lapal_fan Posted August 13, 2019 Share Posted August 13, 2019 9 minutes ago, StefanAVFC said: We're back at this nonsense again https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/9699349/migrants-salary-threshold-brexit-priti-patel/ Bye bye nurses, doctors, teachers, fruit pickers, bar staff etc etc etc At least then we'll be able to moan about queues in A&E and pubs, nothing on the shelves in Asda and dying more quickerer than ever. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mic09 Posted August 13, 2019 Share Posted August 13, 2019 7 minutes ago, StefanAVFC said: We're back at this nonsense again https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/9699349/migrants-salary-threshold-brexit-priti-patel/ Bye bye nurses, doctors, teachers, fruit pickers, bar staff etc etc etc If someone comes to the UK with no language skills, no British cultural background, doesn't know his way around the British bureaucracy and has never even drank a tea with milk, and takes your job at a factory, you have to be asking yourself some serious questions. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post NurembergVillan Posted August 13, 2019 Moderator Popular Post Share Posted August 13, 2019 9 minutes ago, StefanAVFC said: We're back at this nonsense again https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/9699349/migrants-salary-threshold-brexit-priti-patel/ Bye bye nurses, doctors, teachers, fruit pickers, bar staff etc etc etc I was earning about £18k per year when I moved to Germany. Six years later I was paying more tax than the majority of the German workforce. More short-sighted, rabble-rousing bollocks from a government intent more on appealing to the hard of thinking than to actually bringing about positive change. 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NurembergVillan Posted August 13, 2019 Moderator Share Posted August 13, 2019 3 minutes ago, Mic09 said: If someone comes to the UK with no language skills, no British cultural background, doesn't know his way around the British bureaucracy and has never even drank a tea with milk, and takes your job at a factory, you have to be asking yourself some serious questions. Such as - How do people breathe with their mouth closed? Why am I always skint when I have money at the weekends for premium lager and cocaine? What more could I do to get myself to work on time? [/sweepinggeneralisation] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snowychap Posted August 13, 2019 Share Posted August 13, 2019 58 minutes ago, NurembergVillan said: More short-sighted, rabble-rousing bollocks from a government intent more on appealing to the hard of thinking than to actually bringing about positive change. To be fair, this is a suggestion from a report by a think tank, the CSJ (Duncan Smith's baby). She is to be 'told' to do this by them. It isn't, as yet, government policy much as it may fit in with the lack of thinking of some of them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NurembergVillan Posted August 13, 2019 Moderator Share Posted August 13, 2019 4 minutes ago, snowychap said: To be fair, this is a suggestion from a report by a think tank, the CSJ (Duncan Smith's baby). She is to be 'told' to do this by them. It isn't, as yet, government policy much as it may fit in with the lack of thinking of some of them. Wasn't it mooted a few months ago too, though? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snowychap Posted August 13, 2019 Share Posted August 13, 2019 (edited) 1 hour ago, Mic09 said: If someone comes to the UK with no language skills, no British cultural background, doesn't know his way around the British bureaucracy and has never even drank a tea with milk, and takes your job at a factory, you have to be asking yourself some serious questions. It's not in any way as simple as that, though, is it? There are many appeals of a transient workforce (innate flexibility being one), of a certain amount of the workforce that doesn't have much in the way of language skills (and may therefore not understand what work rights they have or should demand or 'know their way around British bureaucracy'), of a workforce that may well be employed on a short-term basis and therefore not accrue certain employment rights (e.g. complaint against some forms of unfair dismissal that doesn't happen until after 24 months), &c. Really not sure what the relevance of a 'British cultural background' has towards some sort of job application for a factory (specific job referred to as per quoted post) unless the employer/HR bod is an unavowed xenephobe with an ability to avoid discrimination legislation. Edited August 13, 2019 by snowychap 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snowychap Posted August 13, 2019 Share Posted August 13, 2019 (edited) 35 minutes ago, NurembergVillan said: Wasn't it mooted a few months ago too, though? I think that there are a number of salary thresholds depending upon visa tier (and exemptions obviously) and the government's current proposal is to increase that threshold for all (with some exemptions) to £30k. p.a. Obviously, if your criticism is a general one about the restrictiveness and self-harm of this kind of policy then I agree with you. I was just pointing out that this even more restrictive policy idea (of an even higher threshold) isn't, as yet, government policy - it's merely Duncan Smith's think tank's suggestion. Edited August 13, 2019 by snowychap 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seat68 Posted August 13, 2019 Share Posted August 13, 2019 12 minutes ago, snowychap said: It's not in any way as simple as that, though, is it? There are many appeals of a transient workforce (innate flexibility being one), of a certain amount of the workforce that doesn't have much in the way of language skills (and may therefore not understand what work rights they have or should demand or 'know their way around British bureaucracy'), of a workforce that may well be employed on a short-term basis and therefore not accrue certain employment rights (e.g. complaint against some forms of unfair dismissal that doesn't happen until after 24 months), &c. Really not sure what the relevance of a 'British cultural background' has towards some sort of job application for a factory unless the employer/HR is an unavowed xenephobe with an ability to avoid discrimination legislation. I read it as if someone comes here with no skills and doesn't speak the language, don't blame them take a look at yourself. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snowychap Posted August 13, 2019 Share Posted August 13, 2019 2 minutes ago, Seat68 said: I read it as if someone comes here with no skills and doesn't speak the language, don't blame them take a look at yourself. Yes, I understand the claim. My post tried to explain why it might not be anywhere near as simple as that and there are many appeals of a transient and migratory workforce over and above costs or lazy generalisations about the native workforce. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NurembergVillan Posted August 13, 2019 Moderator Share Posted August 13, 2019 19 minutes ago, snowychap said: Really not sure what the relevance of a 'British cultural background' has towards some sort of job application for a factory (specific job referred to as per quoted post) unless the employer/HR is an unavowed xenephobe with an ability to avoid discrimination legislation. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snowychap Posted August 13, 2019 Share Posted August 13, 2019 3 minutes ago, NurembergVillan said: There was probably an identical photo of him in that pose in front of an EU flag. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NurembergVillan Posted August 13, 2019 Moderator Share Posted August 13, 2019 9 minutes ago, snowychap said: I think that there are a number of salary thresholds depending upon visa tier (and exemptions obviously) and the government's current proposal is to increase that threshold for all (with some exemptions) to £30k. p.a. Obviously, if your criticism is a general one about the restrictiveness and self-harm of this kind of policy the I agree with you. I was just pointing out that this even more restrictive policy idea (of an even higher threshold) isn't, as yet, government policy - it's merely Duncan Smith's think tank's suggestion. It is, yes. We already know about the benefits of seasonal workers in some sectors, and the examples you give (about 24 mth rights thresholds etc) are important too. It's incredible that British people who find their job under threat because of migrant workers have been convinced it's the migrant workers who are the issue, and not the business owners who will scrape a few quid off the wage bill at any opportunity. This was the prompt for my (tongue in cheek) mouth breather post that followed. Not implying that working in a factory would make you short of IQ, but that missing the obvious about what is the cause of your problems rather than taking it out on the symptoms. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snowychap Posted August 13, 2019 Share Posted August 13, 2019 @NurembergVillan, yes, I think we're largely in agreement here. On a side note, for some reason I can't type/write properly today and you keep on highlighting the sentences where I'm missing a word or there's a typo. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NurembergVillan Posted August 13, 2019 Moderator Share Posted August 13, 2019 4 minutes ago, snowychap said: @NurembergVillan, yes, I think we're largely in agreement here. On a side note, for some reason I can't type/write properly today and you keep on highlighting the sentences where I'm missing a word or there's a typo. This one's fine 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snowychap Posted August 14, 2019 Share Posted August 14, 2019 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Genie Posted August 14, 2019 Share Posted August 14, 2019 12 minutes ago, snowychap said: You just know that charging non-UK citizens to use the NHS will bring in about £150m a year but the mechanism to do it will cost the NHS about £17b and will take 4 years longer than planned to introduce and doctors/nurses will spend more time taking credit card payments than treating people causing an increase in waiting times for all. Nailed on. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VILLAMARV Posted August 14, 2019 Share Posted August 14, 2019 Standard we cant afford morality stuff innit. It's been like this my whole adult life. The sad thing is the very socialist thinking 90odd year old grandma I was chatting to who thinks it's only right that her house be taken away to pay for care she needs because we cant afford it now don't you know. Turns out the Mirror has convinced her that her lifetime of taxes actually on second thoughts wasn't enough. An if she doesn't now pay her bit we'll lose the NHS you know. So the thing you fought for to be free you now have to pay for or it wont be free anymore? Usurous, manipulative, praying on the decent folk word removed's the lot of them. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chindie Posted August 14, 2019 VT Supporter Share Posted August 14, 2019 Johnson's gone full stab in the back rhetoric today. Despicable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tonyh29 Posted August 14, 2019 Share Posted August 14, 2019 1 hour ago, Genie said: You just know that charging non-UK citizens to use the NHS will bring in about £150m a year but the mechanism to do it will cost the NHS about £17b and will take 4 years longer than planned to introduce and doctors/nurses will spend more time taking credit card payments than treating people causing an increase in waiting times for all. Nailed on. We already charge , just the bill goes to the government of the country concerned , rather than the individual ..and as it turns out we are rather shit at sticking these claims in free treatment for British citizens whilst in the EU is also cross charged ..it won't surprise you to learn the EU countries are much better at sticking in their claims Meanwhile , we offered a reciprocal deal to the 27 countries regardless of the outcome of the withdrawal agreement ... turns out they can't individually agree to it and have to wait for all 27 to agree Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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