The Chairman Mao resembling, Monarchy hating, threat to Britain, Labour Party thread

[Awol]

Is there an English language version of this thread?

According to google translate...

A proper nutter is about to be elected Labour leader. Some people are very excited and the rest are falling about laughing or can't believe their luck - in some cases both.

If he survives until the next election MI5 will start leaking info on his acquaintances and previous activities and the Labour Party will be brutally shafted at the polls. In the meantime there will be some interesting conversations on VT.

That's about it so far.

[OutByEaster?]

 

Is there an English language version of this thread?

According to The Daily Mail..

 

A proper nutter is about to be elected Labour leader. Some people are very excited and the rest are falling about laughing or can't believe their luck - in some cases both.

If he survives until the next election MI5 will start leaking info on his acquaintances and previous activities and the Labour Party will be brutally shafted at the polls. In the meantime there will be some interesting conversations on VT.

That's about it so far.

 

Fixed.

[Awol]

Is there an English language version of this thread?

According to The Daily Mail..

A proper nutter is about to be elected Labour leader. Some people are very excited and the rest are falling about laughing or can't believe their luck - in some cases both.

If he survives until the next election MI5 will start leaking info on his acquaintances and previous activities and the Labour Party will be brutally shafted at the polls. In the meantime there will be some interesting conversations on VT.

That's about it so far.

Fixed.

Oooh, 'ark at 'er!

Cheer up, this is going to be really good fun.

[darrenm]

So someone who has quite a median view on most things is a lefty nutter?

 

I suppose having any thoughts which aren't intrinsically racist or xenophobic are laughed at these days.

[Richard]

this idea that Labour only loses elections because it's not left-wing enough.

well, that just plainly isn't the case. Thatch moved the goalposts, sadly, and so Labour had to adapt to that, or risk dying out. The uber left wing 1983 campaign was a bit if a disaster, and 1997 was slightly better as they moved further right. 1992 again an improvement, as again they moved further right. They then become full on Tory lite in 1997, and won massively. They then won 2 more elections on the Tory Lite ticket.

 

Red Ed took them a little (not much) further to the left, and they lost (though that IMO was more to do with the incompetence of Red Ed and his team, and his lack of personal appeal)

 

Seems to me that not enough of the voting public want a left wing guvmint. They want a right wing or centre-ist guvmint with a heart. Sadly, IMO, this Tory party lacks the latter.

  

Yep. I think the public in general, not just labour members, are really engaging with jez. Proper politics here we come ...

but as the public don't want a left wing government not sure how "engagement" actually works or matters. The thing about engagement with Corbyn is this.....

Tories and centre / centre right voters (those that typically elect governments ) are engaging as they see the damage he will do to the left side of the political spectrum and ensure left wing politics are nowhere near any form of government

Left wingers engage as he is their promised one, although they are in the minority

Mainstream labour supporters who believe in trying to get a Labour Party elected are not engaging.

Result, he will split the party whatever happens .

[snowychap]

If he survives until the next election MI5 will start leaking info on his acquaintances and previous activities...

I do think that the kinds of people with whom he has shared/is willing to share a platform are likely to be more damaging to him (and, if elected as leader, the labour party) than his policies but that may be more to do with the willingness of the media to look at them.

If only we'd be/have been so keen to ask searching questions about politicians' (and others') willingness to get in to bed with/be so friendly with Chinese governments/Saudi governments/Gaddafi/the Taliban/Saddam Hussein and on and on...

Edited August 14, 2015 by snowychap

[CarewsEyebrowDesigner]

I think Labour need to give up trying to be Tory lite in order to win Tory voters & start appealing to the rather significant mass of people who are disillusioned and don't vote at all. It's a risky move but if they pull it off they can win big.

 

I don't think they will have much success while they are called 'Labour' though.

Edited August 14, 2015 by CarewsEyebrowDesigner

[Awol]

So someone who has quite a median view on most things is a lefty nutter?

I suppose having any thoughts which aren't intrinsically racist or xenophobic are laughed at these days.

Median compared to what, Che G'?

Are the other Labour candidates who disagree with him a bit racist/intrinsically xenophobic, or only non Socialists?

I think we should be told.

[Awol]

If he survives until the next election MI5 will start leaking info on his acquaintances and previous activities...

I do think that the kinds of people with whom he has shared/is willing to share a platform are likely to be more damaging to him (and, if elected as leader, the labour party) than his policies but that may be more to do with the willingness of the media to look at them.

If only we'd be/have been so keen to ask searching questions about politicians' (and others') willingness to get in to bed with/be so friendly with Chinese governments/Saudi governments/Gaddafi/the Taliban/Saddam Hussein and on and on...

Yep no doubt on your general point. It's Corbyn's previous with the IRA that will do for him - IMO.

[darrenm]

 

So someone who has quite a median view on most things is a lefty nutter?

I suppose having any thoughts which aren't intrinsically racist or xenophobic are laughed at these days.

Median compared to what, Che G'?

Are the other Labour candidates who disagree with him a bit racist/intrinsically xenophobic, or only non Socialists?

I think we should be told.

 

My point was a bit of a high level jab, rather than an all encompassing review of this bloke's thoughts. I did think that was clear to be honest.

 

Kinda pointless me engaging a straw man. But here goes.

 

No, not every opinion which disagrees with Corbyn's is intrinsically racist or xenophobic.

[CarewsEyebrowDesigner]

 

Yep no doubt on your general point. It's Corbyn's previous with the IRA that will do for him - IMO.

 

 

I'm not so sure. There will be a distinct generational divide anyway. A lot of his supporters are too young to remember/care, another lot are either old enough to realise things weren't black & white, or shared his views at the time. There will of course be a large enough crowd that find it distasteful, but I don't think it'll be enough to sink him.

Edited August 14, 2015 by CarewsEyebrowDesigner

[krisagg75]

i'm not a tory or a labour/caborn supporter.i vote for whoever has the most policies i agree with,like most i suppose.i do think and hope caborn gets voted leader for the simple reason there needs to be a difference between the parties.lets be honest whoever got elected last time there would be little difference.at least caborn would guarantee this and he seems to be engaging the younger generation in politics which needs to happen.as for whether or not he would make prime minister is pure speculation as nobody really knows.if he can capture the youth vote who knows what can happen,

[Condimentalist]

 

Vote Caborn!

[snowychap]

Outdated policies not supported by the majority of the voting public.

Burton is off topic, isn't it?

[MakemineVanilla]

I don't think anyone can deny Corbyn's appeal because when you see who is against him he just looks better and better.

 

Whether it is those criminals Straw and Blair or his three rivals who all come across like they are fresh back from a weekend course in leader-speak, Corbyn just gets easier to like.

 

When you see that the Guardian has come out for Yvette Cooper (no surprise there) you begin to see how left-wing they really are (they just dispense homilies and sympathy but not much else). 

 

The Tories are telling us how happy they are to see Corbyn elected Labour leader but they are just too evidently fearful to disguise their bluff and too many of them went to too much trouble to make sure they were excluded to take their little stunt at face value.

 

Corbyn scares the b'jesus out of all these people because he talks about Marx. It is not that they are actually afraid of Marxism, they are actually terrified of big Capital's reaction to Socialist solutions than anything else, and for good reason. They realise that over the thirty years of Thatcherism and Thatcherism-lite all the power was handed over to big Capital, and most ordinary people are working a lot harder and a lot more precariously, for a lot less pay; a reality only mitigated by the cheap products of third-world sweatshops.

 

So I am just enjoying seeing the fear in the eyes of the beneficiaries of this economic and political reality and I'm enjoying every minute. 

 

Corbyn represents a real threat to middle-class privilege and that really scares people who think they matter.

[bickster]

Amusingly, the latest poll actually has JC as the most electable of the 4 candidates amongst the whole population INCLUDING Tory voters

That shuts up one line of argument then

[Mantis]

 If Corbyn is still Labour leader by the election I'll give £50 to VT if he makes Labour the largest party. Simply isn't happening (fortunately).

 

Amusingly, the latest poll actually has JC as the most electable of the 4 candidates amongst the whole population INCLUDING Tory voters

That shuts up one line of argument then

Is it this one?

 

Cooper - 20%

Burnham - 25%

Kendall - 22%

Corbyn - 32%

 

Because if it is that hardly proves Corbyn would be appealing to the wider electorate. Cooper and Burnham are relatively similar in terms of views so their vote will get split anyway. If it was a two way between Corbyn and any of the other 3 I'm pretty confident he'd lose.

[tinker]

The poll was taken in London, outside the capital his support would be greater. I do like some of of his ideas, not sure he would be good for the country though.

 

If he makes it through to the election I do think the fact hes so different to the career politicians means he could get people who wouldn't normally vote turn out.

 

Wasn't Hitler elected if similar circumstances........

Edited August 15, 2015 by tinker

[bickster]

If Corbyn is still Labour leader by the election I'll give £50 to VT if he makes Labour the largest party. Simply isn't happening (fortunately).

 

Amusingly, the latest poll actually has JC as the most electable of the 4 candidates amongst the whole population INCLUDING Tory voters

That shuts up one line of argument then

Is it this one?

 

Cooper - 20%

Burnham - 25%

Kendall - 22%

Corbyn - 32%

 

Because if it is that hardly proves Corbyn would be appealing to the wider electorate. Cooper and Burnham are relatively similar in terms of views so their vote will get split anyway. If it was a two way between Corbyn and any of the other 3 I'm pretty confident he'd lose.

Polls never prove anything BUT it what it does do is destroy the idea that Labour need to elect one of the other three to get back into power. The people of this country actually don't think that at all.

Its also pretty hilarious how many times you hear the old solutions thing from the other three but they never actually say which of his policies they are referring to. Nationalisation of the railways? Public approval for that is running into the 60% plus region, even higher for the utility companies even the majority on Conservative voters are in favour of those policies. For a good few of his policies, Corbyn is actually the politician most in tune with public opinion.

The Tories, red or blue are actually starting to shit themselves a wee bit. Its about time

[bickster]

Yvette Coopers Spinal Tap moment, its up there with the tablet of stone

Anyone who thought that was a good idea shouldn't be leading anything