Jareth Posted August 10, 2020 Share Posted August 10, 2020 17 minutes ago, Jareth said: Oh these trots, oh these leftie tyrants... I can guarantee you that you will not find abhorrence of racism in general in this thread. Have anyone on here really suffered discrimination? Tim Montgomerire clearly thinks not. Labour can prioritise antisemitism all they like - there is a clear hierarchy of racism in this country and it will not be ignored. BTW Dawn was just pulled over, for nothing, an M ferkin P. I have a friend who is a Met detective they have every reason to pull over black people in certain situations - there is a grey area here, a purposeful conflation of what is understood as good behaviour with an agenda of anti black. **** Tim Montgomerie. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seat68 Posted August 10, 2020 Share Posted August 10, 2020 I believe she has the entire conversation recorded if she releases that uncut surely that will shut them up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seat68 Posted August 10, 2020 Share Posted August 10, 2020 Reading up on this MP the footage I am seeing is her in the driver seat, then some are saying it was a black male and then some are saying a white male. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post ml1dch Posted August 10, 2020 Popular Post Share Posted August 10, 2020 (edited) 8 hours ago, Graham t said: At one of my first meetings ( as a shop steward ) to discuss a 'manning' issue in the paint shop I raised my hand to ask for further discussions instead of walking off the job. I was pinned to the wall by two of the Senior Shop Stewards and told that if I didn't shut up that they would 'fill me in'. Maybe you just have that effect on people? Edited August 10, 2020 by ml1dch 2 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Graham t Posted August 10, 2020 Share Posted August 10, 2020 4 minutes ago, ml1dch said: Maybe you just have that effect on people? I was voted into the position of shop steward so that I could represent my less educated colleagues on the track. Of course the knuckle dragging individuals who 'guarded ' senior shop stewards resented my position of someone who wasn't afraid to defend the livelihoods of my friends. I would do the same for you, I can't help myself...., Keep smiling, VLD. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bickster Posted August 10, 2020 Moderator Share Posted August 10, 2020 Police have f***ed up on the Dawn Butler thing, right royally. Ignore the race issue for one second and the distraction of the race of the driver Under the RTA they have the power to stop any vehicle on the road but they must give a reason for the stop. They could have just said they wanted to check their documents, that is a valid reason. They didn't they said they were concerned about their illegal window tints (not illegal) - not a valid reason, then they said they stopped the vehicle because it was misidentified as being from Yorkshire, this means they accessed the PNC for which you must have reasonable grounds (as many officers I work with tell me). So what were those reasonable grounds? So like I said, ignoring the race issue, they effed up and that leads to the suspicion that the stop WAS racially motivated because, they were making up reasons to stop the vehicle. It is good to know that coming from Yorkshire is considered a crime in London. It is the weakest of weak reasons, in fact it makes it an illegal stop, when its so easy to make a legal one. That is the real problem here 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seat68 Posted August 10, 2020 Share Posted August 10, 2020 (edited) 15 minutes ago, bickster said: Police have f***ed up on the Dawn Butler thing, right royally. Ignore the race issue for one second and the distraction of the race of the driver Under the RTA they have the power to stop any vehicle on the road but they must give a reason for the stop. They could have just said they wanted to check their documents, that is a valid reason. They didn't they said they were concerned about their illegal window tints (not illegal) - not a valid reason, then they said they stopped the vehicle because it was misidentified as being from Yorkshire, this means they accessed the PNC for which you must have reasonable grounds (as many officers I work with tell me). So what were those reasonable grounds? So like I said, ignoring the race issue, they effed up and that leads to the suspicion that the stop WAS racially motivated because, they were making up reasons to stop the vehicle. It is good to know that coming from Yorkshire is considered a crime in London. It is the weakest of weak reasons, in fact it makes it an illegal stop, when its so easy to make a legal one. That is the real problem here Tried reading into what happened without any biased spin on it, its bloody difficult. Am I right in saying that her car, that she was a passenger in was stopped for no reason. Her driver was white. Edit. The driver was black according to Dawn in the Guardian but white according to the footage on the DM website. . The given reason as explained by you was that following a mis typed PNC it was a car registered in Yorkshire. A small bit of edited and seemingly flipped footage seems to show the police saying sorry, our mistake. No reason to stop them or run a check it seems. As a side note did she flip the video to back up her tweet or was it Sky. It seems the mail have the entire video Edited August 10, 2020 by Seat68 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StefanAVFC Posted August 10, 2020 Share Posted August 10, 2020 Just stop responding to somebody so obviously on the wind up. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bickster Posted August 10, 2020 Moderator Share Posted August 10, 2020 1 hour ago, Seat68 said: Am I right in saying that her car, that she was a passenger in was stopped for no reason. No legal reason 1 hour ago, Seat68 said: No reason to stop them or run a check it seems. They can stop any vehicle, anytime. They can say they wanted to check documentation, that is perfectly legal. But they didn't say that. They claimed the window tints were illegal, iirc the MOT states tints of up to 90% on rear windows are legal, I think it comes down to 60 or 70% on front windows. 90% tint is pretty much opaque from the outside and I doubt they are carrying the correct equipment to even test that. That does not lead to a reasonable excuse to access the PNC. The PNC was obviously checked to get the "Yorkshire" thing. Also, the female officer demanding to know where they were going? What has that got to do with illegal window tints or coming from Yorkshire? The Police have no right to know that information, they can ask sure but why would you ask that question in relation to the already weaker than week excuse for the stop? Again that leads to the suspicion of racial profiling 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seat68 Posted August 10, 2020 Share Posted August 10, 2020 6 minutes ago, bickster said: No legal reason They can stop any vehicle, anytime. They can say they wanted to check documentation, that is perfectly legal. But they didn't say that. They claimed the window tints were illegal, iirc the MOT states tints of up to 90% on rear windows are legal, I think it comes down to 60 or 70% on front windows. 90% tint is pretty much opaque from the outside and I doubt they are carrying the correct equipment to even test that. That does not lead to a reasonable excuse to access the PNC. The PNC was obviously checked to get the "Yorkshire" thing. Also, the female officer demanding to know where they were going? What has that got to do with illegal window tints or coming from Yorkshire? The Police have no right to know that information, they can ask sure but why would you ask that question in relation to the already weaker than week excuse for the stop? Again that leads to the suspicion of racial profiling Thank you. It seems cut and dried doesn’t it. Black female in the front of what I assume to be a nice car. That seems to be it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tonyh29 Posted August 10, 2020 Share Posted August 10, 2020 21 hours ago, Seat68 said: Thank you. It seems cut and dried doesn’t it. Black female in the front of what I assume to be a nice car. That seems to be it. At face value it does .. Parts of Hackney aren't 't exactly the nicest part of London (its 6th on boroughs of London crime list and 4th on knife crime ) , you could argue that a police presence and random stop and search is a good thing on that basis , however google will show you that Black people are four times more likely to be stopped and searched than white people in Hackney and this article seems to be the police saying exaclty that they are profiling Quote The borough commander accepted that while his officers “don’t always get it right” and that stop and search is “not an exact science”, the responsibility for why a stop and search has been carried out comes down to the individual officer’s justification for stopping somebody. According to a detailed report presented to the scrutiny commission by police monitoring group Hackney Account, many young people it has spoke to believe that they were singled out because of their race for “disproportionate or excessive treatment”. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seat68 Posted August 10, 2020 Share Posted August 10, 2020 (edited) I can’t understand why she would undermine herself by saying she was driving, allowing the video to be flipped and then saying the other person in the car was black when they were white. My error apparently it wasn't flipped, its how it was filmed and the driver was a mixed race guy. Edited August 10, 2020 by Seat68 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HanoiVillan Posted August 10, 2020 Share Posted August 10, 2020 14 hours ago, KentVillan said: It suggests we have a socialist attitude to healthcare provision. Not sure it reads across to other areas of policy. At some point the Tories, the Sun, and the Daily Mail decided the NHS wasn’t worth arguing about (except in terms of funding, and a few dog whistle points about treating foreigners), so it became broadly a national consensus issue. But on other issues I think the UK overall leans just right of centre - eg taxation, immigration, foreign policy, education, state intervention in industry, etc. It’s weird actually how much the NHS has been detached from everything else. Not sure any other country treats its health service as such a unique entity within the wider public sector? Maybe Cuba? The NHS is valorised in the UK for much the same reason Churchill is IMO, in that it represents nostalgia for 'our finest hour', when 'we were all in it together'. As such, the healthcare issue is a double-edged sword for Labour, who benefit from the perception that they are much the better stewards of it, but who generally do not benefit from a politics of nostalgia. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
veloman Posted August 10, 2020 Share Posted August 10, 2020 If I've read this correctly, some/one poster has worked at Longbridge and may have been a Union Official. If that is correct , did you ever have any dealing with Derek (Red Robbo) Robinson and , if so, what was your opinion of him? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Graham t Posted August 10, 2020 Share Posted August 10, 2020 10 hours ago, Seat68 said: I can’t understand why she would undermine herself by saying she was driving, allowing the video to be flipped and then saying the other person in the car was black when they were white. My error apparently it wasn't flipped, its how it was filmed and the driver was a mixed race guy. Couldn't all of this 'fuss' and paranoia been averted with a simple ' how can I help you officer', VLD. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Graham t Posted August 10, 2020 Share Posted August 10, 2020 Hi Velo, sorry I can't help you much with info on 'Red Robbo ' as I was transferred to Longbridge from Solihull ( SD1 ) just after he was sacked ( as I remember ) after a riot in the factory where cars were damaged and security personnel were attacked. Regards, VLD. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xann Posted August 11, 2020 Share Posted August 11, 2020 This thread's turned into a zoo, hasn't it? The reality crash has sent the moderates to ground and got the loons frothing Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bickster Posted August 11, 2020 Moderator Share Posted August 11, 2020 14 hours ago, Graham t said: Couldn't all of this 'fuss' and paranoia been averted with a simple ' how can I help you officer', VLD. The only way it can be stopped is if the Police desist from stopping and searching people of colour based only on the idea that they aren't white (which is backed up by the statistics) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Graham t Posted August 11, 2020 Share Posted August 11, 2020 8 hours ago, bickster said: The only way it can be stopped is if the Police desist from stopping and searching people of colour based only on the idea that they aren't white (which is backed up by the statistics) Incidentally Dawn Butler has refused to release , all of her recording of the police stop ( which was of the driver, not her ). She was apparently abusive, rude and generally uncooperative. She wanted the attention, typical 'victim' behaviour. The police are the 'victims ' here. Heroes to a man, I for one, am proud of our boys and girls in blue. VLD. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrisp65 Posted August 11, 2020 Share Posted August 11, 2020 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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