Brumstopdogs Posted April 2, 2016 Share Posted April 2, 2016 Just now, Mantis said: So when the next manager inevitably fails with these players what then? How many managers will it take? A new manager can make a jot of difference. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mantis Posted April 2, 2016 Share Posted April 2, 2016 1 minute ago, Brumstopdogs said: A new manager can make a jot of difference. Not with this group of players. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brumstopdogs Posted April 2, 2016 Share Posted April 2, 2016 Just now, Mantis said: Not with this group of players. This group of players can still be utilised more effectively. I don't expect miracles but I expect a new manager to make some difference (your original point). Then come the summer hopefully they'll be able to make even more difference and re-build the mess that they have inherited. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Mantis Posted April 2, 2016 Popular Post Share Posted April 2, 2016 1 minute ago, Brumstopdogs said: This group of players can still be utilised more effectively. I don't expect miracles but I expect a new manager to make some difference (your original point). Then come the summer hopefully they'll be able to make even more difference and re-build the mess that they have inherited. So you're telling me that you actually want to see many of these players as part of the team next season? No offence but that's absolute madness. I honestly don't understand how you can so easily criticise managers and lose faith in them but still continue to have faith in such abject and pathetic players? 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mykeyb Posted April 2, 2016 Share Posted April 2, 2016 The balance can be changed in the summer, a new keeper and a decent striker would make a difference. Some players we won't be able to shift but they can be utilised from the bench. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brumstopdogs Posted April 2, 2016 Share Posted April 2, 2016 (edited) 6 minutes ago, Mantis said: So you're telling me that you actually want to see many of these players as part of the team next season? No offence but that's absolute madness. I honestly don't understand how you can so easily criticise managers and lose faith in them but still continue to have faith in such abject and pathetic players? In an ideal world it would be great if we could get rid of most of the squad. In the real world this is unlikely to happen so the new manager will have to get better performances out of those that remain and supplement the squad with players we can bring in. In addition to that our approach to games could well improve under a new manager. Better tactics, right players playing, better organisation, actually trying to attack teams for example. Garde was woeful - he got rightly sacked by our board. Black is out of his depth. The new manager will have a lot to deal with but he'll do well to make more of a shambles of the job than those two. Edited April 2, 2016 by Brumstopdogs Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zatman Posted April 2, 2016 Share Posted April 2, 2016 6 minutes ago, Mantis said: So you're telling me that you actually want to see many of these players as part of the team next season? No offence but that's absolute madness. I honestly don't understand how you can so easily criticise managers and lose faith in them but still continue to have faith in such abject and pathetic players? dont want to see them but I imagine we will be stuck with a lot of them Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lexicon Posted April 2, 2016 Share Posted April 2, 2016 So he won't getting the job on a permanent basis then. Fine by me - by starting Richards at CB he clearly has no idea what he's doing. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
terrytini Posted April 2, 2016 Share Posted April 2, 2016 8 minutes ago, Mantis said: So you're telling me that you actually want to see many of these players as part of the team next season? No offence but that's absolute madness. I honestly don't understand how you can so easily criticise managers and lose faith in them but still continue to have faith in such abject and pathetic players? I sort of agree with your sentiment but they are not ALL rubbish. Some are genuinely bad apples, some past it, some lack the skills (ok, most), some are just now badlty affected by the whole thing.......... but if we can remove the real real dross, and especially those who affect the overall mood, then a decent Manager could add a goalscorer, a playmaker , a keeper, and a couple of others, and make a go of it. He will have to, we cant sack the whole squad. Example ? Okay, (risky area as any player mentioned invites an avalanche)... Gestede ? No known bad attitude, certain strengths in Championship, which, if played to, could work ? Clark ? same as above ? Gana ? Ok, I'm not doing it !!! But I suspect there are maybe 10 players, and add 4 kids (including Gardner), and then add 6 buys to that ? I'm not an expert, just suggesting how it could go. That's why Id like to see the new guy in soon - he needs to see all that up close. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mantis Posted April 2, 2016 Share Posted April 2, 2016 7 minutes ago, Brumstopdogs said: In an ideal world it would be great if we could get rid of most of the squad. In the real world this is unlikely to happen so the new manager will have to get better performances out of those that remain and supplement the squad with players we can bring in. In addition to that our approach to games could well improve under a new manager. Better tactics, right players playing, better organisation, actually trying to attack teams for example. Garde was woeful - he got rightly sacked by our board. Black is out of his depth. The new manager will have a lot to deal with but he'll do well to make more of a shambles of the job than those two. At this stage it's hard to say but it almost seems like you want to keep most of these players which I find odd. The club should do its utmost to get rid of most of them and if the bad eggs can't be sold then they should be isolated from the first team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mantis Posted April 2, 2016 Share Posted April 2, 2016 2 minutes ago, terrytini said: I sort of agree with your sentiment but they are not ALL rubbish. Some are genuinely bad apples, some past it, some lack the skills (ok, most), some are just now badlty affected by the whole thing.......... but if we can remove the real real dross, and especially those who affect the overall mood, then a decent Manager could add a goalscorer, a playmaker , a keeper, and a couple of others, and make a go of it. He will have to, we cant sack the whole squad. Example ? Okay, (risky area as any player mentioned invites an avalanche)... Gestede ? No known bad attitude, certain strengths in Championship, which, if played to, could work ? Clark ? same as above ? Gana ? Ok, I'm not doing it !!! But I suspect there are maybe 10 players, and add 4 kids (including Gardner), and then add 6 buys to that ? I'm not an expert, just suggesting how it could go. That's why Id like to see the new guy in soon - he needs to see all that up close. I never said they were all rubbish did I? There's definitely quite a few that need to be got rid of though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brumstopdogs Posted April 2, 2016 Share Posted April 2, 2016 (edited) 3 minutes ago, Mantis said: At this stage it's hard to say but it almost seems like you want to keep most of these players which I find odd. The club should do its utmost to get rid of most of them and if the bad eggs can't be sold then they should be isolated from the first team. No, I can confirm I do not want to keep most of the players! What I do want is a manager, whoever it is, to manage them in the most effective way. We have not had that for a while. Edited April 2, 2016 by Brumstopdogs Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
deamie Posted April 2, 2016 Share Posted April 2, 2016 Poor, didn't do anything different to garde ...played 3 defensive midfielders, played Gestede who is a passenger if you don't utilise his heading ability...Gil is not a wide player! Failed to make subs until it's too late....very very poor, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mantis Posted April 2, 2016 Share Posted April 2, 2016 1 minute ago, Brumstopdogs said: No, I can confirm I do not want to keep most of the players! What I do want is a manager, whoever it is, to manage them in the most effective way. We have not had that for a while. My point was that with this group of players you simply won't get a manager who will be able to manage them effectively because they're a shit group of players with incredibly weak mentalities. The first priority should be getting rid of people like Agbonlahor, Richards, Lescott, Hutton, Sinclair, Guzan etc 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brumstopdogs Posted April 2, 2016 Share Posted April 2, 2016 Just now, Mantis said: My point was that with this group of players you simply won't get a manager who will be able to manage them effectively because they're a shit group of players with incredibly weak mentalities. The first priority should be getting rid of people like Agbonlahor, Richards, Lescott, Hutton, Sinclair, Guzan etc I agree that all of those players (add Westwood to the list) would ideally be got rid of. However, regardless, we don't have to play Richards at centre back, we don't have to play 3 defensive central midfielders, we don't have to have so few runners from midfield as examples. A new manager could arguably make an improvement to these kind of areas - a positive difference however small it is. Anyway back on topic - not impressed from what I have seen from Black so far but appreciate he has been thrown in to the situation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mantis Posted April 2, 2016 Share Posted April 2, 2016 1 minute ago, Brumstopdogs said: I agree that all of those players (add Westwood to the list) would ideally be got rid of. However, regardless, we don't have to play Richards at centre back, we don't have to play 3 defensive central midfielders, we don't have to have so few runners from midfield as examples. A new manager could arguably make an improvement to these kind of areas - a positive difference however small it is. Anyway back on topic - not impressed from what I have seen from Black so far but appreciate he has been thrown in to the situation. We don't have to play Richards at all. Same goes for shit like Lescott, Bacuna, Hutton etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brumstopdogs Posted April 2, 2016 Share Posted April 2, 2016 Just now, Mantis said: We don't have to play Richards at all. Same goes for shit like Lescott, Bacuna, Hutton etc. So if we don't have to play them and we are doing presumably a new manager coming in could make a jot of difference by not playing them? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mantis Posted April 2, 2016 Share Posted April 2, 2016 (edited) 2 minutes ago, Brumstopdogs said: So if we don't have to play them and we are doing presumably a new manager coming in could make a jot of difference by not playing them? Because you can't buy players mid-season. I don't agree with Black's decision to start some of those players but there aren't many other options at the moment. Edited April 2, 2016 by Mantis Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brumstopdogs Posted April 2, 2016 Share Posted April 2, 2016 Sadly true hence the reason we need to be better organised, have better tactics and not be so defensively set up. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AntrimBlack Posted April 2, 2016 Share Posted April 2, 2016 Black says he does not want the permanent manager's job. Good decision, Eric, for you and for us. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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