Stevo985 Posted June 16, 2014 VT Supporter Share Posted June 16, 2014 Am staggered by people suggesting England should have got a draw. An understrength Italian side hit post and bar and Jagielka had to clear one off the line. I think the media have egged up England's performance a lot here, the Italians played to their style comfortably (probably not emerging from 3rd gear) and got the job done. If this was Villa people would be saying it was a comfortable win (although such a thing doesn't exist under Lambert) I will be surprised to see England get out of this group now. I agree that it looked like Italy could just move up another gear had we equalised again? And look at the fitness of the teams? England's young players were pulling up with cramp towards the end, was Pirlo or DeRossi? BUt the two teams play completely differently. England play a high tempo fast game. italy play a slow paced possession game. England aren't a possession based team. Hodgson can't change that over night. But that's why we cramped up and they didn't, because we played at a higher tempo. We played well. We created more chances than any other team has so far. We just weren't very clinical. On another day we could have won. That's not good enough to say we deserved to win, but I personally think it's good enough to suggest we have a good chance against the two weaker teams in the group 1. Yes but on another day and a couple of inches another way and Italy could have scored instead of hitting the post, the bar and having one cleared off the line? Then we would have been on the end of a 5:1? All if buts and maybes? 2. In the second half as the game went on Italy looked more comfortable and England looked more predictable. We bought on Barkley who was largely squeezed out the game by a desperate Rooney or Johnson moving in from the right to hit a left foot shot into row Z. 3. If you think a Uruguay with Suarez and Costa Rica are easy then you are disillusioned? I've numbered your paragraphs 1. I said as much. it's all ifs and buts. But the fact is we created more chances than any other team in the world cup so far, against the best team in the group. Yes it's not good enough that we didn't score them, but it's certainly encouraging that we provided the chances. 2. I know. I said as much in a much longer post on the previous page. Last 20 minutes we panicked and the old England came through. We need to make sure we are patient and stick to the game plan against the other 2 teams 3. I've said nothing of the sort. Don't put words in my mouth Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tinker Posted June 16, 2014 VT Supporter Share Posted June 16, 2014 Italy are an ageing team who have been in very bad form before they beat us. The formation we played with the players on the pitch was wrong, very wrong. If we start with the same team against Uruguay then we will lose and go out, Roy should then go. We have some great English players that could have been used in this game, Milner for one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kurtsimonw Posted June 16, 2014 Share Posted June 16, 2014 Italy didn't do much outside of set pieces really though did they? First goal,corner. Shot off the post, from corner. Shot off the bar, from free kick. We had more shots on target than they did, that obviously doesn't include the 3/4 chances we had that were inches from being a goal. The early Sterling effort, the Henderson effort, the ball Wellbeck put a cross that Barzagli nearly put in his own net, Rooney's that he dragged near post. I know it's the cool thing to try pick out negatives and slag off the English national team, but we certainly deserved a draw from the game, I'm big on Italian football and have a bunch of mates throughout Europe who adopt Italy as their nation for World Cups, they certainly feel the same thing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stevo985 Posted June 16, 2014 VT Supporter Share Posted June 16, 2014 Italy are an ageing team who have been in very bad form before they beat us. The formation we played with the players on the pitch was wrong, very wrong. If we start with the same team against Uruguay then we will lose and go out, Roy should then go. I massively disagree Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tinker Posted June 16, 2014 VT Supporter Share Posted June 16, 2014 They have drawn at home to Luxembourg and the rep or Ireland lost to Spain and just about beat a team I have never heard of, their team has a higher than average age, and their best player is 35 years old, it's all relative I guess. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stevo985 Posted June 16, 2014 VT Supporter Share Posted June 16, 2014 They have drawn at home to Luxembourg and the rep or Ireland lost to Spain and just about beat a team I have never heard of, their team has a higher than average age, and their best player is 35 years old, it's all relative I guess. Warm up games mean nothing. They were terrible in their warm up games in 2006 and they won the tournament. It's clear from Saturday's games that Italy are the strongest team in the group. I don't think it's absurd to suggest we're the second best team in the group based on Saturday's performances. That's a big assumption of course. But my point is if we play like we did on Saturday against the other 2 teams I think we'll go through. I think we should start with the same team. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Folski Posted June 16, 2014 Share Posted June 16, 2014 England got the formation wrong the last night for me, England seem to always have tried to accommodate the name as opposed to giving a lad a chance. I do not understand how they didn't bring on Lambert. I'd go 4-4-2. Also, Rooney 300k a week my god. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Folski Posted June 16, 2014 Share Posted June 16, 2014 They have drawn at home to Luxembourg and the rep or Ireland lost to Spain and just about beat a team I have never heard of, their team has a higher than average age, and their best player is 35 years old, it's all relative I guess. Warm up games mean nothing. They were terrible in their warm up games in 2006 and they won the tournament. It's clear from Saturday's games that Italy are the strongest team in the group. I don't think it's absurd to suggest we're the second best team in the group based on Saturday's performances. That's a big assumption of course. But my point is if we play like we did on Saturday against the other 2 teams I think we'll go through. I think we should start with the same team. Uruguay were brutal anyway, tough to see Suarez (as good as he can be) changing that much, I think at times England gave Italy too much respect and seemed like a draw would have been a great result for them, when Italy were there for the taking. If Rooney doesn't influence the next 2 games he may as well just retire. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VillaChris Posted June 16, 2014 Share Posted June 16, 2014 Worst player by a country mile was Gerrard. Did nothing whatsoever, failed in his positional role, his tactical role and his role as captain Gerrard is almost completely shot as an athlete, his legs have gone and you can see that by how his pace just isn't there and how his balance is often off, he shouldn't be anywhere near that first team. Italy aren't a very good side and England well, showed they don't have end product and that they can't defend. The media bias towards Liverpool help Gerrard out enormously. A quick read through various forums, twitter, facebook etc show that the majority of fans clearly see what a bad game Gerrard had, but in the media nothing. The BBC - who have put a great performance so far - really did let themselves down with total avoidance of mentioning Gerrard - the captain and so called midfield general - but preferred to concentrate on Rooney As much as I dislike the bloke I could not have seen Terry performing the captain role in such a way as we saw from Gerrard last night Who would you drop Gerrard for? I can see England getting out of this group, 4 points will be enough I reckon if Costa Rica are beaten. The main problem is this is the poorest back 4 I've seen in a long time in terms of one v one battles. England will not be keeping clean sheets in the knock out stages that's for sure. Worst player by a country mile was Gerrard. Did nothing whatsoever, failed in his positional role, his tactical role and his role as captain Gerrard is almost completely shot as an athlete, his legs have gone and you can see that by how his pace just isn't there and how his balance is often off, he shouldn't be anywhere near that first team. Italy aren't a very good side and England well, showed they don't have end product and that they can't defend. The media bias towards Liverpool help Gerrard out enormously. A quick read through various forums, twitter, facebook etc show that the majority of fans clearly see what a bad game Gerrard had, but in the media nothing. The BBC - who have put a great performance so far - really did let themselves down with total avoidance of mentioning Gerrard - the captain and so called midfield general - but preferred to concentrate on Rooney As much as I dislike the bloke I could not have seen Terry performing the captain role in such a way as we saw from Gerrard last night Who would you drop Gerrard for? I can see England getting out of this group, 4 points will be enough I reckon if Costa Rica are beaten. The main problem is this is the poorest back 4 I've seen in a long time in terms of one v one battles. England will not be keeping clean sheets in the knock out stages that's for sure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VillaChris Posted June 16, 2014 Share Posted June 16, 2014 Am staggered by people suggesting England should have got a draw. An understrength Italian side hit post and bar and Jagielka had to clear one off the line. I think the media have egged up England's performance a lot here, the Italians played to their style comfortably (probably not emerging from 3rd gear) and got the job done. If this was Villa people would be saying it was a comfortable win (although such a thing doesn't exist under Lambert) Well you could counter that by Sterling hitting the side netting early on and also I think it was Paletta nearly scoring an own goal in the first half after a good England move down the right. Joe Hart wasn't tested that much. Italy look a quarter final team to me. Excellent midfield but their defence is nowhere near as good as what they were putting out 8 years ago. Am I the only one who finds Chellini a massively overrated defender, where was he for the Sturridge goal? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaulC Posted June 16, 2014 Share Posted June 16, 2014 Italy are strong in midfield. I see them as potential semi-finalists. I personally think England should have got something out of the game. Rooney missed a sitter... No way would Linekar or Platt have missed that. Italy created nothing much second half and Hart had nothing to do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Voinjama Posted June 16, 2014 Share Posted June 16, 2014 Yeah Lineker and Platt never missed chances. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tinker Posted June 16, 2014 VT Supporter Share Posted June 16, 2014 Uruguay are the seeded team in the Group, they have never lost to England in the world cup.They got to the semi finals of the 2010 world cup, we will not easily beat them, we may get a draw but not if we set up like we did against Italy. Its very easily to carried away with the hype surrounding the England team, especially when you follow the English leagues. Anyway enough misery from me, its a hard habit to break, Come on England! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AVFCforever1991 Posted June 16, 2014 Share Posted June 16, 2014 (edited) If Uruguay play like they did against Costa Rica, then we will win. They were **** dreadful, unfortunately I can only see them improving. Edited June 16, 2014 by AVFCforever1991 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villa4europe Posted June 16, 2014 Share Posted June 16, 2014 what was the sitter? the one where he tried to hit the near post and dragged it just wide? IMO he should have scored after doing the hard bit but i wouldnt call it a sitter, not sure how many players would even try that to be honest, not exactly an easy skill to sell the defender and the keeper like that, and the keeper was completely down the river Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CarewsEyebrowDesigner Posted June 16, 2014 Share Posted June 16, 2014 England will win because Suarez isn't fit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoelVilla Posted June 16, 2014 Share Posted June 16, 2014 If Uruguay keep playing Lugano they won't be a problem for England. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VillaChris Posted June 16, 2014 Share Posted June 16, 2014 Uruguay's midfield is just workman like really...rios and Gargano is nothing special at all, they just run around a lot. Not sure who they'll play at RB with Maxi Parieria suspended...Caceres at LB is a liability aswell imo. I think the formula for England to get through is a draw v Uruguay and beat Costa Rica as you'd imagine Italy will knock a few past Costa Rica to get their GD down and I can't see in the last game Uruguay beating Italy by more than what England could beat Costa Rica by. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kurtsimonw Posted June 16, 2014 Share Posted June 16, 2014 They should just play Cacares at RB and an actual LB at LB, solves both problems. They just look shit anyway, it'd be an awful result if we don't beat them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stevo985 Posted June 16, 2014 VT Supporter Share Posted June 16, 2014 Uruguay are the seeded team in the Group, they have never lost to England in the world cup.They got to the semi finals of the 2010 world cup, we will not easily beat them, we may get a draw but not if we set up like we did against Italy. Its very easily to carried away with the hype surrounding the England team, especially when you follow the English leagues. Anyway enough misery from me, its a hard habit to break, Come on England!nobody is saying it will be easy. What I'm saying is that we actually played well on Saturday, and Uruguay were shite. So if we can replicate our performance I think we have a good chance of beating Uruguay, even if they do get better. Its by no means a certainty and no one has ever said we'll easily beat them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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