OutByEaster? Posted October 30, 2020 Moderator Share Posted October 30, 2020 I think you're right on the failure of the current government to find policies that resonate with the new voters they picked up at the last election - largely I guess because they lied through their teeth to them in order to get their votes. I can't agree with this though: Quote It's been clear for a while that the magic formula to win elections is left on the economy, right on values/culture. I think since Thatcher first took power the UK has maintained a single underlying policy on the economy, it's your now standard neo-liberal market based economic theory; smaller state, concentrated financial power in private hands, a corporate banquet with trickle down crumbs - I'd say given that its focus is on taking money out of the public sphere and into the private, and that its aim is to effectively reduce the role of the state and remove social measures, that it would be considered a right wing economic policy. I guess it fits into the debate on the usefulness of the terms left and right wing, but it'd be very hard to argue that it's a "left" economic model. Anyway, that's won every election since 1975 and indeed only Corbyn has really proposed deviation from it in the last thirty years - I think it's very difficult to suggest that the magic formula for winning elections is the opposite of what's won the last dozen or so. Culturally, I think you're right on the effect that patriotism can and does have on election victories, but it's important to remember how and where that patriotism is defined - a huge chunk of the nation respect the patriotic values of the Mail, the Express and the Sun, and they influence the debate on national identity in other media and in the house - successive election winners have recognised the value of aligning themselves with the owners of those papers rather than the people whose views they influence. If you want to win an election on patriotism, making friends with Mr Murdoch and co is the thing - Starmer is definitely working on making the party more palatable to that group. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Awol Posted October 30, 2020 Share Posted October 30, 2020 2 hours ago, Xann said: Is yours Russia? You sold the UK down the pan. Congratulations on reaching stage 2, only 3 more to go. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xann Posted October 30, 2020 Share Posted October 30, 2020 (edited) 6 minutes ago, Awol said: Congratulations on reaching stage 2, only 3 more to go. We've exchanged views before, and they're there to be read. I think it's likely you'll leave the country to the disaster you've sown. Edited October 30, 2020 by Xann Doh Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Awol Posted October 30, 2020 Share Posted October 30, 2020 2 minutes ago, Xann said: I think it's likely you'll leave the country to the disaster you've sewn. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StefanAVFC Posted October 30, 2020 Share Posted October 30, 2020 Brexit means Brexit Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Awol Posted October 30, 2020 Share Posted October 30, 2020 @OutByEaster? One reason the government are fighting for freedom of action on state aid in the EU deal is the plan for massive state intervention in the economy. They will shamelessly steal Labour‘s clothes on the economy, not to nationalise old industries but to seed the new ones. Whether they can afford to post-pandemic is another matter, but the intent is definitely there and it would be difficult for Labour to oppose. We’ll see when Johnson gets hoofed next year whether the old school Tories get control back, lurch right economically and sink them for good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wainy316 Posted October 30, 2020 Share Posted October 30, 2020 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post HanoiVillan Posted October 30, 2020 Popular Post Share Posted October 30, 2020 6 minutes ago, Awol said: @OutByEaster? One reason the government are fighting for freedom of action on state aid in the EU deal is the plan for massive state intervention in the economy. They will shamelessly steal Labour‘s clothes on the economy, not to nationalise old industries but to seed the new ones. Whether they can afford to post-pandemic is another matter, but the intent is definitely there I have a very fine bridge for sale, you may be curious to see it? 3 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ml1dch Posted October 30, 2020 Share Posted October 30, 2020 7 minutes ago, HanoiVillan said: I have a very fine bridge for sale, you may be curious to see it? Harsh. It's likely going to be boom time for the "shell companies recently registered by Tory SpAds in need of initial seed capital" industry. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StefanAVFC Posted October 30, 2020 Share Posted October 30, 2020 Blimey, 'The Tory Government broke international law in order to provide massive state intervention and aid domestically in the future' is not a take I expected to read this morning. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Awol Posted October 30, 2020 Share Posted October 30, 2020 4 minutes ago, StefanAVFC said: Blimey, 'The Tory Government broke international law in order to provide massive state intervention and aid domestically in the future' is not a take I expected to read this morning. Wow! Who said that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xann Posted October 30, 2020 Share Posted October 30, 2020 59 minutes ago, Awol said: Good choice! Another fantasist Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Awol Posted October 30, 2020 Share Posted October 30, 2020 3 minutes ago, Xann said: Good choice! Another fantasist 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wainy316 Posted October 30, 2020 Share Posted October 30, 2020 Another showing a Labour league. I imagine these are the first polls taking into account school meals fiasco. Yesterday’s events won’t be reflected yet which may be interesting to see. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bickster Posted October 30, 2020 Moderator Share Posted October 30, 2020 1 minute ago, Wainy316 said: Yesterday’s events won’t be reflected yet which may be interesting to see. Yesterdays events are far too niche to have an impact anyway I'd have thought. It'll only be the political nerds talking about it. The general population won't give a crap Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blandy Posted October 30, 2020 Moderator Share Posted October 30, 2020 2 hours ago, Awol said: One reason the government are fighting for freedom of action on state aid in the EU deal is the plan for massive state intervention in the economy. No chance. It's so pet little brain-fart ideas from favoured advisors like Cummins, or think-tanks, can be picked to boost their own (the oh so self regarding advisors) self-image and used as play-things. They've no intention or inclination to do "massive state intervention" in the economy. None. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blandy Posted October 30, 2020 Moderator Share Posted October 30, 2020 5 hours ago, Xann said: Is yours Russia? You sold the UK down the pan. That's a bit off, Dave. How on earth can a voter in Scotland or wherever (which ever way they vote) "sell the UK down the pan"? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StefanAVFC Posted October 30, 2020 Share Posted October 30, 2020 5 minutes ago, blandy said: That's a bit off, Dave. How on earth can a voter in Scotland or wherever (which ever way they vote) "sell the UK down the pan"? The big B word 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xann Posted October 30, 2020 Share Posted October 30, 2020 1 minute ago, blandy said: That's a bit off, Dave. How on earth can a voter in Scotland or wherever (which ever way they vote) "sell the UK down the pan"? By peddling fantasy as fact on public forums. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blandy Posted October 30, 2020 Moderator Share Posted October 30, 2020 3 minutes ago, StefanAVFC said: The big B word One vote. And that's without considering the voter's reasoning. Without getting personal, I don't agree with @Awol on the B word, but his reasoning was thoughtful, and not at all based around what is actually being done in the name of the B word by the Baby Eaters. He might be wrong (OK he is wrong ) but there's no "selling out the country" - that was done by the throbbers, whoppers and grifters in and around power that lied to us all.. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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