chrisp65 Posted August 14, 2013 Share Posted August 14, 2013 Also I think Richard Dawkins is a truly detestable individual, and is more closeminded and arrogant than many of the dogmatic folk he confronts. Why? I found the tone of The God Delusion to be so self-congratulatory I had to stop reading it. Made it about 100 pages into it. What has resparked my dislike for him is an interview I watched yesterday where he spoke to a doctor who was championing the idea that controlled drug trials should not be considered absolutely reliable when it comes to predicting how a patient would respond to a drug, and instead he felt that the person's state of mind and other such factors should be taken into account, i.e. the parts of the person that cannot be gleaned by measuring the extent of their illness. Dawkins thought that this was an absolute affront to science and that he was effectively dealing with a homeopath. He would not entertain for a moment that there might other non strictly medical factors at work in whether or not a person would respond to a drug and was very dismissive of any of the doctor's points. The show was called Enemies of Reason, so from the outset, Dawkins was assuming he was correct in all of his views. It was far from a debate and more of a Louis Theroux documentary where he meets an idiot and treats him like one. Dawkins kept returning to the title of the doctor's brand of medicine, which included the word quantum. When he was failing with a point, he'd return to the fact that the doctor had stolen the word quantum from 'real science' and branded his own faux-science with it. Also the way it was cut meant that Dawkins was given a chance to think about every question before he asked it, perhaps consulting with experts behind the scenes, while the doctor was having to answer questions as they were aimed at him. Anyway the interview is here, so you can make up your own mind about it, but it just further added to my dislike for the man, who sees things in the colours of absolute atheism and everything else, when I think this is certainly not the case. Sure organised religion is bollocks, but that doesn't mean that everything that has not been revealed by science yet, and possibly those things that will never be revealed by science due to the limits of the human brain is to be dismissed as all part of the same crap sandwich. Fair enough, although I think the fact that he has become the spokesman for non-belief in a world of believers affords him a bit of slack. Obviously he's not the first atheist/agnostic in the history, but I admire him for making a point of saying what the rest of us are thinking. Like him or not, I think he's a force for good. Until someone else steps up, he'll do as far as I'm concerned. a sort of messiah for those that lack imagination and a sense of place but love strict rules and somebody being in charge? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YLN Posted August 14, 2013 Share Posted August 14, 2013 Who is April? I think she was Devon's assistant in Knight Rider for a while. Ah I thought it was the friend of the Ninja Turtles. Yillan, I'm assuming that while you aren't a fan of organised religion but would I also be right in assuming you believe in God? Absolutely not. No man in the sky. Just forces around us that we are wholly unaware of, and will probably never be fully aware of. Forms of non-biological life maybe, or whatever string theory is... In terms of him being a spokesperson for non-believers, he's a spokesperson for people who believe and agree with what he says. Not for me though. Maybe we non believers need a figure head, our own Jesus that we can look to for arguments when it comes to debating with a religion enthusiast (which is not something that should ever be done), but I'd be more inclined to look within for reasons why you don't think a god is real, rather than relying on anything scientific. We're not going to convince Christians that Jesus didn't walk on water by measuring surface tension. I'm calling for a more benevolent leader. Say Stephen Fry? Someone whose openmindedness does not only extend to not believing in organised religion and from there becomes tightly shut, pinning his wagon to what science has published and considering everything else to be plagues and locusts 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CrackpotForeigner Posted August 14, 2013 Share Posted August 14, 2013 a sort of messiah for those that lack imagination and a sense of place but love strict rules and somebody being in charge? No, no sort of messiah. Nobody's endowing him with supernatural powers or descent from deities. A leader for those who lack bravery and a way with words but love sensible suggestions and somebody to act as a figurehead for their views. (See what I did?) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrisp65 Posted August 14, 2013 Share Posted August 14, 2013 a sort of messiah for those that lack imagination and a sense of place but love strict rules and somebody being in charge? No, no sort of messiah. Nobody's endowing him with supernatural powers or descent from deities. A leader for those who lack bravery and a way with words but love sensible suggestions and somebody to act as a figurehead for their views. (See what I did?) yeah, you sucked all the trolling fun out of it! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjmooney Posted August 14, 2013 Author VT Supporter Share Posted August 14, 2013 Don't follow leaders. Watch the parking meters. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CrackpotForeigner Posted August 14, 2013 Share Posted August 14, 2013 yeah, you sucked all the trolling fun out of it! Goo on, you can troll better than that, I know you've got it in you. In return I'll try not to be a fun-sucker-outer. Don't follow leaders. Watch the parking meters. Wise words, particularly the parking meters bit. I'm not advocating following any leaders fwiw, not even Dawkins, but I am glad that he's taken a public stance on the subject, and in that sense he is a leader of sorts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TrentVilla Posted August 14, 2013 Moderator Share Posted August 14, 2013 We're not going to convince Christians that Jesus didn't walk on water by measuring surface tension. I'm calling for a more benevolent leader. Say Stephen Fry? Someone whose openmindedness does not only extend to not believing in organised religion and from there becomes tightly shut, pinning his wagon to what science has published and considering everything else to be plagues and locusts Thanks for the clarification on your stance, I was wondering if your view on Dawkins was a result of a belief in one of the sky fairies, thanks for clearing that one up. Love the line about surface tension by the way. I guess the problem is that nobody is ever going to convince Christians that anything other than their beliefs are right, even digging up giant dinosaur skeletons and carbon dating doesn't seem to make them doubt the good book. It is, in my view, the lack of reason and the lack of a collective or individual open mind or an ability for religious people to think past their indoctrination and to think for themselves that results in someone like Dawkins being so dogmatic. Dawkins clings to science yet his opposition cling to the collective writings of... well we don't actually know... from several thousand years ago. I don't really blame Dawkins for his stance and actually applaud him for taking on religion the way he does when all too many people are afraid to do so. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morley_crosses_to_Withe Posted August 14, 2013 Share Posted August 14, 2013 Yillan, cracking posts about Dawkins. I agree! I also stopped reading the God Delusion for the same reason. I'm sure he wrote it whilst strumming over a reflection of himself in the mirror. He's a condescending, self back slapping, narrow minded word removed of the highest order. P.S I don't believe in sky fairies. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Risso Posted August 14, 2013 Share Posted August 14, 2013 Same here Trent. People don't like him because he makes them look stupid. Christpher Hitchens was similar in his outlook. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjmooney Posted August 14, 2013 Author VT Supporter Share Posted August 14, 2013 I agree with just about everything Dawkins says. However, there is certainly something unlikeable about him. His manner is rather grating and he comes across as smug - which is a pity. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morley_crosses_to_Withe Posted August 14, 2013 Share Posted August 14, 2013 However, there is certainly something unlikeable about him. His manner is rather grating and he comes across as smug - which is a pity. I totally agree. The message, generally, is a good one, but his execution is horrid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Risso Posted August 14, 2013 Share Posted August 14, 2013 However, there is certainly something unlikeable about him. His manner is rather grating and he comes across as smug - which is a pity. I totally agree. The message, generally, is a good one, but his execution is horrid. He gets everybody talking about his methods, so I'd argue that they are spot on. He's the most famous person pushing the atheist message, and I think it's entirely because of how he chooses to discuss things. Good on him, I say. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
legov Posted August 14, 2013 Share Posted August 14, 2013 I agree with just about everything Dawkins says. However, there is certainly something unlikeable about him. His manner is rather grating and he comes across as smug - which is a pity. I don't find him unlikeable at all, but I can easily see why the vast majority of theists would. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Risso Posted August 14, 2013 Share Posted August 14, 2013 Exactly Legov, he's doing his job quite nicely. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brumerican Posted August 14, 2013 Share Posted August 14, 2013 Dawkins wishes he was this awesome. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mQorzOS-F6w 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kingfisher Posted August 14, 2013 Share Posted August 14, 2013 Hitchens was a moron. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brumerican Posted August 14, 2013 Share Posted August 14, 2013 Hitchens was a moron. Sure . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AVFCforever1991 Posted August 14, 2013 Share Posted August 14, 2013 Sagan > Everyone else. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kingfisher Posted August 14, 2013 Share Posted August 14, 2013 Hitchens was a moron. Sure . He was one of the right wing media's biggest spokesman for a violent foreign policy which resulted in wars, invasions and millions of deaths. A policy which has been an unmitigated failure. He 'apparently' thought they were just and right wars against what he perceived to be the craziness of Islam. What a fool, if he did, and what a fool because it wasn't, and what a gift he was to the Fox network and the Neocon crusade OF terror. He was obsessed with defying religion, and missed what's fundamental, an enlightened intellectual he was not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CarewsEyebrowDesigner Posted August 14, 2013 Share Posted August 14, 2013 (edited) To suggest he was right wing displays an alarming amount of ignorance. In later years he certainly stood his ground as seeing the threat of Islamic fundamentalism as the main threat to our way of life and as such he curried favour with politicians on both sides of the fence, but he did it out of a hatred for totalitarianism, a hatred which underlies his criticism of organised religion and a personal, ever watchful god. Edited August 14, 2013 by CarewsEyebrowDesigner Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts