Leandro Bacuna

[dounavilla]

27 minutes ago, TrentVilla said:

I both agree and disagree. He didn't say Barcelona you are right, but I also think you know nobody actually thinks he did they are mocking him but again you know that.

You are wrong though when you say he said "one day" had he done so he probably wouldn't have got as much stick.

What he actually said was "Within two years now I try to make my next move." So not one day but within two years, this less than 12 months after signing a new 5 year deal. Not to mention Collymore had already raised question marks about his attitude and commitment.

Is it really surprising people didn't like it? Especially given the timing when we were supposed to be fighting to stay up, are you really surprised when a player so openly admits they are already looking at the possibility of moving on.

Football fans aren't idiots, they know most players are mercanary, they know they are thinking about their next move at times they shouldn't be. But to come out and say it, at that particular time was always going to draw fierce criticism. Add to that the fact he is an average player who had a below average season the CL element to what he said was always going to be mocked.

I'm afraid Bacuna threw himself under the bus with a poorly judged and timed comments and he has burnt his bridges with many as a result.

He isn't a scapegoat, not even remotely close. He like a number of others is getting stick for his conduct, attitude and ultimately his performances but he absolutely isn't a victim or a scapegoat.

So are  you saying Barcelona still might make a bid ?

[Demitri_C]

10 hours ago, Junxs said:

And he never said he wanted to go to Barcelona either - which seems to be the chosen destination for him by Villatalk posters.

In an interview he said he'd like to return to Holland one day, preferably for one of the sides in the champions league eg Ajax or PSV.

I think thats a perfectly acceptable comment and didn't deserve the boos he got for it. It has been totally taken out of context. Villa fans just want a scapegoat, nothing new there.

I take it you never heard the collymore rant when he said after a big defeat, bacuna was playing around a hoover board straight after without a care of the defeat. we dont need losers like this playing for our club

[dounavilla]

That sucks.

Edited July 12, 2016 by dounavilla

[Hoof hearted]

4 minutes ago, dounavilla said:

a hoover board ?

I had one for Christmas, it, like Bacuna ironically, sucked....

Edited July 12, 2016 by Hoof hearted

[zapbranny]

He would get a free transfer from me.  He's an idiot and whilst I might tolerate someone's questionable mentality if they are talented and put in good performances; however Bacuna is none of those.  Extremely limited player with a poor attitude.  

Get him out soonest.  Leicester have shown what a decent attitude and team spirit can achieve.

[bobzy]

3 hours ago, TrentVilla said:

I both agree and disagree. He didn't say Barcelona you are right, but I also think you know nobody actually thinks he did they are mocking him but again you know that.

You are wrong though when you say he said "one day" had he done so he probably wouldn't have got as much stick.

What he actually said was "Within two years now I try to make my next move." So not one day but within two years, this less than 12 months after signing a new 5 year deal. Not to mention Collymore had already raised question marks about his attitude and commitment.

Is it really surprising people didn't like it? Especially given the timing when we were supposed to be fighting to stay up, are you really surprised when a player so openly admits they are already looking at the possibility of moving on.

Football fans aren't idiots, they know most players are mercanary, they know they are thinking about their next move at times they shouldn't be. But to come out and say it, at that particular time was always going to draw fierce criticism. Add to that the fact he is an average player who had a below average season the CL element to what he said was always going to be mocked.

I'm afraid Bacuna threw himself under the bus with a poorly judged and timed comments and he has burnt his bridges with many as a result.

He isn't a scapegoat, not even remotely close. He like a number of others is getting stick for his conduct, attitude and ultimately his performances but he absolutely isn't a victim or a scapegoat.

He got disgusting abuse from "fans" on Twitter (apparently regarding his daughter (or son?)) around the turn of the year - think it was after the Sunderland game.  Presumably this continued and he made a comment about wanting to "move on" within 2 years (I assume a contract expiry).  When asked about moving to Holland, he said it would only be to Ajax or PSV as they play in the Champions League regularly and that would be the only draw.

To say he "threw himself under a bus" is basically saying online abuse is fine and players should just put up and shut up.  That's way worse than anything Bacuna has said here but, hey, we do love making pretty nasty comments about our own.

 

Edit:  Perhaps "scapegoat" is wrong, but he's certainly within a group that are selected for abuse on here (Agbonlahor, Lescott, Richards, Guzan, Bacuna).

Edited July 12, 2016 by bobzy

[Richard]

he may be shit and have a crap attitude but we'd stll get around 2M for him.  That is money we could put towards better improvements and not to be sniffed at as ,  to be honest,  I doubt XIa will be funding us to extortionate levels either this season or next

[markavfc40]

31 minutes ago, bobzy said:

He got disgusting abuse from "fans" on Twitter (apparently regarding his daughter (or son?)) around the turn of the year - think it was after the Sunderland game.  Presumably this continued and he made a comment about wanting to "move on" within 2 years (I assume a contract expiry).  When asked about moving to Holland, he said it would only be to Ajax or PSV as they play in the Champions League regularly and that would be the only draw.

To say he "threw himself under a bus" is basically saying online abuse is fine and players should just put up and shut up.  That's way worse than anything Bacuna has said here but, hey, we do love making pretty nasty comments about our own.

Him getting abuse on twitter can’t be excused but I can’t see how that can be linked to him then stating he wants to move on with in two years. As a player you should either stay off social media or you rise above the derogatory comments. What you certainly shouldn’t do is allow a few comments from a few knob heads tar your thoughts on a fan base of hundreds of thousands.

I personally couldn’t care a less what he said about moving on. What I do care about is his performances on the pitch for us and last season especially they were dire and his attitude in terms of effort and how he applied himself stank. He wasn’t alone in that.

The way I see it is that it would be better for all concerned if those players that have borne the brunt of the fans criticism, whether you think justified or not, were moved on. We don’t need the cloud of last season hanging over us and there are a number of players that if they remain and start the season poorly will find supporters on their backs. Having said that though for our part I do hope any players that do remain are given a fair crack of the whip and given a chance to redeem themselves. A toxic atmosphere is the last thing we need next season.

[Gary Thomas]

1 minute ago, markavfc40 said:

What I do care about is his performances on the pitch for us and last season especially they were dire and his attitude in terms of effort and how he applied himself stank.

This hits the nail right on on the head for me.

[bobzy]

1 minute ago, markavfc40 said:

Him getting abuse on twitter can’t be excused but I can’t see how that can be linked to him then stating he wants to move on with in two years. As a player you should either stay off social media or you rise above the derogatory comments. What you certainly shouldn’t do is allow a few comments from a few knob heads tar your thoughts on a fan base of hundreds of thousands.

There's enough nasty comments on VT, which is a relatively pleasant section of our fan base, let alone the amount who will say stuff on Twitter.

Personally, I can see how that would make you want to leave.  Irrespective of ability, he used to play with a smile on his face and that simply isn't there anymore.  I think it's affected him quite badly, personally.

I agree that a toxic atmosphere isn't needed next season but it isn't Bacuna's fault that he got abuse, or that he wishes to move on.  Fans seems to think he warrants everything he gets.  It's disappointing to see/hear but, hey, football fans eh?

[markavfc40]

17 minutes ago, bobzy said:

 

Personally, I can see how that would make you want to leave.  Irrespective of ability, he used to play with a smile on his face and that simply isn't there anymore.  I think it's affected him quite badly, personally.

 

I used to have a smile on my face when attending our matches but due to the crap served up by the likes of Bacuna that ceased to be the case a long time ago. The difference between me and Bacuna is that I can say I did all I could to improve our fortunes by supporting the team where as he frequently never got close to giving his all.

I have found with the vast majority of our supporters that if players try their best, regardless of ability, they will support them. A lack of ability is one thing but a lack of effort is unforgivable.I am not singling Bacuna out here by the way. He had plenty of company in not giving a shit.

I don’t really want to get embroiled in the issues of last season though as we don’t need to carry that baggage into the next one. I have never booed a player but I understand why some do and we don’t need that. For those players that did get dogs abuse last season it will be a two way street if they do stay. For their part they ,unlike last season, will have to ensure they give their all and we have to give them a fair crack of the whip. In an ideal world though they would be moved on as it would be better for all concerned.

Edited July 12, 2016 by markavfc40

[Straggler]

I wish I could find a video of the back pass Bacuna hit against Southampton for Long to run on to.  That was the cherry on the cake of one of the worst performances you can hope to see in a Villa shirt.  If I recall he played in the front 3 that day or in some sort of free role behind Ayew, it is hard to tell as he didn't really appear to be doing anything very much.  All I know is that from well inside Southampton's half and under little or no pressure he managed to punt the ball 40/50 yards into the path of pretty much the only opposition player between him and our own goal.  He was not full of energy, his technique was poor and his willingness to help out the team was non existent.  This is only one game, but to me it sums up Bacuna's season in a nutshell. He played 26 times last season and got the sum total of 1 goal and no assists, Clark and Lescott can both match that, bloomin Richards can do better.   He is a below average right back, a poor midfielder and just dreadful in a more forward role.

It is fair to say that I don't rate him as a player.

[Gary Thomas]

13 minutes ago, Straggler said:

I wish I could find a video of the back pass Bacuna hit against Southampton for Long to run on to.  That was the cherry on the cake of one of the worst performances you can hope to see in a Villa shirt.  If I recall he played in the front 3 that day or in some sort of free role behind Ayew, it is hard to tell as he didn't really appear to be doing anything very much.  All I know is that from well inside Southampton's half and under little or no pressure he managed to punt the ball 40/50 yards into the path of pretty much the only opposition player between him and our own goal.  He was not full of energy, his technique was poor and his willingness to help out the team was non existent.  This is only one game, but to me it sums up Bacuna's season in a nutshell. He played 26 times last season and got the sum total of 1 goal and no assists, Clark and Lescott can both match that, bloomin Richards can do better.   He is a below average right back, a poor midfielder and just dreadful in a more forward role.

It is fair to say that I don't rate him as a player.

Is it this the one

 

Edited July 12, 2016 by Gary Thomas

[Straggler]

2 minutes ago, Gary Thomas said:

Is this the one

Thank you sir, that is indeed the one.  Watching it back it was actually worse than I remember.  Sadly it also reminded me of how angry I was at Richards "tracking back" as Southampton players streamed past him to join the attack, but that is for another thread.

 

[AVTuco]

I think fans that got annoyed by his comments are a little overly sensitive, but I can understand that feeling. What has happened since is a total overreaction where many have ridiculed and isolated him in a way that probably affected the spirits of the whole team. Every player must have noticed the boos and wondered, what the heck. All this while we were supposed to fight for our premier league lives.

I don't think Bacuna is a scapegoat as such, but he has been subjected to abuse he didn't really deserve, and that hurt the whole team. Not much, but anyway.

Judging by this board, there's no way back. Shame.

Edited July 12, 2016 by AVTuco
Less feeling

[omariqy]

Jeez I forgot how shit we were.

[Gary Thomas]

14 minutes ago, omariqy said:

Jeez I forgot how shit we were.

Painful to watch, but I hope RDM has studied all these horror shows and thinks very carefully before giving players "second" (3rd, 4th, 5th) chances.  The proof is in the eating as they say.

[TrentVilla]

5 hours ago, bobzy said:

He got disgusting abuse from "fans" on Twitter (apparently regarding his daughter (or son?)) around the turn of the year - think it was after the Sunderland game.  Presumably this continued and he made a comment about wanting to "move on" within 2 years (I assume a contract expiry).  When asked about moving to Holland, he said it would only be to Ajax or PSV as they play in the Champions League regularly and that would be the only draw.

To say he "threw himself under a bus" is basically saying online abuse is fine and players should just put up and shut up.  That's way worse than anything Bacuna has said here but, hey, we do love making pretty nasty comments about our own.

 

Edit:  Perhaps "scapegoat" is wrong, but he's certainly within a group that are selected for abuse on here (Agbonlahor, Lescott, Richards, Guzan, Bacuna).

I think you need to back up a bit here because you seem to be reading things I haven't said and not reading what I have, as is evident from you still thinking his contract expired within 2 years!

Me saying he threw himself under a bus with the fans is in absolutely no way saying what you are claiming it is saying.  That is quite simply putting words in my mouth and utterly wrong.

You said he was a scapegoat which you now accept was wrong. There was absolutely no reference in your original post or in mine and nothing from me that could be interpreted to mean online abuse is okay and players should put up and shut up. That is just cobblers.

As for this abuse you say Bacuna received on Twitter, I didn't see it so can't comment on that. It rather sounds like you didn't either so I find it odd you can do so.

You then make a presumption that this abuse, which you haven't actually seen, continued and resulted in his saying he wanted to move on for CL football. Which is frankly nothing but supposition on your part to try and defend your original position that Bacuna is a victim being harshly treated and have a pop at Villa fans.

You are entitled to your opinion but I think you are completely wrong.

[TrentVilla]

4 hours ago, bobzy said:

There's enough nasty comments on VT, which is a relatively pleasant section of our fan base, let alone the amount who will say stuff on Twitter.

Personally, I can see how that would make you want to leave.  Irrespective of ability, he used to play with a smile on his face and that simply isn't there anymore.  I think it's affected him quite badly, personally.

I agree that a toxic atmosphere isn't needed next season but it isn't Bacuna's fault that he got abuse, or that he wishes to move on.  Fans seems to think he warrants everything he gets.  It's disappointing to see/hear but, hey, football fans eh?

I don't see a whole lot of nasty comments on here to be honest l, what I see is plenty of cricism certainly nothing of the nature you are claiming was directed at him on Twitter. I resent any suggestion that such stuff is posted on here.

However this theory you seem to have that he made his comments as a reaction to abuse is seemingly nothing but your theory, there absolutely nothing to support it. There is no quotes from him, no transfer request and let's be realistic here for a moment, if he was so bothered about fan criticism or abuse would he really say "I've had enough of this I'm off, er sometime in the next two years". Sorry it's just daft.

Bacuna was actually quite well liked until his comments, despite his shortcomings, the criticism and abuse (assuming there was some) in my view came after the CL comment not before.

As for last line, once again you are making stuff up.

[heid3ster]

Benteke talked to the press a few times about wanting to move, wanting to make a step up and play in Europe. He got some criticism for interviews like that here on the boards, but no one ever booed him on the pitch. You know the difference? Benteke backed up his talk with great performances on the pitch. Football fans will forgive a lot if the player performs well; Bacuna did not.