ChrisNichollsToe Posted September 8, 2011 Share Posted September 8, 2011 To give both credit, Randy and O'Neill had a proper good go at getting Champions League football. Fact is we missed out and you can't sustain that level of spending without actually getting in the Champions League, unless your owner is willing to keep donating 10s of millions out of his own pocket. Randy isn't, which is fair enough. What O'Neill should never have done is leave so close to the start of the season and leave us in the shit. You can not sustain that level of spending even if you get into the champions league. Ask Spurs and Everton :winkold: You have to spend bigger to just to try and stay in there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PauloBarnesi Posted September 8, 2011 Share Posted September 8, 2011 I wouldnt call Oneills transfer policy wreckless personally. He made a few mistakes, but everyone does. At the end of the day, he assembled a squad who currently make up most of the england team. Well thats all well and good if it can be afforded. We couldnt. Spending money you dont have, well thats reckless. Still, not his money, not his club, why should he care? Then, when the game is up, and the money runs out, and all you've done with 'most of the England team' is finish sixth, you can run off, not your problem any more. If he was doing it to protect his reputation then that was a massive fail wasnt it? His reputation went down the toilet just about as fast as Randy's bank balance. Strikes me its just as easy to say that Randy didn’t have a business plan properly worked out; perhaps he made promises he couldn’t keep? Maybe he overestimated revenue streams? Maybe he promised money he couldn’t deliver or wasn’t prepared to deliver when the downturn began? Certainly what happened post MON suggests that Randy and the gang aren’t as savvy as we thought. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zatman Posted September 8, 2011 Share Posted September 8, 2011 Davies, NRC, Cuellar all played their part and at times have been first team regulars. Dont let the last season of his tenure cloud your judgement. thats nearly 25 million pound on 3 players. They should be doing more than playing their part and for them prices should be regular first teamers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shillzz Posted September 8, 2011 Share Posted September 8, 2011 Indeed. Randy should have atleast considered the consequences of failing to qualify for the champions league within the alloted time that he had given to Oneill (in terms of financial backing). I completely understand the point about changing direction through sensible financial operation, but there should have been a plan communicated throughout Lerner's tenure. A plan that was transparent enough to the likes of Oneill that he would have already known the likely consequences of failure to qualify for the champions league, so that he might then have thought a little more carefully about his purchases in the first place. Oneill said himself that he barely spoke with Lerner towards the latter stages of his time with us. It wouldnt have taken too much effort for Lerner to spell out the likely consequences of qualification failure to Oneill. Atleast then, if he wanted to bottle it, he could have done it in at a sensible time, rather than days before the start of the new season having just been told that he wouldnt be given the Milner money to re-invest. Lerner has taken us on a financial rollercoaster ride. Heavy investment for a number of years, then heavy divestment to follow. This is no way to run any business as far as I am concerned. If money was going to be such a limiting factor in the present years, then we shouldnt have been ploughing money into Habib Beye, Mosaics, Pubs and free sponsorship in years gone past. There has been a massive lack of transparency and communication from the board, to the fans, with regards to their aims for the club. It wouldnt surprise me in the slightest if Oneill suffered the same lack of dialogue and only found out about the financial state of play when he tried to re-invest the Milner money. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PB Posted September 8, 2011 Share Posted September 8, 2011 Strikes me its just as easy to say that Randy didn’t have a business plan properly worked out; perhaps he made promises he couldn’t keep? Maybe he overestimated revenue streams? Maybe he promised money he couldn’t deliver or wasn’t prepared to deliver when the downturn began? Certainly what happened post MON suggests that Randy and the gang aren’t as savvy as we thought. I accept all of that. I dont think randy is all that savvy. I just also dont think O'Neill was quite the genius his reputation made him out to be. As was said, we gave it a shot, didnt make it; we had a Champions league wage and transfer budget, and a Europa League qualification. Either Lerner kept on moving money in or he stopped. As it happens, he seems to have had little choice other than to stop, as he isnt anything like as rich as he was when he took over (and to be fair to him, events in the world financially would have been unforeseeable at the time he took over Villa). Does any of that justify O'Neill stomping off? I just dont see it, especially not at the time he did, especially not after a preseason that he reportedly just didnt really turn up for in any meaningful way. That smacks, to me, of a deliberately vindictive act. Of course, we'll likely never know what was said between the two, so can only speculate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DelboyVilla Posted September 9, 2011 Share Posted September 9, 2011 When you consider what has happened with transfers since Oneill left us, it's really not that difficult to figure out why he decided to quit AVFC. how? id say the fact Eck hasnt had much to spend was because of MON reckless transfer policy. MON was only asked to tidy up the wage bill which seems reasonable when he helped spiral it out of control. I personally think MON quit as he knew he wouldnt get 6th again and was protecting his reputation so he quit 5 days before the start of the season to protect his reputation :? And got paid compensation too boot???? At the end of the day he got compo because the club either broke the conditions of his contract or treated him unfairly in the eyes of the employment laws!! Now we don't know what happened but I doubt asking to reduce the wage bill and sell some of the deadwood would constitute a breach of either of these and would be something far more serious. We will have to wait for MON's memoirs to find out me thinks?? Maybe Faulkner tried sharing his ginger manlove with MON??? We may never find out?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
holtelower Posted September 9, 2011 Share Posted September 9, 2011 this just goes round and round in circles. Why dont everyone just wait and see how it all turns out - coz, we havent got a clue yet. I hear "boring" "defensive" etc... Quite frankly, I dont give a rats arse as long as we win. We can score in the first minute then park the bus for all I care as long as I get a trip to Wembley at the end of it. Put it this way A manager who was known as up and coming, plays attractive football, a born winner, highly successful, managed high profile stars, played and won at the highest level Think David O'Leary A guy known as being a long ball, dour manager, who bought below average players and made them into a workman like team. Never won anything, and only ever managed small clubs where he did a very good job. Think both Graham Taylor and John Gregory Which ones turned out the best appointments. I did not want McLeish due to the Blues connection, but now he is here, I will give him every chance, and especially as I cant see anything he has done wrong so far ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Delphinho123 Posted September 9, 2011 Author Share Posted September 9, 2011 this just goes round and round in circles. Why dont everyone just wait and see how it all turns out - coz, we havent got a clue yet. I hear "boring" "defensive" etc... Quite frankly, I dont give a rats arse as long as we win. We can score in the first minute then park the bus for all I care as long as I get a trip to Wembley at the end of it. Put it this way A manager who was known as up and coming, plays attractive football, a born winner, highly successful, managed high profile stars, played and won at the highest level Think David O'Leary A guy known as being a long ball, dour manager, who bought below average players and made them into a workman like team. Never won anything, and only ever managed small clubs where he did a very good job. Think both Graham Taylor and John Gregory Which ones turned out the best appointments. I did not want McLeish due to the Blues connection, but now he is here, I will give him every chance, and especially as I cant see anything he has done wrong so far ! To be fair, a good post. Im too harsh on the bloke considering he hasnt been here a while. I just see similarites already to the boring relegation football he instilled in the last job he had. I wish he'd give Bannan a chance. I really wanna see what this kid is about because everytime i've seen him play i've been very impressed. The problem at Villa goes beyond Mcleish and people know that. The board have no idea how to run a football club and the consistently embarrassing decisions just keep on coming. UptheVilla. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NowDoINotLikeThat Posted September 9, 2011 Share Posted September 9, 2011 The problem at Villa goes beyond Mcleish and people know that. The board have no idea how to run a football club and the consistently embarrassing decisions just keep on coming. UptheVilla. Key points. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DelboyVilla Posted September 9, 2011 Share Posted September 9, 2011 The problem at Villa goes beyond Mcleish and people know that. The board have no idea how to run a football club and the consistently embarrassing decisions just keep on coming. UptheVilla. Key points. Sums it up well IMO! And I think we are going through the same thing as the Browns fans have had to endure for quite a few years now! Which shows that even when they know the sport well they still fail when it comes to running the club! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ozvillafan Posted September 9, 2011 VT Supporter Share Posted September 9, 2011 I did not want McLeish due to the Blues connection, but now he is here, I will give him every chance, and especially as I cant see anything he has done wrong so far ! That sums it up for me. I'd much preferred to hang on to Houllier but that is now history. McLeish is now the manager and he deserves at least 2 years to put his stamp on things. I wish him all the best. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AVFC-Prideofbrum Posted September 16, 2011 Share Posted September 16, 2011 Given gab us comments, I chained my mind on John Orr and now glad he didn't stay. I love gabby. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smetrov Posted September 16, 2011 Share Posted September 16, 2011 One theory I heard about MON - was that he was never given guidelines by Lerner as to what could be afforded and what couldn't. This may explain the wild fluctuation in his purchases -ie the frugal purchases of Harewood, Knight - when most thought we had the clout to go higher. Then the other extreme of Beye, Cueller, Warnock - not bad players ...but the fees were well OTT. Given how lerner communicates with us .......why should we assume he is any different with his managers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AVFC-Prideofbrum Posted September 17, 2011 Share Posted September 17, 2011 One theory I heard about MON - was that he was never given guidelines by Lerner as to what could be afforded and what couldn't. This may explain the wild fluctuation in his purchases -ie the frugal purchases of Harewood, Knight - when most thought we had the clout to go higher. Then the other extreme of Beye, Cueller, Warnock - not bad players ...but the fees were well OTT. Given how lerner communicates with us .......why should we assume he is any different with his managers because the manager and customer are completely different ... what a daft thing to say. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hercs23 Posted September 19, 2011 Share Posted September 19, 2011 Looks like it was a wise decision to get rid of houllier when we did. he says he is still only 85% and will probably never manage again. http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/football/14978948.stm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VamosMiAstonVilla Posted September 19, 2011 Share Posted September 19, 2011 From that article re: Gabby Houllier defended McAllister, saying: "I was a bit surprised that one of the players was having a go at his training sessions. "Because, truly, he is a modern, very up-to-date and very good coach. In fact, some players really improved. "We could see some progress in Ashley Young and Stewart Downing in the way they played and the way they even increased their technical abilities." ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Spot on there I said this all along Ash definitely improved last season, and we all know Downing did. Under Houllier we were going forward. Under Mcleish we are going nowhere. Great to hear from GED though :angel: Hope he's well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
markavfc40 Posted September 19, 2011 Share Posted September 19, 2011 he says he is still only 85% and will probably never manage again. Wise decision as even at 100% he was a useless ****. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mantis Posted September 19, 2011 Share Posted September 19, 2011 he says he is still only 85% and will probably never manage again. Wise decision as even at 100% he was a useless ****.He wasn't though. You may have your views on him as a Villa manager but as a manager in general he was pretty good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
briny_ear Posted September 19, 2011 Share Posted September 19, 2011 He was the worst manager we've had for a while and his claims of a personal role in improving Young and Downing are self-aggrandising fantasy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mantis Posted September 19, 2011 Share Posted September 19, 2011 Well, he was worse than the guy before him but that's about it. Hard to compare the two reigns though as one lasted 9 months and the other last 4 years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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