duke313 Posted January 26, 2023 Share Posted January 26, 2023 3 minutes ago, nick76 said: It also could hurt us short term not getting Europe. Not able to attract players we want in the summer and/or players like Martinez and Kamara courted by bigger clubs. The argument goes both ways. I don’t think we are getting a Europe league place but we are 3 points off it’s 18 games to go, maybe some quality additions now make the difference and then in the summer we figure how we cope with the extra games….certainly a nice problem to have. If we buy a couple of additions then at least they are settled ready for the charge next season even if we don’t make Europe this season. If they are available now, we'll sign them. If they're not, we won't. 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jas10 Posted January 26, 2023 Share Posted January 26, 2023 until the window slams shut… 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HKP90 Posted January 26, 2023 VT Supporter Share Posted January 26, 2023 4 minutes ago, Made In Aston said: It's the same every window. The bed wetters go into full panic mode with a week to go, even though we could announce multiple transfers on deadline day if we wanted to. Deals sometimes go to the wire because of gamesmanship or waiting for dependent deals to happen,but they choose to ignore this fact! Tell me, what are your expectations for the rest of the season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nick76 Posted January 26, 2023 Share Posted January 26, 2023 4 minutes ago, DCJonah said: There seems to be a similar attitude sneaking in that appeared during Deano's 2nd season. Where some are acting like football will end in a few years and we have to finish in European places right now. There is some truth in that though. With Newcastle joining the top six, likely massive investment over the next couple of years, those European places seem further and further away. Somebody can always sneak in but it’s getting harder. Brighton, Fulham and Brentford are above Liverpool and Chelsea at the moment but you can just see that’ll reverse over the next few months despite how poor they are currently playing. So it’s not football ending just the elite shop is dominating. We still have the opportunity of sneaking in and building a solid base of European football over the next five years and especially the cash that comes with it but as time goes on outside of that it becomes harder and then more of our better players like Martinez and Kamara will get poached. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nick76 Posted January 26, 2023 Share Posted January 26, 2023 5 minutes ago, Jas10 said: until the window slams shut… People said that in the summer, and our last two incoming was Bednarek and Dendoncker 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
markc Posted January 26, 2023 Share Posted January 26, 2023 7 minutes ago, nick76 said: Always a potential problem but at the same time, we are told not to buy the players because we aren’t in Europe so can’t have that level of squad. Also the level or quality we want are more likely to come if we have Europe…not as much as CL qualification but more likely than having no European football at all. I think it’s also defeatist thinking it’s better not to have European football and the extra games. Surely let’s get European football and then figure how we cope with it. We have the elite manager who is used to playing in many competitions unlike many of the clubs you are probably thinking of like West Ham, so I trust in him. This is where I’m at. I can only see positives in qualifying for Europe this season. It’s not until next year, we can strengthen accordingly in the summer if we do. It will help attract better players to the club. It will help us keep the players we want at the club when the vultures come circling. It moves us forward, it helps us sell ‘the project’. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nick76 Posted January 26, 2023 Share Posted January 26, 2023 8 minutes ago, Made In Aston said: It's the same every window. The bed wetters go into full panic mode with a week to go, even though we could announce multiple transfers on deadline day if we wanted to. Deals sometimes go to the wire because of gamesmanship or waiting for dependent deals to happen,but they choose to ignore this fact! Bedwetters? Why be offensive? I’m no bedwetter, I’m just eager to take this opportunity we have given our league position of 3 points off Europe. Do I think our current squad is good enough to get European place? No but a couple of additions could make a difference. Deals sometimes do go to the wire, you are right. Many more deals on deadline day are desperation deals which we don’t want. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobzy Posted January 26, 2023 Share Posted January 26, 2023 26 minutes ago, nick76 said: Yes January is not as good as the summer window but there is still a window in which good deals can be done and are being done. Also for our new manager to get in players that fit his style and also weaknesses in our team. I feel it’s just as infuriating that fans who almost give up the second half of the season, literally 3 points off a European place with 18 games to go when another quality player or two can really make a difference for a push to those spots in the league. So I would argue it’s not impatience but seeing the opportunity now. But then you're expecting a new player/new players to just settle straight away and be great straight away, right? Which fairly rarely happens. You can already see the bedding in needed with Alex Moreno; who may well turn out to be a good purchase. Overpaying for the sake of getting player(s) in in January and expecting them to come good is a risky approach. It's absolutely impatience. We've got a better shot at Europe next season having (hopefully) not had a poor start to the season. The players we've already got (largely, Ings has left) have got us to where we are and improved already under Emery. It's absolutely impatience to be saying "this isn't good enough, we need more NOW". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobzy Posted January 26, 2023 Share Posted January 26, 2023 18 minutes ago, nick76 said: It also could hurt us short term not getting Europe. Not able to attract players we want in the summer and/or players like Martinez and Kamara courted by bigger clubs. The argument goes both ways. I don’t think we are getting a Europe league place but we are 3 points off it’s 18 games to go, maybe some quality additions now make the difference and then in the summer we figure how we cope with the extra games….certainly a nice problem to have. If we buy a couple of additions then at least they are settled ready for the charge next season even if we don’t make Europe this season. We attracted exactly the players you've stated whilst not having European football. Both are on long term deals. If anyone wants to court them, they'll be paying a vast amount - and that's a good thing for us! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
picicata Posted January 26, 2023 Share Posted January 26, 2023 15 minutes ago, Made In Aston said: It's the same every window. The bed wetters go into full panic mode with a week to go, even though we could announce multiple transfers on deadline day if we wanted to. Deals sometimes go to the wire because of gamesmanship or waiting for dependent deals to happen,but they choose to ignore this fact! I read an article earlier that stated that by this date last January only a quarter of the eventual spend of the premier League had been spent. The last week will be busier than the rest of the month combined and by some distance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Indigo Posted January 26, 2023 Share Posted January 26, 2023 Honestly I see more moaning about panicking than actual panicking half the time. Feel like some folk need to calm down even more than the people they're telling to calm down Will be interesting to see how things play out, we've had so many things come out of the blue in recent times that I don't think there's any way you can be confident one way or the other. I'd be surprised if a winger doesn't come in being that Emery specified one as a priority, and the squad is quite threadbare in that area of the pitch at the moment. As much as folk are saying we could get lucky with injuries and be fine for the rest of the season, five subs has introduced a new dynamic and you're more likely to pay for it now than previously if you have a dearth of options in your squad. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
messi11 Posted January 26, 2023 Author Share Posted January 26, 2023 49 minutes ago, bobzy said: January is the shittest month to do business. We have a decent squad already. The impatience involved in football is so infuriating. Chelsea, Arsenal, Southampton, Leeds and Bournemouth disagree. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HKP90 Posted January 26, 2023 VT Supporter Share Posted January 26, 2023 1 minute ago, bobzy said: We attracted exactly the players you've stated whilst not having European football. Both are on long term deals. If anyone wants to court them, they'll be paying a vast amount - and that's a good thing for us! In fairness that's 2 players from a squad of 25. There are always exceptions. Look at the players the top teams are attracting (ie Mudryk). If it is to be believed (and obviously there is a huge pinch of salt involved here) several of our ambitious targets have turned us down. I think mostly the links are nonsense, but I would expect at least a flicker of flame where there is smoke. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobzy Posted January 26, 2023 Share Posted January 26, 2023 Just now, messi11 said: Chelsea, Arsenal, Southampton, Leeds and Bournemouth disagree. Look at their situations - one club who needs to drastically improve to get their necessary top 4 status, one team challenging for the title and three who are fighting against relegation. They're all desperate to some extent (less so Arsenal, I'd argue) so the risk is worth it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
duke313 Posted January 26, 2023 Share Posted January 26, 2023 1 minute ago, picicata said: I read an article earlier that stated that by this date last January only a quarter of the eventual spend of the premier League had been spent. The last week will be busier than the rest of the month combined and by some distance. Chelsea in for a busy week then. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Folski Posted January 26, 2023 Share Posted January 26, 2023 15 minutes ago, nick76 said: It also could hurt us short term not getting Europe. Not able to attract players we want in the summer and/or players like Martinez and Kamara courted by bigger clubs. The argument goes both ways. I don’t think we are getting a Europe league place but we are 3 points off it’s 18 games to go, maybe some quality additions now make the difference and then in the summer we figure how we cope with the extra games….certainly a nice problem to have. If we buy a couple of additions then at least they are settled ready for the charge next season even if we don’t make Europe this season. Ok but historically who have we actually bought in January that's done well. 2022 Digne - £25m clearly now 2nd choice left back just 12 months later, likely on a big contract and few potential suitors. Chambers - Free also told he can go by the looks of things. 2021 Sanson - £14m just gone on loan has had no real impact. 2020 Samatta - £8.5m managed a total of 14 games for us Baston - Free waste of time 2019 Kalinic - total disaster Guilbert - I liked him but managers didn't 2018 N/A 2017 Bjarnason, Bree, Hourihan, Taylor, Hogan - mostly flops Conor did well. 2016 Cole & Senderon 2015 Gil & Sinclair 1 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Made In Aston Posted January 26, 2023 Share Posted January 26, 2023 10 minutes ago, nick76 said: There is some truth in that though. With Newcastle joining the top six, likely massive investment over the next couple of years, those European places seem further and further away. Somebody can always sneak in but it’s getting harder. Brighton, Fulham and Brentford are above Liverpool and Chelsea at the moment but you can just see that’ll reverse over the next few months despite how poor they are currently playing. So it’s not football ending just the elite shop is dominating. We still have the opportunity of sneaking in and building a solid base of European football over the next five years and especially the cash that comes with it but as time goes on outside of that it becomes harder and then more of our better players like Martinez and Kamara will get poached. How will we get into Europe next year or the year after if it is such a closed shop?! Qualifying for the europa league this year makes no difference in attracting 'next level' players. You only have to look at recent qualifiers and winners like West ham, Leicester, sevilla and Villareal to see that it hasn't pushed them forwards. We can attract europa quality players now as we have the Premier league money. We won't attract champions league players unless we are in the competition or manage to convince the occasional gem like Kamara. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PieFacE Posted January 26, 2023 VT Supporter Share Posted January 26, 2023 (edited) 4 minutes ago, messi11 said: Chelsea, Arsenal, Southampton, Leeds and Bournemouth disagree. Other than Chelsea, we've signed the same amount or more players than these teams so far this window. Just adding for perspective. Edited January 26, 2023 by PieFacE Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nick76 Posted January 26, 2023 Share Posted January 26, 2023 Just now, bobzy said: But then you're expecting a new player/new players to just settle straight away and be great straight away, right? Which fairly rarely happens. You can already see the bedding in needed with Alex Moreno; who may well turn out to be a good purchase. Overpaying for the sake of getting player(s) in in January and expecting them to come good is a risky approach. It's absolutely impatience. We've got a better shot at Europe next season having (hopefully) not had a poor start to the season. The players we've already got (largely, Ings has left) have got us to where we are and improved already under Emery. It's absolutely impatience to be saying "this isn't good enough, we need more NOW". 1) I never said overpay, to be honest I don’t even know what overpay means in the modern football market. For example if we are only willing to pay £35m for Guendouzi but Marseille want £40m, is then caving now overpaying? I agree if it was £60m but what is overpaying. 2) I also agree that players coming might not be great straight away but that’s fine by me if they are, they will be by the start of next season whereas waiting for them until the summer, then buying them, then they need time to settle. 3) we have a better chance of europe next season? Maybe true but Chelsea and Liverpool aren’t going to be as poor as this season, I’m guessing Spurs won’t, Arsenal are just getting stronger and City are just a machine. Newcastle will likely invest heavily. Yes we will be starting better because of Emery but the European teams ie the big six and Newcastle are going to be much stronger. I don’t think it’s a given we have a better shot next season because we maybe better but our rivals certainly will be better. 4) I never said “this isn’t good enough, we need more now”, I think we’ve done fabulous to get back in the mix but we have weaknesses and this isn’t Emery’s team. A few quality additions could sneak us in European places give how poor Liverpool and Chelsea are. It’s an opportunity, however small. So I don’t think it’s impatience, it’s seeing the opportunity and eager to try. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jas10 Posted January 26, 2023 Share Posted January 26, 2023 16 minutes ago, nick76 said: People said that in the summer, and our last two incoming was Bednarek and Dendoncker Dark days of the Scouser… Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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