Relegation

[Gompedyret]

I'm quite the optimist right now.

 

Partly because I think we will get at least seven more points, but might get as much as 13. Also, I reckon (or might it be hope?) that _one_ of the teams around us (Sunderland/Wigan/Norwich/Stoke) quite probably will have a run-in from hell bringing them considerable less points than the competitors (max. 3) and certain relegation as a result.

 

My guess is we end up comfortably around 14.-11. place at end of season. In all cases we should avoid the drop.

 

But still, it's going to be nerve wracking. So many six-pointers. That said, bring'em on!

[praisedmambo]

i realise that for the past couple of wins weve had, ive still be quite negative about them, but only because in a way, i feel that they are hollow victories..

 

when were winning games and playing well, theres still a chance that lerner will use this to refuse to improve the squad, which we desperately need

 

onto to relegation, there does seem more of a chance that we will now stay up, but theres still a chance we could be dragged back down

I wonder what you think about all the money we've been losing, because to me in that light Lerner's cost cutting seems pretty logical. I think once the wage bill is sorted out with the departures of people like Ireland, Hutton, Makoun, Bent, Dunne etc. (I know some have gone, but only recently) that Lambert will get money to spend. I don't see Lerner as a miser at all, especially not considering how much money he has spent!

[sne]

i realise that for the past couple of wins weve had, ive still be quite negative about them, but only because in a way, i feel that they are hollow victories..

 

when were winning games and playing well, theres still a chance that lerner will use this to refuse to improve the squad, which we desperately need

 

onto to relegation, there does seem more of a chance that we will now stay up, but theres still a chance we could be dragged back down

I wonder what you think about all the money we've been losing, because to me in that light Lerner's cost cutting seems pretty logical. I think once the wage bill is sorted out with the departures of people like Ireland, Hutton, Makoun, Bent, Dunne etc. (I know some have gone, but only recently) that Lambert will get money to spend. I don't see Lerner as a miser at all, especially not considering how much money he has spent!

Fair enough, but the money lost on high wages is a drop in the ocean compared to the money we would lose should we be relegated.

The path choosen by Lerner is an insane gamble which makes we wonder if there really is any money at the end of Lerners rainbow for us even after the high earners are gone

Edited April 10, 2013 by sne

[AndyBM]

exactly, yes lerner has spent alot, but that was his choice, he clearly thought spending too much too soon would be the answer, maybe under the right manager it would of been

 

as for the high wage bill, that excuse is getting tiresome now...

 

given - will soon be gone

dunne - gone in a couple of months

hutton - whos knows

makoun - will be sitting on his contract till expiry anyway

ireland - ill be surprised if anyone wants him

bent - an asset not treated the right way by the club

 

should we not have any senior players in the team and just rely on average inexperienced kids?

 

but then again praisedmambo, i guess it doesnt matter what i say on here does it, as i know you will be there waiting to disect it and turn it into a negative?

Edited April 10, 2013 by AndyBM

[briny_ear]

makoun - will be sitting on his contract till expiry anyway

?? 'Twas announced recently he's going to Rennes permanently from 1 July

[smetrov]

i realise that for the past couple of wins weve had, ive still be quite negative about them, but only because in a way, i feel that they are hollow victories..

 

when were winning games and playing well, theres still a chance that lerner will use this to refuse to improve the squad, which we desperately need

 

onto to relegation, there does seem more of a chance that we will now stay up, but theres still a chance we could be dragged back down

I wonder what you think about all the money we've been losing, because to me in that light Lerner's cost cutting seems pretty logical. I think once the wage bill is sorted out with the departures of people like Ireland, Hutton, Makoun, Bent, Dunne etc. (I know some have gone, but only recently) that Lambert will get money to spend. I don't see Lerner as a miser at all, especially not considering how much money he has spent!

 

The majority of club owners loose or 'inves't money - its why owners need to be rich. Whats the point of a billionairre owner - who doesn't put money into the club ?

 

Your point about the wage bill bemuses me - The wage will have been 'sorted out' - and so by your (not just you) logic - Lambert will  get the green light to increase the wage bill to its previous levels, which we were told are so problematic - doesn't make sense, or seem feasible to me. More likley with the wage bill having been brought down, Lambert will be under instructions to keep it down.

Edited April 11, 2013 by smetrov

[Raver50032]

smetrov - that is my fear as well... Trimmed for sale. And if not for sale, then certainly trimmed for everlasting mediocrity as a regressed selling club.

[romavillan]

exactly, yes lerner has spent alot, but that was his choice, he clearly thought spending too much too soon would be the answer, maybe under the right manager it would of been

 

as for the high wage bill, that excuse is getting tiresome now...

 

given - will soon be gone

dunne - gone in a couple of months

hutton - whos knows

makoun - will be sitting on his contract till expiry anyway

ireland - ill be surprised if anyone wants him

bent - an asset not treated the right way by the club

 

should we not have any senior players in the team and just rely on average inexperienced kids?

 

but then again praisedmambo, i guess it doesnt matter what i say on here does it, as i know you will be there waiting to disect it and turn it into a negative?

 

i don't think we shouldn't have experienced players per se, what we shouldn't have is bench warmers and people who don't give a shit on massive amounts of money.

 

we're getting close to FINALLY getting rid of all the overpaid underperformers. then the new start begins. let's just hope that's in the premier league

[The Fun Factory]

If we win on saturday we could end up being safe to spare. Being a pessimist we will probably lose and the worry will  last to wigan away. Fulham are nearly always useless away so bar Berbs they are a very beatable side. In terms of form now we most be in the top 6- just shame about the christmas period which got us in this trouble!

[AshVilla]

The form were in id say there's a better chance of us finishing mid table than going down

 

We just have to continue working hard

Edited April 11, 2013 by AshVilla

[praisedmambo]

I never said the wage bill would be increased to the same level it was, obviously. The club can't lose 50million a year, and we as fans can't just expect the owner to cover that. Especially not to that high level. There are no two ways about it the finances have been a mess and they did need sorting. 

 

Now it appears we aim to build sustainably with the young and hungry players route. I think we will even potentially be interested in experience too. 

 

I don't get why the high wage bill is an excuse. It's plain logic. We had a high wage bill with players not deserving what they were on, coming to the end of their careers so that they had no resale value. The aim has to be to have not even one player hanging around picking up huge wages and contributing nothing. We still have half a dozen or so of them. Get rid of them and their wages can be applied better and elsewhere. Benteke is on 20k a week. It's a totally different approach to what we have done before and it is a transition still in process. I do not believe it has to mean we are always going to be battling with relegation—I believe we can finally be a team to get behind again but you can't turn everything out in one main transfer window, and the awkward window that it is in January. 

exactly, yes lerner has spent alot, but that was his choice, he clearly thought spending too much too soon would be the answer, maybe under the right manager it would of been

 

as for the high wage bill, that excuse is getting tiresome now...

 

given - will soon be gone

dunne - gone in a couple of months

hutton - whos knows

makoun - will be sitting on his contract till expiry anyway

ireland - ill be surprised if anyone wants him

bent - an asset not treated the right way by the club

 

should we not have any senior players in the team and just rely on average inexperienced kids?

 

but then again praisedmambo, i guess it doesnt matter what i say on here does it, as i know you will be there waiting to disect it and turn it into a negative?

 

i don't think we shouldn't have experienced players per se, what we shouldn't have is bench warmers and people who don't give a shit on massive amounts of money.

 

we're getting close to FINALLY getting rid of all the overpaid underperformers. then the new start begins. let's just hope that's in the premier league

Well put. 

[Stevo985]

A win against FUlham would put us in a fantastic (relatively speaking of course) position.

 

From 18th a few weeks ago to potentially 14th and 5 points clear would be better than I imagine most of us would have predicted back then.

 

Fingers crossed we get the job done.

[romavillan]

a point would do me from the fulham game, we're favourites with the bookies though, with the away win and the draw being similar odds). 

 

let's hope the bookies are right but a point combined with losses for our rivals down the bottom would lift us a little further away from the drop.

[Stevo985]

YEah, I seem to have said this a lot recently, but I'd take a point if offered. Wouldn't be a bad result at all.

[StefanAVFC]

YEah, I seem to have said this a lot recently, but I'd take a point if offered. Wouldn't be a bad result at all.

 

Agreed. I think Norwich and Sunderland are more winnable games. And that's before Wigan.

[smetrov]

I never said the wage bill would be increased to the same level it was, obviously. The club can't lose 50million a year, and we as fans can't just expect the owner to cover that. Especially not to that high level. There are no two ways about it the finances have been a mess and they did need sorting. 

 

Now it appears we aim to build sustainably with the young and hungry players route. I think we will even potentially be interested in experience too. 

 

I don't get why the high wage bill is an excuse. It's plain logic. We had a high wage bill with players not deserving what they were on, coming to the end of their careers so that they had no resale value. The aim has to be to have not even one player hanging around picking up huge wages and contributing nothing. We still have half a dozen or so of them. Get rid of them and their wages can be applied better and elsewhere. Benteke is on 20k a week. It's a totally different approach to what we have done before and it is a transition still in process. I do not believe it has to mean we are always going to be battling with relegation—I believe we can finally be a team to get behind again but you can't turn everything out in one main transfer window, and the awkward window that it is in January. 

 

 

we're getting close to FINALLY getting rid of all the overpaid underperformers. then the new start begins. let's just hope that's in the premier league

 

I am a Lambert fan - but if Aston Villa is to thrive, he is going to have to bigger wages for better players, or even to retain the better ones we have (Bentekke, Weiman) - If he is allowed to do this, the probability of some of the big earners not living up to expectations is pretty high.

 

You won't have a succesful premier Aston Villa team, with the players earning half what they would get at other clubs

[romavillan]

I never said the wage bill would be increased to the same level it was, obviously. The club can't lose 50million a year, and we as fans can't just expect the owner to cover that. Especially not to that high level. There are no two ways about it the finances have been a mess and they did need sorting. 

 

Now it appears we aim to build sustainably with the young and hungry players route. I think we will even potentially be interested in experience too. 

 

I don't get why the high wage bill is an excuse. It's plain logic. We had a high wage bill with players not deserving what they were on, coming to the end of their careers so that they had no resale value. The aim has to be to have not even one player hanging around picking up huge wages and contributing nothing. We still have half a dozen or so of them. Get rid of them and their wages can be applied better and elsewhere. Benteke is on 20k a week. It's a totally different approach to what we have done before and it is a transition still in process. I do not believe it has to mean we are always going to be battling with relegation—I believe we can finally be a team to get behind again but you can't turn everything out in one main transfer window, and the awkward window that it is in January. 

 

 

we're getting close to FINALLY getting rid of all the overpaid underperformers. then the new start begins. let's just hope that's in the premier league

 

I am a Lambert fan - but if Aston Villa is to thrive, he is going to have to bigger wages for better players, or even to retain the better ones we have (Bentekke, Weiman) - If he is allowed to do this, the probability of some of the big earners not living up to expectations is pretty high.

 

You won't have a succesful premier Aston Villa team, with the players earning half what they would get at other clubs

 

i think the idea is to do it sustainably though? if we stay up we'll have more income, which means more spending power in terms of wages. the route we tried to go down was paying lots of money for established talent and the odd promising youngster. what PL's route seems to be is to lok for value, so players that he thinks can perform to a level above the price he is going to pay for them and give them as wages. benteke, lowton and westwood are good examples of this.

 

now, if we improve in terms of league position with these players are revenues increase, and if we want to keep them we pay them more, and so on and so on. 

 

to advocate we splash big now is probably bad timing seeing as we still have some of the hangover left from the last time we did.

[smetrov]

 

I never said the wage bill would be increased to the same level it was, obviously. The club can't lose 50million a year, and we as fans can't just expect the owner to cover that. Especially not to that high level. There are no two ways about it the finances have been a mess and they did need sorting. 

 

Now it appears we aim to build sustainably with the young and hungry players route. I think we will even potentially be interested in experience too. 

 

I don't get why the high wage bill is an excuse. It's plain logic. We had a high wage bill with players not deserving what they were on, coming to the end of their careers so that they had no resale value. The aim has to be to have not even one player hanging around picking up huge wages and contributing nothing. We still have half a dozen or so of them. Get rid of them and their wages can be applied better and elsewhere. Benteke is on 20k a week. It's a totally different approach to what we have done before and it is a transition still in process. I do not believe it has to mean we are always going to be battling with relegation—I believe we can finally be a team to get behind again but you can't turn everything out in one main transfer window, and the awkward window that it is in January. 

 

 

we're getting close to FINALLY getting rid of all the overpaid underperformers. then the new start begins. let's just hope that's in the premier league

 

I am a Lambert fan - but if Aston Villa is to thrive, he is going to have to bigger wages for better players, or even to retain the better ones we have (Bentekke, Weiman) - If he is allowed to do this, the probability of some of the big earners not living up to expectations is pretty high.

 

You won't have a succesful premier Aston Villa team, with the players earning half what they would get at other clubs

 

i think the idea is to do it sustainably though? if we stay up we'll have more income, which means more spending power in terms of wages. the route we tried to go down was paying lots of money for established talent and the odd promising youngster. what PL's route seems to be is to lok for value, so players that he thinks can perform to a level above the price he is going to pay for them and give them as wages. benteke, lowton and westwood are good examples of this.

 

now, if we improve in terms of league position with these players are revenues increase, and if we want to keep them we pay them more, and so on and so on. 

 

to advocate we splash big now is probably bad timing seeing as we still have some of the hangover left from the last time we did.

 

Apologies - I took your initial post 'Lambert will have more scope in the summer as high earner x,y,z will have left'  - to mean you were hopeful of such a splash - I agree such a splash would put us back in financial terms where we were post Houllier\Mcleish - when the wages were deemed unacceptably high.(rightly or wrongly)

 

However in a football sense - lowering the wage bill isn't really cause for fans excitement.

[Oaks]

I think i remember someone at the club in the summer saying the wage bill was now at an acceptable level. Since then Makoun and Warnock have left the club. In the summer Dunne's and Petrov's contracts are both up and i don't think we will have any trouble off loading Bent and Given. Then there is Hutton, Ireland and maybe even N'Zogbia. I think that would only leave Gabby as a major earner with the scope up offer decent contracts to Benteke, Westwood, Guzan and Lowton.

 

Also the new TV deal puts an extra third into the budget.

Edited April 11, 2013 by Oaks

[Richard]

makoun - will be sitting on his contract till expiry anyway

?? 'Twas announced recently he's going to Rennes permanently from 1 July

Not seen this,  good news if so