2 along with a  nudge from the fans has encouraged him to play more expansively.Long may it continue.

 

 

 

I don't have a problem with any of the above apart from the bit about Adomah. He is absolutely a positive now, but I don't think it is fair to describe his form now as some sort of relevation.  Imo he is showing now the same sort of form as he showed last season, the main difference being that he is sharing the creative workload with other players which is enabling him to be more effective. It is one of the most evident mistakes of the Bruce era that Gabby, Bacuna and Bjarnassen have started ahead of him. Putting our most creative player from last season back in the team is a no brainer which also aptly describes the decision to leave him out in the first place. 

[carewjust4u]

Brucey's gonna win us the league mate.

[TRO]

16 minutes ago, Straggler said:

I don't have a problem with any of the above apart from the bit about Adomah. He is absolutely a positive now, but I don't think it is fair to describe his form now as some sort of relevation.  Imo he is showing now the same sort of form as he showed last season, the main difference being that he is sharing the creative workload with other players which is enabling him to be more effective. It is one of the most evident mistakes of the Bruce era that Gabby, Bacuna and Bjarnassen have started ahead of him. Putting our most creative player from last season back in the team is a no brainer which also aptly describes the decision to leave him out in the first place. 

I agree.....but I still think Alberts form is conducive to the whole team being more balanced.....he is also cutting inside and doubling as an (old fashioned term)inside forward which is bringing him goals.

He was left out because SB wanted players with more defensive qualities......I understand Bruce's view, but not sure I would have done that, like you I rate him.However I still think he is playing with more of a swagger and looks more like the undroppable player you and me could see last year....(but circumstances were different imo)

I have said many times on here.....one player will set the rest off in terms of form and now they are all showing signs of improved form.....personally, I think snoddy has done that, not saying i think ge is our best player, just saying last piece in the PRESENT jigsaw......when we go up we will have to think again.

I also think we may have to put our thinking caps on to face teams who are intent in getting so many players behind the ball.....next stage to worry about.

Edited September 28, 2017 by TRO

[bannedfromHandV]

21 hours ago, macandally said:

Let's see where we are come Christmas eh?  For me he has just done what people have been slating him for over the last 40 games.  Get on the front foot, stop being so defensive and pick a settled team for a few weeks.  Look what that brings, pity it has taken so long, we might already be a league above!

It's called being 1 year into the job, people expected this after 1 month into the job.

[TRO]

9 minutes ago, carewjust4u said:

Brucey's gonna win us the league mate.

Brave man......have you been signed up by the site to get reaction

[DCJonah]

20 minutes ago, bannedfromHandV said:

It's called being 1 year into the job, people expected this after 1 month into the job.

Not sure they did. But even the club expected better. The expectations when he was hired were made clear. The expectations for this year were made clear. 

So far he failed to meet them last year and is failing to currently meet them this year. Hence the continued concern from some 

 

[DCJonah]

4 hours ago, mattjpa said:

Im not picking an isolated random period of form though, im picking our last 6 games which now reads won 4 draw 2 and bears much more semblance than the results that preceded it when referring to form. This points per game return extrapolated over a season would see us promoted. If Blues win 6 in a row they are indeed in title winning form, it doesn't mean they will win the title as they more than likely wouldn't be able to maintain it. 

Dont want to sound pedantic but you picked up on my terminology originally which I think is correct. Im talking about form, you are talking about points return so far this season which I agree is not going to get us promoted. Im an optimist when it comes to the Villa but Im living in hope that 4 promotions give SB enough experience to be able to manage a forward momentum (something he hasnt managed up to now ill conceed)

Our last 6 games is won 3 drawn 3 which is 2 points a game. If we continued that form that would give us 88 points, which hasn't been good enough for promotion the last 5 years

[TRO]

18 minutes ago, DCJonah said:

Not sure they did. But even the club expected better. The expectations when he was hired were made clear. The expectations for this year were made clear. 

So far he failed to meet them last year and is failing to currently meet them this year. Hence the continued concern from some 

 

Its interesting how interpretations differ.

I think your reference to this year is right....I think last year was a whole different ball game.....If they ( the hierarchy)were expecting to  go up and didn't they would have sacked him, no doubt in my mind.....One poster wrote on here at the time.... " if he keeps us up it will be a miracle" such was our form and inability to secure a win....so he did not fail at all.....he succeeded.

His job in year 1 was to stop the rot......reverse the demise....he did it.

This season, He knows the score.....up or out......so far from a stuttering start the team has hit a rich vein of form and the balance of the team looks right, we are playing more expansively, all our players have raised their level of individual form and we are 3rd in the form league sitting in 8 th place in the league with 35 games to go.

I would say that is well on plan in anyones eyes........but we all know how this game of football can be, so brittle ,with injuries to key players and suspensions or internationals, so nothing is taken for granted.

I would say there is more than reasonable concern for optimism.

Edited September 28, 2017 by TRO