Trinity-Tom Posted June 15, 2007 Share Posted June 15, 2007 TT - Even Hindu's have a set of 'rules' to follow. Personally, I'll just carry on the way I am. Trying to do the right thing and being true to myself. If that's enough, great. If not, then God is crueler than I think. They do indeed and the basis of the way you lead your life will only get you into the Hindu equivalent of heaven. All of the other religions require you to believe and practice theirs. Your last point is pertinent and why I have a problem with the Catholic teachings I was brought up on. On the one hand you are taught that God is all loving and on the other hand you are told that he will send you to hell if you don't do as your told. A loving parent would never condemn their child to enternal pain and suffering. I do believe in there being something else out there, I am just not sure what it is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trinity-Tom Posted June 15, 2007 Share Posted June 15, 2007 If you are an atheist, are you being a hypocrite be uttering the remark: "for God's sake!" or "God almighty!". also, am i right in beliveing that atheists don't necessarily deny the existence of Jesus, just that he was "notrhign sepcial" so to speak? In whcih case, we would be allowed to say "Jesus!" but not "Jesus Christ!" or "For Christ's Sake!"? Tis true Jon. I don't think there is much doubt that Jesus lived but who he was is a completely different matter. If Derren Brown was alive 2035 years ago he would have been hailed as a witch/sorcerer/messiah. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pablopicasso Posted June 15, 2007 Share Posted June 15, 2007 non practising roman catholic... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon Posted June 15, 2007 Share Posted June 15, 2007 If you are an atheist, are you being a hypocrite be uttering the remark: "for God's sake!" or "God almighty!". also, am i right in beliveing that atheists don't necessarily deny the existence of Jesus, just that he was "nothing special" so to speak? In which case, we would be allowed to say "Jesus!" but not "Jesus Christ!" or "For Christ's Sake!"? and on a related note, can an atheist Villa fan call McGrath God without it being hypocritical? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRL Posted June 15, 2007 Share Posted June 15, 2007 How can you actually defend beeing an atheist? It's quite simple I'd imagine. You don't believe in God. So you are saying there are no God whatsoever. When in fact, you dont know? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjmooney Posted June 15, 2007 VT Supporter Share Posted June 15, 2007 If you are an atheist, are you being a hypocrite be uttering the remark: "for God's sake!" or "God almighty!". also, am i right in beliveing that atheists don't necessarily deny the existence of Jesus, just that he was "nothing special" so to speak? In which case, we would be allowed to say "Jesus!" but not "Jesus Christ!" or "For Christ's Sake!"? It's a free country, we're "allowed" to say pretty much what we like. The thing about oaths and swearing, is that (apart from the bodily parts ones) they are nearly all religious, or bowdlerised from religious oaths - even the "tame" ones: Cripes = Christ Bloody = by Our Lady Strewth = God's Truth Gosh = God Blimey = God blind me etc. I have no idea whether the same is true in other cultures (anybody?), but the fact is that language is an organic thing, that grows out of cultural tradition. If religion ever fades away (I wish - but I suspect it won't be for a long time, if ever), then possibly the religious oaths will eventually disappear and be replaced with something else. But in the meantime there is no way we can shake off the cultural baggage - if I hit my thumb with a hammer, or something disgusts me, I'm probably going to say "Jesus Christ!" or some such. It doesn't mean I am actually invoking a deity, it's just a phrase, like "shit!" The believers who insist that atheists are being "hypocritical" by using such language are simply being foolish (what do they want us to say? "By Dawkins!"?) It's like saying you shouldn't use the term "by and large" if you aren't a sailor. There are more important things to worry about. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dont_do_it_doug. Posted June 15, 2007 Share Posted June 15, 2007 How can you actually defend beeing an atheist? It's quite simple I'd imagine. You don't believe in God. So you are saying there are no God whatsoever. When in fact, you dont know? I'm not saying that, I believe in God. Nobody can say for sure, only what they believe in. There are people who are convinced God exists, there are those that are convinced he doesn't. IMO neither will be left out on judgement day (whatever that entails). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjmooney Posted June 15, 2007 VT Supporter Share Posted June 15, 2007 How can you actually defend beeing an atheist? It's quite simple I'd imagine. You don't believe in God. So you are saying there are no God whatsoever. When in fact, you dont know? Here we go again. Proof doesn't come into it. I don't KNOW that there isn't a giant invisible pink teapot orbiting the Earth, I can't PROVE that there isn't. But based on the available evidence, and using my own intelligence, I conclude that there isn't. Same with God. Being an atheist doesn't mean "I have incontrovertible proof that God does not exist". It means "I do NOT have any incontrovertible proof that he does. Therefore I DO NOT BELIEVE that he exists". It says nothing about what I DO believe (that is a pretty big area of science). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OldFart Posted June 15, 2007 Share Posted June 15, 2007 Isn't "golly" really "God love me"? Crumbs, only just realised that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjmooney Posted June 15, 2007 VT Supporter Share Posted June 15, 2007 Isn't "golly" really "God love me"? Crumbs, only just realised that. Yep. Dunno what "crumbs" is though. Probably "Christ's thumbs" or some such... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRL Posted June 15, 2007 Share Posted June 15, 2007 How can you actually defend beeing an atheist? It's quite simple I'd imagine. You don't believe in God. So you are saying there are no God whatsoever. When in fact, you dont know? Here we go again. Proof doesn't come into it. I don't KNOW that there isn't a giant invisible pink teapot orbiting the Earth, I can't PROVE that there isn't. But based on the available evidence, and using my own intelligence, I conclude that there isn't. Same with God. Being an atheist doesn't mean "I have incontrovertible proof that God does not exist". It means "I do NOT have any incontrovertible proof that he does. Therefore I DO NOT BELIEVE that he exists". It says nothing about what I DO believe (that is a pretty big area of science). But shouldnt you be so humble to realise that there is a chance a God can exist? For after all, you dont know? But seriously, you have no proof he does exist, but you cant deny the fact that he/she may very well exist. Then why should you support a belief which denies the possibility of a greater force. You should be an agnostic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OldFart Posted June 15, 2007 Share Posted June 15, 2007 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRL Posted June 15, 2007 Share Posted June 15, 2007 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThunderPower_14 Posted June 15, 2007 Share Posted June 15, 2007 How can you actually defend beeing an atheist? It's quite simple I'd imagine. You don't believe in God. So you are saying there are no God whatsoever. When in fact, you dont know? That's a ridiculous statement TRL. You arent sure if there is a god. Well done. But the rest of us are sure, and that goes for the religious people and for us athiests. As an Athiest I am saying that without a doubt there is no "god" that created everything in the universe and looks after/punishes every one of us for everything we do. The whole concept is about as believable to me as a man in a red suit travelling to every house in the world (on a reindeer powered sleigh that flies) on the 25th of december and delivering presents. And Religious people are just as certain that there is a god, and that he will look after them and everything bad in the world has a purpose yada yada yada. Why have a go at us because we've made up our mind about something? Edit: Technically, by your rules, every person on the planet should be agnostic. Silly really. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon Posted June 15, 2007 Share Posted June 15, 2007 If you are an atheist, are you being a hypocrite be uttering the remark: "for God's sake!" or "God almighty!". also, am i right in beliveing that atheists don't necessarily deny the existence of Jesus, just that he was "nothing special" so to speak? In which case, we would be allowed to say "Jesus!" but not "Jesus Christ!" or "For Christ's Sake!"? It's a free country, we're "allowed" to say pretty much what we like. The thing about oaths and swearing, is that (apart from the bodily parts ones) they are nearly all religious, or bowdlerised from religious oaths - even the "tame" ones: What about Hell? does that have religious connotations? i generally do not invoke tha tamer swear words when issuign expletives, but have on ocassion used the phrase: "**** Hell!". Not sure if this has a religions origin though - not the fcuking = the hell bit? I presume it has. I'll just stick to the tried and trusted f*ck word removed and w*nker, it's far safer and much less likely to raise the ire of the god botherers ..... :winkold: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRL Posted June 15, 2007 Share Posted June 15, 2007 Edit: Technically, by your rules, every person on the planet should be agnostic. Silly really. No. I believe every Atheist should be an Agnostic. As an Athiest I am saying that without a doubt there is no "god" that created everything in the universe Which is funny as regarding how the world was made, science can bring very little. Energy for once. Laws of physics. How did something get created out of nothing? Im trying to riducule you or anyone, i just find it strange that you deny the presence of something which could be possible, and according to a lot of theories likely. Be a bit broadminded etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Awol Posted June 15, 2007 Share Posted June 15, 2007 I'm reading 'The God Delusion' by Richard Dawkins at the moment and as a non-practicing Christian it doesn't do much for your 'faith'. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon Posted June 15, 2007 Share Posted June 15, 2007 Edit: Technically, by your rules, every person on the planet should be agnostic. Silly really. No. I believe every Atheist should be an Agnostic. well possibly. the thing is, many non-believers don't look into it in that much detail. They simply don't believe in god, and thereofre say they're an atheist, as this more well known in poplular culture. I am guilty of this. TBH, having just looked at the defeinitions of both, they are very similar, although i fall on the side of atheism, as although i can't prove that their isn't a God, i also don't believe there is one either. Ago's seem to say whilst they can't prove their isn't a God, they don't really know either way and so don't believe anything. Or at least that's how i understand it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ED Posted June 15, 2007 Share Posted June 15, 2007 Trl in a God debate, this could last a while. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gort Posted June 15, 2007 Share Posted June 15, 2007 I'm a Sikh Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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