mockingbird_franklin Posted January 19, 2014 Share Posted January 19, 2014 Never mind the pen being a poor decision, what about the truly awful decision to give a Liverpool free kick when Suarez clearly fouled Sylla, the one he very nearly scored a winner from. During the second half there were quite a few instances of some very poor decisions where he favoured Liverpool 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
danceoftheshamen Posted January 19, 2014 Author Share Posted January 19, 2014 Never mind the pen being a poor decision, what about the truly awful decision to give a Liverpool free kick when Suarez clearly fouled Sylla, the one he very nearly scored a winner from. During the second half there were quite a few instances of some very poor decisions where he favoured Liverpool I agree, once Liverpool were two down the decisions swang their way quite noticeably. As for the Dive by Suarez the only defenses i have heard for it are all nonsense.. Things like "It's part of the game" or "the ref couldn't have seen it clearly from there so is always going to give it in that situation"..I mean WHAT? If the ref can't see it properly that means he's guessing... so shouldn't be a penalty!.. Where does it say in the rules that if a Referee "assumes" it was a foul he can give a penalty? Another one is "He just clipped him so it was a penalty" Again nonsense, on that basis there would be about 100,000 free kicks per game for "Tiny contact" offenses. The reason for the tiny contact was the way Suarez flicked his leg out at an unnatural angle to make sure he got clipped.. as it was even despite him doing this he barely touched him. Couple of things i learned today: 1. Tiny contact caused by hanging a leg over to one side = Legitimate stonewall penalty (But only at Anfield, Old Trafford, Stamford Bridge, Emirates and Man City's ground) 2. It's part of the game = Cheating is perfectly acceptable. 3. All Strikers do it = Cheating is perfectly acceptable 4. The keeper rushed out too quickly = The keeper gave the striker the chance to cheat Etc . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Con Posted January 19, 2014 Share Posted January 19, 2014 (edited) Was a dive. Shearer was protesting too hard. Strikers union. Not only was it a dive, Suarez played for the dive. Even had he stayed on his feet he would not have caught up with the ball because he had kicked it so far in front of him it would have run out of play. (actually just watched MOTD and he could have got it, he just chose to go down on a feather) Strikers looking for an opportunity to win a penalty don't care where the ball they kick ends up because they know they're going to dive. Edited January 20, 2014 by Con Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
foreveryoung Posted January 19, 2014 Share Posted January 19, 2014 (edited) Take off the claret and blue glasses guys. Swarez got kneed in the ass. Got elbowed in the face and Bacuna Blatently handballed in the first half, nothing given. I never wanna get into the situation we believe every loss is because the refs are against us. As for the penalty. It was'nt a foul no, neither was it a Ashley Young special. Swarez played for it, unfortunately its part of the game now. I would have expected our player to play it like that had the keeper come flying out like he did. Hate the scousers and im not defending refs, but we have to be better than this, to blame them week in week out is just poor. Edited January 19, 2014 by foreveryoung Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
danceoftheshamen Posted January 19, 2014 Author Share Posted January 19, 2014 Bang on Con agree completely Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
danceoftheshamen Posted January 19, 2014 Author Share Posted January 19, 2014 Take off the claret and blue glasses guys. Swarez got kneed in the ass. Got elbowed in the face and Bacuna Blatently handballed in the first half, nothing given. I never wanna get into the situation we believe every loss is because the refs are against us. This wasn't a loss, It's not sour grapes either nothing to do with it in fact. The Suarez penalty discussion is all over the Media at the moment too so i think it's perfectly reasonable to discuss it on here. Nothing to do with winning or losing either just a view on the game changing incidents of the game whether that be for or against us, win, lose or draw. I agree Suarez could have had a free kick for the "Arse" incident but the elbow was accidental and the hand ball was ball to hand... In my opinion of course. Notice virtually all of these incidents involve one player? He is brilliant and very adept at cheating, as soon as he feels a bit of contact he's either holding his face as though he's been punched, diving for a Pen or as in this case holding his Arse as though he's been assaulted... He does it all the time in every game i see him play! In fact i'd say he deliberately plays for those things by jumping into situations and then as soon as he finds someones elbow he goes down i agony holding his face... Did you see any bruising afterwards by chance? Any blood from this nasty assault Bacuna made? Neither do i think "The refs are against us" but i do think they favor the sky four and 9 times out of 10 in a game changing incident they will err on the side of those teams.100% yes. I was actually delighted with the result, a point from Anfield against an in form Liverpool side was a great day for us. So i disagree it's got anything to do with wearing Claret & Blue specs, it's more about not sweeping blatantly poor decisions/cheating under the carpet or allowing it to be swept under the carpet.. Or do you not think this goes on? Do you think "It all evens out in the end" maybe? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kwan Posted January 19, 2014 Share Posted January 19, 2014 No claret and blue specs. I'm sure Benteke gets a hundred elbows in the back and leaping over top of him and knees in the backs as he leaps but he doesn't throw himself on the ground and get the replays. Suarez is a diving, cheating word removed. End of. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rovers13 Posted January 19, 2014 Share Posted January 19, 2014 Another reason where the rule needs to be amended so you don't get a foul if you hit the ball out of reach Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
One For The Road Posted January 20, 2014 Share Posted January 20, 2014 Another reason where the rule needs to be amended so you don't get a foul if you hit the ball out of reach I don't believe the rules need to be amended because those ARE the rules. I remember, ironically, Steven Gerrard being clearly tripped in the box at Anfield by an Arsenal player but as he burst in to the area he kicked the ball so far ahead of himself that there was no way he could possibly have got to the ball. The ref gave a goal kick because even though he was brought down he was not denied the opportunity to play the ball. A correct decision. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Con Posted January 20, 2014 Share Posted January 20, 2014 not a red card, apparently. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
matrim Posted January 20, 2014 Share Posted January 20, 2014 not a red card, apparently. The only reason he didn't get a red is because Vidic got one about 2 minutes before that. If Vidic didn't get a red Rafeal would had. The Vidic one was questionable too. I thought a yellow would have been enough but could kinda see why the ref gave a red Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lammy123 Posted January 20, 2014 Share Posted January 20, 2014 Was a dive. Shearer was protesting too hard. Strikers union. Not only was it a dive, Suarez played for the dive. Even had he stayed on his feet he would not have caught up with the ball because he had kicked it so far in front of him it would have run out of play. (actually just watched MOTD and he could have got it, he just chose to go down on a feather) Strikers looking for an opportunity to win a penalty don't care where the ball they kick ends up because they know they're going to dive. It was a dive but he did get caught slightly but as con says he played for it. Refs at the prem higher level seem to not apply any common sense to situations. When I referee (still played up to last year) the basic common sense rules I use are (1) If he hadn't of dived would he have been taken out? - this catches the scenario where the player dives to get out of being injured - which should be a foul - eg. attempting to trip/kick... (2) If the player that challenged the diver hadn't of been there would the diver have kept on his feet - this catches the Suarez/Young type of dive - which shouldn't be a foul. eg. If Guzan had of pulled up slightly quicker and not brushed against Suarez would Suarez would have still gone down - the answer is yes. Its quite easy to apply when you break it down like this. It could even be looked at in retrospect with match bans as it is hard to tell sometimes at full speed with no detrimental effect to the ref in question. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jarpie Posted January 20, 2014 Share Posted January 20, 2014 IMO it looked like that ref was looking excuse to give penalty, and he got it. Seen that happen many times when Sky 6 plays against other teams. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
srsmithusa Posted March 17, 2014 Share Posted March 17, 2014 So, resurrecting this thread to mention about Foy and Chelsea. First card - on Baker. could have possibly gone as a firm admonition, but a caution was very reasonable. second card - on Willian. correct and necessary to be consistent with the tone set on the first card. third card - on Bennet. correct and necessary. Could have been viewed as denying an obvious goal scoring opportunity. (DOGSO) but did not really fit it, by a couple details. (The angle, and Vlaar) fourth card - willian. Defensible as it was clearly a deliberate and tactical contact from behind to stop an attack (Look at how far Willian sprinted to be able to do it.... clearly tactical, possibly retaliatory intent) Non mandatory, could have gotten away with an admonition. fifth card - benteke. Honestly, don't remember it. But I remember thinking it wa sixth card - Vlaar. Good caution. Red not necessary as the attempt was for the ball. Matic just got to it with his head first. Seventh card - Ramirez. Mandatory straight red. Sending off - Maurino. He wanted it. You don't stroll on to the pitch to discuss a call with the referee. Better to give it to him than to force him to escalate in order to get it. Disallowed goal - really good call, made by AR (he clearly communicated he had a problem with the goal - he did not move up the line as per mechanics if there is a good goal. I think chelsea has a right to feel aggrieved on the second caution to Willian, but little else. (from Foy) I thought the AR's gave us the benefit on a couple close offside calls. I personally think it's refreshing to see a referee that does not transparently give the benefit to a "big club." The no call when Terry clearly handled the ball out of the penalty area in the opposite fixture being an obvious example. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bannedfromHandV Posted March 17, 2014 Share Posted March 17, 2014 We did get away with 2 or 3 offsides that weren't but then that's par for the course for a football match these days, other than that I don't see how Mourinho can really whinge, not that it will stop him Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VillaChris Posted March 17, 2014 Share Posted March 17, 2014 I just don't understand how they're all claiming the Bennett one was a certain red, feck me Ron was level with Ramieres and Bennett when the foul occurred! If it's last man there can't be a covering defender in the vicinity so to claim a red in that situation was ridiculous imo when Ron was about two yards away from Ramires who'd probably have just fallen over Guzan and tried to claim a penalty anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
danceoftheshamen Posted March 17, 2014 Author Share Posted March 17, 2014 I just don't understand how they're all claiming the Bennett one was a certain red, feck me Ron was level with Ramieres and Bennett when the foul occurred! If it's last man there can't be a covering defender in the vicinity so to claim a red in that situation was ridiculous imo when Ron was about two yards away from Ramires who'd probably have just fallen over Guzan and tried to claim a penalty anyway. Agreed For me the hysteria surrounding this game is all being generated by Mourinho... He is basically doing what Fergie used to do and go massively OTT to create an "uncomfortable aura" for the officials in future Chelsea games. This is exactly what Fergie used to do to massive effect and although debatable i really do think this is worth around 15 to 20 points over the course of a season in "Beneficial decisions" to the top 4 media darling clubs or so called sky4 clubs. It happened at Arsenal on opening day.. We won that game fair & square and yet look at the ridiculous Wenger driven witch hunt which followed and It's happening again now but this time is Mourinho driven. These managers know this damn well and it basically massively pressures the officials in future games resulting in the vast majority of those decisions going for them... As we witnessed at Chelsea earlier in the season, at Anfield with the Suarez "penalty dive" and how many times have we been on the wrong end of a shocking decision against Man U during the Fergie years? The evidence is there for all to see but most choose to ignore it or brush it under the carpet for fear of sounding "Small time" or whatever. Instead we let these clubs get away with it year in year out unchallenged .... And yet when the boot is on the other foot those clubs scream & shout and make as much noise as possible because they know how huge this pressurising of officials really is... It's worth lots of points over a season so why wouldn't they. Of course this wouldn't work for most clubs in the same way as they have less media spotlight and the bias which clearly exists in this respect just does not work in their favour... so it's only a tool useable by managers of the super rich, large international fanbase, or London based clubs. The London clubs because that's where much of the media companies and staff reside of course. The other evidence of this happened on Sunday but in reverse if you will. Liverpool were awarded 3 penalties at Old Trafford. Now i ask anyone who doubts this goes on in the game to hand on heart tell me they think there is any chance that Man Utd would have had 3 penalties awarded against them at Old Trafford under Fergie? Not a chance! Since Fergie left Man Utd have lost a large chunk of their "Aura" and look at the impact it's had. They are scratching their heads as to what's happened but for me it's largely that they don't get the same "Rub of the green" the had under Fergie. Same players pretty much and yet look at the difference in results! Back to the Chelsea game and i can't see much wrong with Mr Foy's decisions. But Mourinho is looking at the bigger picture of course. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
srsmithusa Posted March 18, 2014 Share Posted March 18, 2014 Agreed For me the hysteria surrounding this game is all being generated by Mourinho... He is basically doing what Fergie used to do and go massively OTT to create an "uncomfortable aura" for the officials in future Chelsea games. This is exactly what Fergie used to do to massive effect and although debatable i really do think this is worth around 15 to 20 points over the course of a season in "Beneficial decisions" to the top 4 media darling clubs or so called Dance, you are right. I abbreviated your post to make this shorter to read, not because it had a weakness..... In my post I said that Maurinho wanted to be dismissed. And I think you explained why. That match was lost, he was thinking ahead to the future, and setting the table for favorable calls in the future. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ponky Posted March 18, 2014 Share Posted March 18, 2014 Well the Willian 2nd yellow was far worse than the "foul" on Ramires that won them a last minute penalty against WBA earlier this season. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chappy Posted March 18, 2014 Share Posted March 18, 2014 Ramires who'd probably have just fallen over Guzan and tried to claim a penalty anyway. "Clever play" (Shearer, 2014) 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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