Genie Posted December 8, 2021 Share Posted December 8, 2021 9 minutes ago, tinker said: I want a choice , we live in democratic society. that's more important to me. I don't want governments dictating medical procedures on anyone , especially this government. But you’ve accepted that it will reduce the likelihood of getting severely ill. Plus nobody is being told they have to have it, they can produce a negative lateral flow test result instead of a covid passport. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tinker Posted December 8, 2021 VT Supporter Share Posted December 8, 2021 6 minutes ago, sidcow said: Well I like your explanation about vaccine efficacy a lot better than the official line. Problem is there are all these highly qualified experts who have dedicated their lives to studying disease and vaccines are telling me that the single most important thing I can do is get a booster jab. I just wanted to be absolutely sure before I ignored them and followed your thought process that you were equally well qualified and not some random on the Internet spouting absolute bollocks. It's not about the procedure being affective it's being forced to have it or be singled out by exclusion that's the issue. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjmooney Posted December 8, 2021 VT Supporter Share Posted December 8, 2021 10 minutes ago, tinker said: I want a choice , we live in democratic society. that's more important to me. Living in a democratic society does not mean everybody can just do what they want. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
richp999 Posted December 8, 2021 Share Posted December 8, 2021 1 minute ago, a m ole said: I’m not interested in arguing any of the rest of the post but this particular but gave me a giggle - that’s exactly what the booster jabs are for, when your immunity wanes So you definitely won’t be having any of those useless boosters unless of course you might need a booster So tell me, what was the result of your antibody test, the one you did before you had your booster ? The one that would tell you what your immunity level was, which you surely did before knowing you needed this booster right now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xela Posted December 8, 2021 Share Posted December 8, 2021 I've had 2 vaccines and will have a booster in due course, but I fundamentally disagree in mandatory vaccinations for the population. There is something despotic about that and I don't want to live in a society like that. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trekka Posted December 8, 2021 VT Supporter Share Posted December 8, 2021 2 minutes ago, a m ole said: I’m not interested in arguing any of the rest of the post but this particular but gave me a giggle - that’s exactly what the booster jabs are for, when your immunity wanes So you definitely won’t be having any of those useless boosters unless of course you might need a booster (or, and I'm definitely not saying it is absolutely true as I don't want to start a big debate here but when proof of boosters are needed to enter certain establishments and football stadia for example). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Genie Posted December 8, 2021 Share Posted December 8, 2021 (edited) 6 minutes ago, tinker said: First they break the rules and laugh and then they ask you to have a medical procedure or become an outcast and people just accept it blindly believing in these clowns. Medical procedure? That’s a little bit OTT. If you want to go to a gig then as you walk in you show them your covid passport or negative lateral flow test result. Who is an outcast? Edited December 8, 2021 by Genie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tinker Posted December 8, 2021 VT Supporter Share Posted December 8, 2021 Just now, mjmooney said: Living in a democratic society does not mean everybody can just do what they want. It' means that you have a choice to have or not have medical procedures without being discriminated against. It's a principal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
choffer Posted December 8, 2021 VT Supporter Share Posted December 8, 2021 6 minutes ago, richp999 said: I'm not asking or telling you to even read my though process, let alone follow it. I've seen your posts on here for years, and thought you had your own mind and were capable of independent thinking, but then i am spouting absolute bollocks I suppose. So unless someone agrees with you, they’re not capable of independent thinking? That’s an interesting perspective. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tinker Posted December 8, 2021 VT Supporter Share Posted December 8, 2021 2 minutes ago, Genie said: Medical procedure? That’s a little bit OTT. If you want to go to a gig then as you walk in you show them your covid passport of negative lateral flow test result. Who is an outcast? What medical school did you go to? 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bickster Posted December 8, 2021 Moderator Share Posted December 8, 2021 5 minutes ago, richp999 said: And you forgot to answer the question ? It wasn't worthy of a reply. Emotive questions about putting your own children into an imaginary scenario that currently is not going to happen are really not worth answering. And as evidence of it not being a likely scenario, I give you your very first statement. You are choosing not to have the booster. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Genie Posted December 8, 2021 Share Posted December 8, 2021 Just now, tinker said: What medical school did you go to? How is that relevant? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sidcow Posted December 8, 2021 VT Supporter Share Posted December 8, 2021 (edited) 22 minutes ago, richp999 said: I've seen your posts on here for years, and thought you had your own mind and were capable of independent thinking, but then i am spouting absolute bollocks I suppose. Thanks for that somewhat backhanded compliment. Part of, a huge part of independent thinking is to establish which are likely to be correct facts and which are likely to be incorrect facts. So asking for your medical qualifications is a pretty fundamental question to ask if I'm to give serious thought to your claim that vaccines still have strong efficacy and boosters are not needed. You gotta help me out on that. I'm kind of loath to ignore what pretty much every noted scientist is saying unless I think there maybe some factual basis in what you say. And the problem is, when you come out and say stuff like that, like it or not you WILL be applying soft influence over others. Your comment will be one other little factoid someone will absorb when making a deadly serious decision. Unfortunately that type of person is likely to be someone who doesn't apply critical thinking and is easily influenced. Edited December 8, 2021 by sidcow Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xela Posted December 8, 2021 Share Posted December 8, 2021 Correct me if I'm wrong here... but the vaccine doesn't stop you getting covid does it? It just minimises the effect, meaning its no worse, potentially, than a cold? Plenty of people in this thread have had covid, post vaccines. If so, why does it matter if someone else doesn't want the jab? It's their own choice/risk surely? Or am I looking at it too simplistically? I've been in pubs/bars over the last few weeks and i'm not fussed if people in there have been jabbed or not. I know I have and thats what matters to me. I don't want to see people being excluded from these places because of their vaccine preference. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tinker Posted December 8, 2021 VT Supporter Share Posted December 8, 2021 6 minutes ago, Genie said: Medical procedure? That’s a little bit OTT. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sidcow Posted December 8, 2021 VT Supporter Share Posted December 8, 2021 7 minutes ago, tinker said: It's not about the procedure being affective it's being forced to have it or be singled out by exclusion that's the issue. No, he said "For me, I've had 2 jabs, wont be having anymore. They are simply not needed. Maybe in a year or two when my immunity wanes perhaps." 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Genie Posted December 8, 2021 Share Posted December 8, 2021 (edited) 3 minutes ago, tinker said: Why not just call it a jab, injection or vaccine like everyone else? Ref the point about being an outcast, who is treated as an outcast if everyone has to present something before entering a venue? Either a passport or negative test result? Edited December 8, 2021 by Genie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bickster Posted December 8, 2021 Moderator Share Posted December 8, 2021 9 minutes ago, tinker said: It' means that you have a choice to have or not have medical procedures without being discriminated against. It's a principal. No, it absolutely isn't. There are very many democratic countries that you cannot enter unless you have the correct vaccinations. It is not a principal of democracy You are correct that you should have the choice whether or not to have a vaccine but that decision should be weighed up with what having that vaccine will or won't allow you to do, that is part of your decision making in a democracy Democracy does not equate to total freedom to do what you want, never has been and never will be 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sidcow Posted December 8, 2021 VT Supporter Share Posted December 8, 2021 13 minutes ago, tinker said: First they break the rules and laugh and then they ask you to have a medical procedure or become an outcast and people just accept it blindly believing in these clowns. Which one of Jonathan Van-Tam and Chris Whitty have broken the rules? They are the qualified people advising you you really should have a jab. You think these guys are clowns? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
richp999 Posted December 8, 2021 Share Posted December 8, 2021 3 minutes ago, choffer said: So unless someone agrees with you, they’re not capable of independent thinking? That’s an interesting perspective. Not at all. I don't expect anyone to agree with me! I also don't expect people to blindly follow what they hear from the BBC, or any other expert. Sure, research and find out as much as you can for yourself. None of us are chemists/biologists etc, so you have to try and find out as much as you can from sources you trust. Then make your *own* choice. Don't just do something because boris johnson tells you to. Like he's a trustworthy fellow. If on the balance of your research, you think its best to go one way, then do it. Just don't force anyone else to. That's all. Let people make up their own mind - and if someone makes a different choice to you , however mad their reasoning might be to you , then it's their choice and you should defend their ability to make it. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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