FrenchVillaLova Posted April 24, 2017 Share Posted April 24, 2017 4 minutes ago, HanoiVillan said: #alternativefacts It joined in 1966, so you're a way out there. France is one of the founding members of NATO, in 1948. De Gaulle withdrew in 1966. It fully-rejoined the integrated command in 2009. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HanoiVillan Posted April 24, 2017 Share Posted April 24, 2017 2 minutes ago, FrenchVillaLova said: France is one of the founding members of NATO, in 1948. De Gaulle withdrew in 1966. It fully-rejoined the integrated command in 2009. Huh, well, waddaya know. Fair do's Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tonyh29 Posted April 24, 2017 Share Posted April 24, 2017 6 minutes ago, FrenchVillaLova said: France is one of the founding members of NATO, in 1948. De Gaulle withdrew in 1966. It fully-rejoined the integrated command in 2009. Pedant alert NATO wasn't formed until 1949 ..you're thinking of the WEU but that was purely a European pact and thus not NATO 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Awol Posted April 24, 2017 Share Posted April 24, 2017 1 hour ago, FrenchVillaLova said: Well France only joined NATO in 2009 under Sarkozy, so it's hardly a historical member... France temporarily withdrew from the NATO command structure but remained and remains an independent pillar of the western alliance as part of the P3 at the UN and a bilateral military alliance with the UK. At no point since WW2 has France had a leader who openly courted Moscow in preference to the order that has kept Western Europe free and at peace. Le Pen is poison. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FrenchVillaLova Posted April 24, 2017 Share Posted April 24, 2017 25 minutes ago, Awol said: France temporarily withdrew from the NATO command structure but remained and remains an independent pillar of the western alliance as part of the P3 at the UN and a bilateral military alliance with the UK. At no point since WW2 has France had a leader who openly courted Moscow in preference to the order that has kept Western Europe free and at peace. Le Pen is poison. I'm not saying she's not. She'd be very dangerous, but for me it would be for different reasons (dumping the euro, social unrest...). That said, if you have a closer look at Macron - his mentors, the financial interests behind him, his populist attitude - it makes you wonder what he will lead France to. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OutByEaster? Posted April 24, 2017 Moderator Share Posted April 24, 2017 Tough choice, extreme right wing social policy or extreme right wing economy. I guess the economy is less immediately damaging and at least you're on the same boat as everyone else. Hate or greed? For us, Macron is probably more worrying - he'll reduce tax to business and become a genuine competitor to us in the race to the bottom - if he's better than we are, business will leave; if he's not, we'll have to live poorer to keep them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amsterdam_Neil_D Posted April 24, 2017 Share Posted April 24, 2017 1 hour ago, tonyh29 said: WEU Is that a "A female ghost with large drooping breasts" Or have I go the spelling wrong ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StefanAVFC Posted April 24, 2017 Author Share Posted April 24, 2017 14 minutes ago, Amsterdam_Neil_D said: Is that a "A female ghost with large drooping breasts" Or have I go the spelling wrong ? That's wewe 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amsterdam_Neil_D Posted April 24, 2017 Share Posted April 24, 2017 Just now, StefanAVFC said: That's wewe Thanks mate, I feel a bit of a fool now Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sid4ever Posted April 24, 2017 Share Posted April 24, 2017 Le Pen steps aside as leader of FN before the 2nd round, is this an admission that she could not win? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snowychap Posted April 24, 2017 Share Posted April 24, 2017 30 minutes ago, Sid4ever said: Le Pen steps aside as leader of FN before the 2nd round, is this an admission that she could not win? It's a bizarrely desperate attempt to win the run off, I guess. What's she going to do? Try and reinvent herself as an all inclusive nothing to do with FN really candidate in the next 13 days? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ml1dch Posted April 24, 2017 Share Posted April 24, 2017 (edited) 6 hours ago, TreeVillan said: It's amazing how many people on here want Macron to win, seeing as he stated he will punish the British public for choosing to leave the EU. Astonishingly, people see preventing the return of fascism to Western Europe as something more important than indulging a bunch of infantile morons who think that diplomacy and international politics is some sort of jovial game. Edited April 24, 2017 by ml1dch 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amsterdam_Neil_D Posted April 25, 2017 Share Posted April 25, 2017 9 hours ago, ml1dch said: Astonishingly, people see preventing the return of fascism to Western Europe as something more important than indulging a bunch of infantile morons who think that diplomacy and international politics is some sort of jovial game. Agreed but the problem with French system is that you can end up with 2 idiots neither up to the job IMO. They have to vote for Macron but deep down I think they know he isn't the right man for the job either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Awol Posted April 25, 2017 Share Posted April 25, 2017 1 hour ago, Amsterdam_Neil_D said: Agreed but the problem with French system is that you can end up with 2 idiots neither up to the job IMO. They have to vote for Macron but deep down I think they know he isn't the right man for the job either. Problem of finding good political leadership applies in many major western countries. Clinton or Trump, May or Corbyn, etc. I blame lead water pipes back in the day. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amsterdam_Neil_D Posted April 25, 2017 Share Posted April 25, 2017 38 minutes ago, Awol said: I blame lead water pipes back in the day. Ia that when tomatoes had lead in ? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villakram Posted April 26, 2017 Share Posted April 26, 2017 So it appears that Macron's older wife was originally his teacher at age 15, and they got officially together as soon as it was legal. This is news to me as there's no way this wouldn't be huge news over here. I guess if they're happy it's ok, but boy oh boy are the optics pretty bad. I know the French are stereotypically a tolerant bunch around such things, but I'm somewhat surprised he's been able to avoid tabloid assassination over this. Plenty of room for Le Pen to get dirty! https://www.theguardian.com/world/shortcuts/2017/apr/25/macron-marriage-age-gap-french-presidential-ageism-sexism "Yet the relationship is tricky from a gender relativist point of view; if Madame Macron were a male drama teacher, leaving his marriage for a student whom he met when she was 15, then, even if they waited until she (the hypothetical student) were 18, as the Macrons did in real life, the feminist would still have a thing or two to say." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Awol Posted May 6, 2017 Share Posted May 6, 2017 Apparently these Macron leaks have been traced back to the Russian GRU linked botnets that were so prolific during the Trump campaign. Lots of forged or doctored document mixed in with real stuff and released minutes before the French media ban on election coverage and discussion kicked in. No doubt Macron will still walk it but interesting that Moscow is still so brazen about this kind of thing. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snowychap Posted May 7, 2017 Share Posted May 7, 2017 Beeb are saying Macron with 65%: Quote Centrist Emmanuel Macron beats Marine Le Pen to the French presidency, winning about 65 of the vote, according to a projection by Kantar Public One Point-TF1-RTL Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chindie Posted May 7, 2017 VT Supporter Share Posted May 7, 2017 I suppose anything is better than the far right. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Awol Posted May 7, 2017 Share Posted May 7, 2017 29 minutes ago, snowychap said: Beeb are saying Macron with 65%: That's the good news, bad news is 11M French are so pissed off they voted for fascism in drag. In addition 12% spoiled ballots, another 4M voters. Europe writ large just dodged a bullet but it should trigger some serious soul searching. I suspect we'll see triumphalism instead and the problem will continue to grow. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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