PussEKatt Posted August 1, 2012 Share Posted August 1, 2012 It's a tough one, because if you truly do want to lose the game, which they obviously did, how do you motivate yourself to try and win it? It's a strange thought to be honest and I'm not sure I've ever been in that situation. You are missing the point.The reason they lost is because they want to win.They decided to lose this event so that they could win the next one and then go on to gold. Nope, I think it's you that has missed the point. My point is if they've decided to lose this event so that they can win the next one, but the rules (or the "spirit") say that they HAVE to try and win every match, how do they then motivate themselves to win a match that they clearly want to lose? I did`nt know that the rules stated that you had to try and win ? that blows strategy right out of the water. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stevo985 Posted August 1, 2012 VT Supporter Share Posted August 1, 2012 It's a tough one, because if you truly do want to lose the game, which they obviously did, how do you motivate yourself to try and win it? It's a strange thought to be honest and I'm not sure I've ever been in that situation. You are missing the point.The reason they lost is because they want to win.They decided to lose this event so that they could win the next one and then go on to gold. Nope, I think it's you that has missed the point. My point is if they've decided to lose this event so that they can win the next one, but the rules (or the "spirit") say that they HAVE to try and win every match, how do they then motivate themselves to win a match that they clearly want to lose? I did`nt know that the rules stated that you had to try and win ? that blows strategy right out of the water. Well I don't know if it's actually in the rules, but the whole point of the controversy is that they didn't try and win. That's why this whole debate is happening. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BOF Posted August 1, 2012 Moderator Share Posted August 1, 2012 It's not explicitly in the rules. So they've been disqualified for not breaking a rule that's not written. *shrug* I dunno. Am I mental? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tegis Posted August 1, 2012 VT Supporter Share Posted August 1, 2012 Dangerous precedent IMO. So if you by chance play below par due to a cold you can get chucked out because a judge has an opinion. Not liking this Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon Posted August 1, 2012 Share Posted August 1, 2012 I'm not sure about this, but I've heard somewhere that the Badminton players may have been chucked out Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
briggaman Posted August 1, 2012 Share Posted August 1, 2012 Surely it's pretty much the same thing as match fixing? That isn't allowed so I agree that this shouldn't be. At least if you're going to do it then don't make it blatantly obvious. They did and are being punished for it... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon Posted August 1, 2012 Share Posted August 1, 2012 It's not explicitly in the rules. So they've been disqualified for not breaking a rule that's not written. *shrug* I dunno. Am I mental? Nope. I'm with you Bri. It's nonsense, although I did expect this decision, due to the 'outrage' of W*nkers like Coe Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
will87 Posted August 1, 2012 Share Posted August 1, 2012 The Chinese pair were nailed on winners as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon Posted August 1, 2012 Share Posted August 1, 2012 Surely it's pretty much the same thing as match fixing? Eh? :? It's not nothing like it at all. The match was/is not fixed. 2 teams both played to lose, as opposed to 2 teams both playing to win. Both teams wanted to 'lose'. So where's the fix? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
briggaman Posted August 1, 2012 Share Posted August 1, 2012 Surely it's pretty much the same thing as match fixing? Eh? :? It's not nothing like it at all. The match was/is not fixed. 2 teams both played to lose, as opposed to 2 teams both playing to win. Both teams wanted to 'lose'. So where's the fix? Yes it is exactly like match fixing. I didn't say it was fixed. I said "pretty much the same thing", which it clearly is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon Posted August 1, 2012 Share Posted August 1, 2012 Dangerous precedent IMO. So if you by chance play below par due to a cold you can get chucked out because a judge has an opinion. Not liking this Agreed teggers. It's a dangerous and 'populist' ruling that sets a dangerous precedent. We don't think you did your best, so we're disqualifying you. You eased down in your heat to get a different lane - disqualified! I'd focus my attention on why the matches were not all starting at the same time. Would have got round this problem entirely, surely (like they do in football) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HongKongVillan Posted August 1, 2012 VT Supporter Share Posted August 1, 2012 Although I have no problem seeing the badminton players being chucked out, but isn't this the same as team GB cyclists teaming up to help Cavandish to win (although it failed but this was publically admitted by the cyclists), this in itself is against the Olympic spirit surely, and should they be chucked out too? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LondonLax Posted August 1, 2012 Share Posted August 1, 2012 Well it IS written in the rules that you must play to win. The Ref had warned them during the match that they were contravening the rule. Trying to fix a result by throwing a match goes against the spirit as well. I bet they are wishing they had just given it a go now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon Posted August 1, 2012 Share Posted August 1, 2012 Surely it's pretty much the same thing as match fixing? Eh? :? It's not nothing like it at all. The match was/is not fixed. 2 teams both played to lose, as opposed to 2 teams both playing to win. Both teams wanted to 'lose'. So where's the fix? Yes it is exactly like match fixing. I didn't say it was fixed. I said "pretty much the same thing", which it clearly is. so both teams are trying to 'fix' the result in their favour! Just like when they are trying to win! 2 teams trying to match fix different results, is like match fixing, although it's obviously completely not. You argument/point/drivel seems devoid of logic, so I'll leave you to your nonsensical wanderings. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon Posted August 1, 2012 Share Posted August 1, 2012 I've heard that the badminton players have been chucked out! :shock: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Genie Posted August 1, 2012 Share Posted August 1, 2012 I bet they are wishing they had just given it a go now. Or done a better job of disguising what they were trying to do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drat01 Posted August 1, 2012 Share Posted August 1, 2012 Dangerous precedent IMO. So if you by chance play below par due to a cold you can get chucked out because a judge has an opinion. Not liking this Agreed teggers. It's a dangerous and 'populist' ruling that sets a dangerous precedent. We don't think you did your best, so we're disqualifying you. You eased down in your heat to get a different lane - disqualified! I'd focus my attention on why the matches were not all starting at the same time. Would have got round this problem entirely, surely (like they do in football) No Jon - they have been disqualified (a decision supported by their own countries so it seems) for "conducting oneself in a manner that is clearly abusive or detrimental to the sport". in addition to the "not trying" charge. The way they went about things was wrong, there is "not trying" and there is "really not trying". As said previously I saw a boxer the other day who looked like he was in London for a shopping trip. He got a few boos from the crowd and he lost. But at least he did throw some punches and gave some effort which in turn entertained a paying public. The badminton players were very much guilty of trying to lose which is against the ethics of the Olympics and they did not hide the facts. People would have purchased tickets etc assuming they would have seen two keenly competitive matches but what they saw was a scandalous attempt to lose which cannot be good for the sport of badminton nor the Olympics in general. I personally am very happy they have been dealt with by disqualification Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ED Posted August 1, 2012 Share Posted August 1, 2012 I've heard that the badminton players have been chucked out! :shock: Rory Delap Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stevo985 Posted August 1, 2012 VT Supporter Share Posted August 1, 2012 Surely it's pretty much the same thing as match fixing? Eh? :? It's not nothing like it at all. The match was/is not fixed. 2 teams both played to lose, as opposed to 2 teams both playing to win. Both teams wanted to 'lose'. So where's the fix? Yes it is exactly like match fixing. I didn't say it was fixed. I said "pretty much the same thing", which it clearly is. so both teams are trying to 'fix' the result in their favour! Just like when they are trying to win! 2 teams trying to match fix different results, is like match fixing, although it's obviously completely not. You argument/point/drivel seems devoid of logic, so I'll leave you to your nonsensical wanderings. Sorry Jon, but I think he's making perfect sense and you've been rather harsh here. I agree that they shouldn't have been thrown out. But it is "pretty much like" match fixing, in that they're trying to lose a game. Doesn't matter that 2 teams are doing it at the same time. it's still an effort to throw a game and that is LIKE (but not exactly the same as) match fixing Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon Posted August 1, 2012 Share Posted August 1, 2012 Well it IS written in the rules that you must play to win. Really. Do you have that rule to hand, as I'd be interested to see it. You have to 'play to win' in the heats/qualifiers too, surely. So, an athlete easing down in a heat, to qualify 2nd or 3rd, is clearly not 'trying to win' that heat, and should be kicked out? Dangerous ground here IMO. Whilst it isn't 'match fixing' (as both sides are trying to 'fix' different results - be that to win or lose) it is what teams have done for years, not just in the olympics. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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