Big_John_10 Posted May 23, 2013 Share Posted May 23, 2013 We're not a nothing club? I think every neutral fan and most of the media would disagree.I couldn't give a flying **** what every neutral fan or the media think of Aston Villa. Do you believe you are following a nothing club? Your posts suggest you do. Maybe take a look at yourself. Well you don't have to care. Your opinion doesn't decide what kind of club we are. And yes I think it's clear I do think I'm following a nothing club. It's what we're fast becoming under Randy Lerner. What do I need to look at? Am I better fan if I ignore what I see and post how great we are on the Internet? 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mantis Posted May 23, 2013 Share Posted May 23, 2013 (edited) Oh yeah because if a player like Benteke had come to us under Ellis we'd be able to keep hold of him, just like Yorke right? What a load of **** nonsense. It's just the nature of football today, nothing to do with Lerner. Edited May 23, 2013 by Mantis 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brommy Posted May 23, 2013 Share Posted May 23, 2013 My one worry is that this might sway Weimann into making a similar decision. You say that as if it's news! That's what you get when you cannot hold onto your best players it is a vicious circle and people who say "If (Young, Downing, Milner, Barry, Yorke etc) want to leave then let them and we'll invest the money" failed to see that. This is why people like John above say we are a nothing club and why I have been saying for a while we are a feeder club. And why we cannot hold onto our best players. This summer Weimann and Benteke next summer Lowton and Sylla who knows after that I've had a season ticket for the best part of 30 years and not seen it any different. Why worry about it now? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big_John_10 Posted May 23, 2013 Share Posted May 23, 2013 I don't really see how Benteke leaving changes anything with regards to the reputation of the club? We would've struggled to hold onto him even if we were fighting for Europe so I don't really see what your point is here. If anything the reputation of the club has improved over the past 12 months. Stop being so dramatic. Yes but you're missing the point. We're not challenging for Europe are we? We struggling to keep hold of good players AND fighting relegation battles for 3 years. Those things combined do absolutely nothing for the reputation of the club. But it's not a problem I'm told. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BOF Posted May 23, 2013 Moderator Share Posted May 23, 2013 My one worry is that this might sway Weimann into making a similar decision.You say that as if it's news! That's what you get when you cannot hold onto your best players it is a vicious circle and people who say "If (Young, Downing, Milner, Barry, Yorke etc) want to leave then let them and we'll invest the money" failed to see that. This is why people like John above say we are a nothing club and why I have been saying for a while we are a feeder club. And why we cannot hold onto our best players. This summer Weimann and Benteke next summer Lowton and Sylla who knows after thatWe're at a stage in our redevelopment as a club where we can't hold on to someone like Benteke. Hell, even if we had been as high as 6th we probably couldn't have held on to him (look at me talking like he's already gone ... anyway I digress). Some players are destined for the very top. I don't think it's any reflection on Villa if Benteke leaves. I don't think that makes us a feeder club. I do think it would be a reflection on us if Weimann left though. He's a player we should be looking to keep. Only Yorke from your above list is fit to polish Benteke's boots IMHO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shillzz Posted May 23, 2013 Share Posted May 23, 2013 In fairness, we have been no better than Fulhum & Stoke (if even as good) for the past 3 years. We can count ourselves lucky that we had the 3rd highest scorer in Europe this calendar year to save us from relegation. If he goes, then so be it, I don't think he'd necessarily be able to repeat this season's achievements next year, and we'd probably still end up selling, but for a lot less. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big_John_10 Posted May 23, 2013 Share Posted May 23, 2013 Oh yeah because if a player like Benteke had come to us under Ellis we'd be able to keep hold of him, just like Yorke right? What a load of **** nonsense. It's just the nature of football today, nothing to do with Lerner. I've said below you're missing the point. It's not just about losing a good player. It's about losing a good player WHILE we consistently fight to survive in the league. All good teams lose good players, no one is going to have a go at the club soley for losing a good player. It's everything. It's the whole picture and its what this club is becoming that's the worry. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mantis Posted May 23, 2013 Share Posted May 23, 2013 (edited) I don't really see how Benteke leaving changes anything with regards to the reputation of the club? We would've struggled to hold onto him even if we were fighting for Europe so I don't really see what your point is here. If anything the reputation of the club has improved over the past 12 months. Stop being so dramatic. Yes but you're missing the point. We're not challenging for Europe are we? We struggling to keep hold of good players AND fighting relegation battles for 3 years. Those things combined do absolutely nothing for the reputation of the club. But it's not a problem I'm told. Even when we were challenging for Europe we couldn't keep hold of our best players (see Barry and Milner), and those two weren't getting the kind of interest that Benteke is. The fact is all but the very top clubs will struggle to keep hold of world class players. Oh yeah because if a player like Benteke had come to us under Ellis we'd be able to keep hold of him, just like Yorke right? What a load of **** nonsense. It's just the nature of football today, nothing to do with Lerner. I've said below you're missing the point. It's not just about losing a good player. It's about losing a good player WHILE we consistently fight to survive in the league. All good teams lose good players, no one is going to have a go at the club soley for losing a good player. It's everything. It's the whole picture and its what this club is becoming that's the worry. You're the one that's missing the point. Benteke possibly leaving isn't even relevant as it would've been a possibly even if we were fighting for Europe. Edited May 23, 2013 by Mantis Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
samjp26 Posted May 23, 2013 Share Posted May 23, 2013 Meltdown 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big_John_10 Posted May 23, 2013 Share Posted May 23, 2013 I do think it would be a reflection on us if Weimann left though. Why are you worried about this though? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HalfTimePost Posted May 23, 2013 Share Posted May 23, 2013 If Benteke leaves this summer it's going to be an absolute nightmare just to hold on to Weimann and Lowton for August. We all know the plan though, buy young, up coming players with resale value and try to build the club up around them. Theres only one reason why you choose players with resale value. It's to sell them. We cannot compete with the top 4, hopefully we find a lot of gems all in one go and manage to take the league by storm and push for Champions League and be the next Dortmund but it's very unlikely. We are more likely to find players on the up, build them up and mix them with players from the academy, all going well we sell a few on for huge sums of money and go again. Yes, it sucks to lose Benteke after 9 months but if we get £30-40m for him then its a good start to that and we have to put our faith in the scouting network to find another. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big_John_10 Posted May 23, 2013 Share Posted May 23, 2013 I don't really see how Benteke leaving changes anything with regards to the reputation of the club? We would've struggled to hold onto him even if we were fighting for Europe so I don't really see what your point is here. If anything the reputation of the club has improved over the past 12 months. Stop being so dramatic. Yes but you're missing the point. We're not challenging for Europe are we? We struggling to keep hold of good players AND fighting relegation battles for 3 years. Those things combined do absolutely nothing for the reputation of the club. But it's not a problem I'm told. Even when we were challenging for Europe we couldn't keep hold of our best players (see Barry and Milner), and those two weren't getting the kind of interest that Benteke is. The fact is all but the very top clubs will struggle to keep hold of world class players. Oh yeah because if a player like Benteke had come to us under Ellis we'd be able to keep hold of him, just like Yorke right? What a load of **** nonsense. It's just the nature of football today, nothing to do with Lerner. I've said below you're missing the point. It's not just about losing a good player. It's about losing a good player WHILE we consistently fight to survive in the league. All good teams lose good players, no one is going to have a go at the club soley for losing a good player. It's everything. It's the whole picture and its what this club is becoming that's the worry. You're the one that's missing the point. Benteke possibly leaving isn't even relevant as it would've been a possibly even if we were fighting for Europe. I don't think I can be more clear with my opinion than in the two posts you've quoted. Yet you've ignored it twice and repeated yourself. Probably best to just leave the debate there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BOF Posted May 23, 2013 Moderator Share Posted May 23, 2013 Well you don't have to care. Your opinion doesn't decide what kind of club we are.It's not the first or last time you've missed my point. My opinion of my club; what I think about my club; is ALL that matters and I will certainly not allow a biased media that only has time for the top 4 or rival fans who know bugger all about Villa to influence my thoughts about my own club. I'd suggest you don't be so easily convinced by them either. The fact that Sky have chosen to report on football as if they invented it in 1992 seems to have successfully convinced you and others that we have always been also-rans and that we're now a small club. I'm sorry to hear that but it doesn't make me think less of the club in the way that you say you do.I do think I'm following a nothing club.I'm just quoting this as I think it's a remarkable thing for a fan to say. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mantis Posted May 23, 2013 Share Posted May 23, 2013 I don't really see how Benteke leaving changes anything with regards to the reputation of the club? We would've struggled to hold onto him even if we were fighting for Europe so I don't really see what your point is here. If anything the reputation of the club has improved over the past 12 months. Stop being so dramatic. Yes but you're missing the point. We're not challenging for Europe are we? We struggling to keep hold of good players AND fighting relegation battles for 3 years. Those things combined do absolutely nothing for the reputation of the club. But it's not a problem I'm told. Even when we were challenging for Europe we couldn't keep hold of our best players (see Barry and Milner), and those two weren't getting the kind of interest that Benteke is. The fact is all but the very top clubs will struggle to keep hold of world class players. Oh yeah because if a player like Benteke had come to us under Ellis we'd be able to keep hold of him, just like Yorke right? What a load of **** nonsense. It's just the nature of football today, nothing to do with Lerner. I've said below you're missing the point. It's not just about losing a good player. It's about losing a good player WHILE we consistently fight to survive in the league. All good teams lose good players, no one is going to have a go at the club soley for losing a good player. It's everything. It's the whole picture and its what this club is becoming that's the worry. You're the one that's missing the point. Benteke possibly leaving isn't even relevant as it would've been a possibly even if we were fighting for Europe. I don't think I can be more clear with my opinion than in the two posts you've quoted. Yet you've ignored it twice and repeated yourself. Probably best to just leave the debate there. I haven't ignored anything. Your view is that the relegation battles and Benteke possibly leaving prove that the club's reputation has declined and I'm saying that Benteke possibly leaving is irrelevant with regards to the club's reputation because it would've been a struggle to keep hold of him anyway. This isn't like Arsenal selling Van Persie. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HalfTimePost Posted May 23, 2013 Share Posted May 23, 2013 Also, only Messi and Ronaldo have scored more in 2013. That means Benteke has outscored the likes of Aguero, Van Persie, Rooney, Falcao, Lewandowski, Ibrahimovic etc etc. So anybody thinking it was going to be a nice case of asking him politely to sign a new contract and him doing so with no fuss about moving is living in a dream world. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BOF Posted May 23, 2013 Moderator Share Posted May 23, 2013 I do think it would be a reflection on us if Weimann left though.Why are you worried about this though?I won't be going into my reasons with you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mantis Posted May 23, 2013 Share Posted May 23, 2013 (edited) I think before people start going into hysterics about "how far the club has fallen" or proclaiming that we're a "nothing club" they should wait and see: a. Whether Benteke is actually sold this summer b. Who we get in as his replacement c. How his replacement performs Edited May 23, 2013 by Mantis Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard Posted May 23, 2013 Share Posted May 23, 2013 My one worry is that this might sway Weimann into making a similar decision. You say that as if it's news! That's what you get when you cannot hold onto your best players it is a vicious circle and people who say "If (Young, Downing, Milner, Barry, Yorke etc) want to leave then let them and we'll invest the money" failed to see that. This is why people like John above say we are a nothing club and why I have been saying for a while we are a feeder club. And why we cannot hold onto our best players. This summer Weimann and Benteke next summer Lowton and Sylla who knows after that We're at a stage in our redevelopment as a club where we can't hold on to someone like Benteke. Hell, even if we had been as high as 6th we probably couldn't have held on to him (look at me talking like he's already gone ... anyway I digress). Some players are destined for the very top. I don't think it's any reflection on Villa if Benteke leaves. I don't think that makes us a feeder club. I do think it would be a reflection on us if Weimann left though. He's a player we should be looking to keep. Only Yorke from your above list is fit to polish Benteke's boots IMHO. With all due respect Brian, it isn't just a "stage" we have been this way for years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
juteface Posted May 23, 2013 Share Posted May 23, 2013 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BOF Posted May 23, 2013 Moderator Share Posted May 23, 2013 With all due respect Brian, it isn't just a "stage" we have been this way for years.Yeah I know but our latest Lambert project might have us going somewhere. Let's just see. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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