terrytini Posted February 25, 2017 Share Posted February 25, 2017 That's what I said about Moyes Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
terrytini Posted February 25, 2017 Share Posted February 25, 2017 We are all aware of the desirability of stability blah blah it's not like all those wanting Bruce out don't understand that. Its just that those who want him to stay appear to think stability without results or progress is ok, that somehow stability of itself is the key. It never has been, it isn't now, and it never will be. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRO Posted February 25, 2017 Share Posted February 25, 2017 2 minutes ago, terrytini said: If Bruce gets us relegated the best thing that could happen is that we keep him ? I honestly cant beleive what one or two are thinking !!! Oh and by the way the 'negativity' as you call it is nothing of the sort. I am very positive that if they sack Bruce we will do better. It coukd easily be argued that the negative view is the one that says the best we can do is retain a Manager who gets us relegated !! What he is saying Terry is we have to stop taking the "tablets" and let the ailment take its fling and work it out of your system. To be fair.....We have constantly took tablets ( changing managers) and it hasn't worked. I would just like to know what are these " tablets "( new managers) with the certain cure? 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
terrytini Posted February 25, 2017 Share Posted February 25, 2017 TRO I know that's what he is saying, we all know it. But the question is WHO is the one you stick with and WHY them ? Our record under Bruce is already poor and getting worse. Taking the premise that we got relegated that means between now and May we would do even worse. How on earth would that constitute the WHY to keep Bruce ? It doesn't matter how often we change Managers if we change them because they fail. What would be madness would be keeping them if they fail. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRO Posted February 25, 2017 Share Posted February 25, 2017 (edited) 1 hour ago, terrytini said: We are all aware of the desirability of stability blah blah it's not like all those wanting Bruce out don't understand that. Its just that those who want him to stay appear to think stability without results or progress is ok, that somehow stability of itself is the key. It never has been, it isn't now, and it never will be. No Terry your are wrong in your assumption. We/He are/is not saying, Stability for the sake of it or anything remotely like that......He knows from close quarters the work SB is doing or he should. What we are saying is.....There is a mammoth amount wrong, it will take him time to plough through all the evils.....some will have a knock on effect, some will take longer, they can't all be addressed at the same time......hence time. There is far from one fault here.....any manager needs webbed feet here, to put all the fires out. With results as they are it does seem a difficult call.....but I thinks its right. I think Steve Bruce will fix this. Edited February 25, 2017 by TRO 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tommo_b Posted February 25, 2017 Share Posted February 25, 2017 I honestly think with stability will come results and performances, this season has turned out too choppy, how many players in and out, how many coaching staff in and out, etc. Results and performances aren't going to be great for the rest of the season, we will stay up, but until we have had that stability and players are settled and actually friends off the pitch as well, then I believe need to accept we need to actually give this set up a chance first and foremost. Knowing Bruce does have the tools and know how to get out of this league surely should grant him at least a crack at a preseason with his own squad, then if it hasn't improved sack him after 11 games and rinse and repeat what we have done the last few years, leading to the position we are in now. I would've kept di Mattel for longer too personally, perhaps I'm more patient and like to be optimistic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
terrytini Posted February 25, 2017 Share Posted February 25, 2017 The very notion that keeping Bruce if he got us relegated is absolutely 100% bonkers (and Wuness knows it). 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
terrytini Posted February 25, 2017 Share Posted February 25, 2017 (edited) 4 minutes ago, TRO said: No Terry your are wrong in your assumption. We are not saying, Stability for the sake of it or anything remotely like that. What we are saying is.....There is a mammoth amount wrong, it will take him time to plough through all the evils.....some will have a knock on effect, some will take longer, they can't all be addressed at the same time......hence time. There is far from one fault her......any manager needs webbed feet here, to put all the fires out. No no no a thousand times no I'm not unaware of what you are saying NOBODY is unaware that we have lots to sort out. An idiot could see that? It's not the issue. The issue is whether you retain a failing Manager. And nobody does not at Villa, not in any Football Club, any sports club, any job, anywhere. Edited February 25, 2017 by terrytini 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRO Posted February 25, 2017 Share Posted February 25, 2017 2 minutes ago, terrytini said: The very notion that keeping Bruce if he got us relegated is absolutely 100% bonkers (and Wuness knows it). Well lets not embroil ourselves in a hypothetical scenario......when match day madness is enough to be getting on with. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tommo_b Posted February 25, 2017 Share Posted February 25, 2017 Wyness knows we won't get relegated, it's actually a very smart comment to make in regards to the team and it's morale, these players that have signed want to play for Bruce not some other manager that they didn't choose to sign for. I wouldn't get hung up on that comment, its like a reverse bluff. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
terrytini Posted February 25, 2017 Share Posted February 25, 2017 1 minute ago, TRO said: Well lets not embroil ourselves in a hypothetical scenario......when match day madness is enough to be getting on with. Er, that's the debate ( in this thread) because we are debating our CEOs comments. Personally I agree, it shouldn't be a debate - because he shouldn't have said it. He should have simply said there is no way we will be relegated. But he didn't, and at a time when people are thinking of whether or not to renew STs for next season it now matters. I have certainly put my decision on hold because there is no way I could support a decision to keep Bruce, under several circumstances, butt certainly not if he takes us down Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRO Posted February 25, 2017 Share Posted February 25, 2017 1 minute ago, terrytini said: No no no a thousand times no I'm not unaware of what you are saying NOBODY is unaware that we have lots to sort out. An idiot could see that? It's not the issue. The issue is whether you retain a failing Manager. And nobody does not at Villa, not in any Football Club, any sports club, any job, anywhere. I'm talking about on the pitch.....If you don't think there are lots to sort out you must be watching a very different Villa Team to me.....its mammoth, what has to be fixed. We have had all these failing managers.....and there is nothing to suggest the successful ones you have in your head.....will actually succeed where the last lot have failed.....there is nothing to suggest that at all......This frustrating call you feel against stability is no more frustrating than we hear to keep changing managers with absolutely no evidence that anything will change there either. There is no white Knight to save us......anymore than the present manager could get a turn for the better.....but a new one is more likely to want to change players again.....more disruption and more time required. Its vicious circle.....we have to break. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRO Posted February 25, 2017 Share Posted February 25, 2017 5 minutes ago, terrytini said: Er, that's the debate ( in this thread) because we are debating our CEOs comments. Personally I agree, it shouldn't be a debate - because he shouldn't have said it. He should have simply said there is no way we will be relegated. But he didn't, and at a time when people are thinking of whether or not to renew STs for next season it now matters. I have certainly put my decision on hold because there is no way I could support a decision to keep Bruce, under several circumstances, butt certainly not if he takes us down Why debate Relegation, when we are not there yet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
terrytini Posted February 25, 2017 Share Posted February 25, 2017 There aren't millions of problems just the same ones that every team has and good managers fix them and failing ones don't. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
terrytini Posted February 25, 2017 Share Posted February 25, 2017 Just now, TRO said: Why debate Relegation, when we are not there yet. Again, because in this thread we are debating the comments of the CEO, I would think that's clear enough ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRO Posted February 25, 2017 Share Posted February 25, 2017 12 minutes ago, terrytini said: No no no a thousand times no I'm not unaware of what you are saying NOBODY is unaware that we have lots to sort out. An idiot could see that? It's not the issue. The issue is whether you retain a failing Manager. And nobody does not at Villa, not in any Football Club, any sports club, any job, anywhere. No nobody retains a failing manager in any organisation granted..... but when you have changed 4 or 5 maybe its not surprising that another tree seems the best option to bark at. Lets be fair here Terry, its not like he has been here 2 or 3 years its 4-5 months, with not exactly a duck pond to swim in......In his eyes he is still WIP Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRO Posted February 25, 2017 Share Posted February 25, 2017 (edited) 6 minutes ago, terrytini said: There aren't millions of problems just the same ones that every team has and good managers fix them and failing ones don't. So, why did arguably the best manager in the world a few years ago.....take so long to get his " Bed" straight.....He was nearly sacked., and the rest is history. Edited February 25, 2017 by TRO Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tommo_b Posted February 25, 2017 Share Posted February 25, 2017 I think his comments were the right thing to say, very smart. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
terrytini Posted February 25, 2017 Share Posted February 25, 2017 But I think your logic is massively flawed. You keep referring to how many Managers we've had. But if you take it rationally we had Lambert who worked under strangled investment and a disinterested owner until he was burnt out. We then made two daft appointments in Sherwood and Garde. Appointments made on the cheap by a disinterested owner. And we got what we deserved. Are you really saying that IN ANY WAY getting rid of those two had cost us ANYTHING ? Because I don't know anyone who thinks so. So none of those three guys getting sacked CONTRIBUTED to our demise, they were part of the cause. Which leaves RDM and Bruce. Neither of whom have produced an even tolerable level of results or signs of progress. So effectively we are no different than any side. We've a failing Manager and he isn't a special case so we do what every club does. It doesn't guarantee the next guy will succeed? No club can guarantee that when they sack a failing Manager, but all clubs do it because they know their only chance of getting a successful guy is to get rid of an unsuccessful guy . Its simple really, and has been the way of the football world since forever. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
terrytini Posted February 25, 2017 Share Posted February 25, 2017 4 minutes ago, Tommo_b said: I think his comments were the right thing to say, very smart. Yes I saw you thought that. I think they were very naive, at best. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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