The Randy Lerner thread

[BOF]

To change the subject a little.

 

I'm concerned the club will now stagnate rather than get better year in year out.

 

We are buying young players which is great but if those young players continue to improve at the rate of say Benteke, Westwood or Lowton will the chairman invest enough in wages to keep those players with the vultures circling? We have kept Weimann but i'm not sure there was too many clubs interested so rather than being able to build a team will we just keep selling our better players and become the Premiership version of Crewe rather than gaining any success?

That's the natural way of things for all bar the very very top clubs though. As long as our club progresses up the league off the back of this talent then the next set of transfers can be that bit better (i.e. commensurate with us being a, say, top 8 club) and so it continues that those players then bring us further up the league - and you try to continue the trend as far as you can.

[dont_do_it_doug.]

To change the subject a little.

I'm concerned the club will now stagnate rather than get better year in year out.

We are buying young players which is great but if those young players continue to improve at the rate of say Benteke, Westwood or Lowton will the chairman invest enough in wages to keep those players with the vultures circling? We have kept Weimann but i'm not sure there was too many clubs interested so rather than being able to build a team will we just keep selling our better players and become the Premiership version of Crewe rather than gaining any success?

Your concerns are valid and reciprocated, but we're not going to know until we try.

I know some hate that word, "try", but thats all we can do. Give it our best shot.

We do need to be more prepared from now on and I'd like to think the team, from Lerner to Faulkner to Lambert, Karsa et al are working towards that.

[Morpheus]

 

To change the subject a little.

 

I'm concerned the club will now stagnate rather than get better year in year out.

 

We are buying young players which is great but if those young players continue to improve at the rate of say Benteke, Westwood or Lowton will the chairman invest enough in wages to keep those players with the vultures circling? We have kept Weimann but i'm not sure there was too many clubs interested so rather than being able to build a team will we just keep selling our better players and become the Premiership version of Crewe rather than gaining any success?

That's the natural way of things for all bar the very very top clubs though. As long as our club progresses up the league off the back of this talent then the next set of transfers can be that bit better (i.e. commensurate with us being a, say, top 8 club) and so it continues that those players then bring us further up the league - and you try to continue the trend as far as you can.

 

Yes thats certainly one very sensible way of looking at it BOF but i guess you then get into the realms of what is now deemed as success for our club? Certainly the scenario you put forward is an improvement over the past three seasons but will we ever be able to actually build a stable team that will be able to compete with the top four or will we forever be in a transitional stage always being the sleeping giant who doesn't quite get there?

[CVByrne]

People seem to be making too many excuses for him, being naive is not something you can use for his defence. That is a crippling indicament of him in my opinion. 

 

It's quite simple, he came in, ran the club into a massive financial hole. Then while in it thought appointing McLeish was the way to get out. We just survived relegation by the skin of our teeth. 

 

Yes this is exactly what I had wanted from Villa when he took over. If we do start getting some good results in and moving up the table it is in no thanks to Randy Lerner. It's down to Lambert being so skilled under the financial constraints we are in because of Lerner.

 

I just can't understand why he has such support still when we are in a financial hole because of him. The amount of hatred for pretty much all our managers since Gregory, but an owner committing far worse sins on this club than nearly all of them is given the free pass. 

 

I plain don't get it. 

[dont_do_it_doug.]

I can't see many excuses. Just a few people showing potential mitigating circumstances then the same old faces shouting louder.

[BOF]

Yes thats certainly one very sensible way of looking at it BOF but i guess you then get into the realms of what is now deemed as success for our club? Certainly the scenario you put forward is an improvement over the past three seasons but will we ever be able to actually build a stable team that will be able to compete with the top four or will we forever be in a transitional stage always being the sleeping giant who doesn't quite get there?

Well there'll certainly come a point where progress becomes harder, because you're in and around better (and probably richer) clubs, all vying to sign the type of player you are now trying to sign. But that's the fun of it. You give it a go. Pit your wits against the best. You try your best and you find out how high you can go. Try and win the odd cup along the way and be entertaining to watch.

[BOF]

People seem to be making too many excuses for him, being naive is not something you can use for his defence. That is a crippling indicament of him in my opinion. 

 

It's quite simple, he came in, ran the club into a massive financial hole. Then while in it thought appointing McLeish was the way to get out. We just survived relegation by the skin of our teeth. 

 

Yes this is exactly what I had wanted from Villa when he took over. If we do start getting some good results in and moving up the table it is in no thanks to Randy Lerner. It's down to Lambert being so skilled under the financial constraints we are in because of Lerner.

 

I just can't understand why he has such support still when we are in a financial hole because of him. The amount of hatred for pretty much all our managers since Gregory, but an owner committing far worse sins on this club than nearly all of them is given the free pass. 

 

I plain don't get it.

The only reason people are even talking about it is because others keep bringing up the past. I'd prefer to concentrate on the NOW. Right now we're in pretty good nick and we're looking up, not down. I think the current level of optimism probably doesn't sit comfortably with some and they just have to keep having a moan by living in the past because they can't currently moan about the present. Which in a way is an inadvertent compliment by them to Lerner

[Morley_crosses_to_Withe]

Do people also not remember we have been mostly a top half club for most of the premier league era. So to be down in these relegation dog fights 3 years running under what was supposed to be the man to "save us" from Doug

Do people not remember the days when disenchanted fans formed supporters groups and tried to think of/organise ways to get their message across to the man in charge. Now all we have is keyboard warriors writing the same old tired posts on internet forums.

Get out there and do something if he bothers you that much. Be the spark that causes the fire. I can guarantee you won't and that, even if you did, you'd have little support because the majority of fans are willing to give him another chance.

Anyway, as you were: "He should sell up because we've battled relegation for three seasons blah blah blah. Don't forget that every penny he's put in has been in loans blah blah blah".

Edited June 18, 2013 by Morley_crosses_to_Withe

[Stevo985]

I can't see many excuses. Just a few people showing potential mitigating circumstances then the same old faces shouting louder.

It's been like this for years in various threads.

 

It was the same in the Lambert thread last season. Anyone offering a REASON for poor performances was labelled as just giving excuses.

 

Same old posters too.

[dont_do_it_doug.]

I can't see many excuses. Just a few people showing potential mitigating circumstances then the same old faces shouting louder.

It's been like this for years in various threads.

It was the same in the Lambert thread last season. Anyone offering a REASON for poor performances was labelled as just giving excuses.

Same old posters too.

Then the worm turns and those same old posters with it, except an apology or an admittance that they acted a bit of a word removed back there is never forthcoming. Whatever happened to humility?

Except from Morpheus, but then he needs the points

[Morpheus]

 

To change the subject a little.

I'm concerned the club will now stagnate rather than get better year in year out.

We are buying young players which is great but if those young players continue to improve at the rate of say Benteke, Westwood or Lowton will the chairman invest enough in wages to keep those players with the vultures circling? We have kept Weimann but i'm not sure there was too many clubs interested so rather than being able to build a team will we just keep selling our better players and become the Premiership version of Crewe rather than gaining any success?

Your concerns are valid and reciprocated, but we're not going to know until we try.

I know some hate that word, "try", but thats all we can do. Give it our best shot.

We do need to be more prepared from now on and I'd like to think the team, from Lerner to Faulkner to Lambert, Karsa et al are working towards that.

 

Yeah mate i hear you ok and agree that we must try something different. With Lambert at the helm and a more thrifty chairman keeping a close eye on the pennies i just wonder in three years time will we still have Benteke, Westwood, Lowton and Okore playing for us or will we have replaced them with similar youthful players who will then take another three seasons to reach their potential?

 

Is that going to be our success being a profitable club off the pitch rather than being successful on it?

 

BOF has made some valid points about the further we move up the table the better quality of player we will attract but that may not necessarily be so when those better players will want to play in Europe if we are still mid table.

Edited June 18, 2013 by Morpheus

[Big_John_10]

I can't see many excuses. Just a few people showing potential mitigating circumstances then the same old faces shouting louder.

It's been like this for years in various threads.

 

It was the same in the Lambert thread last season. Anyone offering a REASON for poor performances was labelled as just giving excuses.

 

Same old posters too.

And could you not say the same old posters had the same complaints about anyone who didn't see positives in all things villa last year?

I think it works both ways.

[BOF]

I can't see many excuses. Just a few people showing potential mitigating circumstances then the same old faces shouting louder.

It's been like this for years in various threads.

 

It was the same in the Lambert thread last season. Anyone offering a REASON for poor performances was labelled as just giving excuses.

 

Same old posters too.

And could you not say the same old posters had the same complaints about anyone who didn't see positives in all things villa last year?

I think it works both ways.

Yes it does work both ways. There are those who see the bad and the good and acknowledge both, and there are those who are suspicious of the good and concentrate on the bad. Just because it works both ways doesn't mean both ways are of equal merit.

[CVByrne]

 

The only reason people are even talking about it is because others keep bringing up the past. I'd prefer to concentrate on the NOW. Right now we're in pretty good nick and we're looking up, not down. I think the current level of optimism probably doesn't sit comfortably with some and they just have to keep having a moan by living in the past because they can't currently moan about the present. Which in a way is an inadvertent compliment by them to Lerner

 

 

 

 

Oh I'm very positive BOF about the future under Lambert. I think we've all connected with this team in a way we haven't since MON's first season or two. I think we are all behind this team. Totally behind them and I hope the team grows leaps and bounds this coming season.

 

But my views on Lerner are the club is in this financial mess because of him and his hiring of McLeish was such a monumental mistake that I do not have any faith in him anymore as owner of this club. 

 

you cannot link my opinions on our owner to my love of this team, manager and club. I want what's best for us and I think it's with new ownership. The right new ownership. too much has happened for a full reconciliation with Lerner. 

 

Like everything on message boards, it's merely opinion. That one is mine.

[Stevo985]

 

 

I can't see many excuses. Just a few people showing potential mitigating circumstances then the same old faces shouting louder.

It's been like this for years in various threads.

 

It was the same in the Lambert thread last season. Anyone offering a REASON for poor performances was labelled as just giving excuses.

 

Same old posters too.

And could you not say the same old posters had the same complaints about anyone who didn't see positives in all things villa last year?

I think it works both ways.

 

I never said it didn't.

 

The problem is the majority of us sit in the middle of those two extremes and are equally pissed off by both. I've been labelled as "anyone who didn't see positives in all things Villa" AND someone who is overly negative, depending on who I'm talking too.

 

The problem is if you sit on one of those extremes then you see any other point of view as the opposite of yours. 

 

Everything is south of the north pole.

[Eames]

 

So without the benefits of the above you end up with 2 options - what we have ie: a wealthy bloke prepared to invest who yes has made some big mistakes in his time here but has ultimately been of benefit to the club and its supporters OR you have Venky's, Carson Yeung etc.

 

This is the worst post I've read in a long time. So we have Lerner or Venky's they are the only 2 options. If it's not Lerner it can only be Venkys or Yeung

 

Amazingly stupid post. Quite amazing. 

 

This is the worst post I've read in a long time.

 

Amazingly arrogant post. Quite amazing.   

[dont_do_it_doug.]

I can't see many excuses. Just a few people showing potential mitigating circumstances then the same old faces shouting louder.

It's been like this for years in various threads.

It was the same in the Lambert thread last season. Anyone offering a REASON for poor performances was labelled as just giving excuses.

Same old posters too.

And could you not say the same old posters had the same complaints about anyone who didn't see positives in all things villa last year?

I think it works both ways.

Like I said mate, the middle ground. Use it occasionally, you might like it.

[Big_John_10]

I can't see many excuses. Just a few people showing potential mitigating circumstances then the same old faces shouting louder.

It's been like this for years in various threads. It was the same in the Lambert thread last season. Anyone offering a REASON for poor performances was labelled as just giving excuses. Same old posters too.

And could you not say the same old posters had the same complaints about anyone who didn't see positives in all things villa last year?I think it works both ways.

Yes it does work both ways. There are those who see the bad and the good and acknowledge both, and there are those who are suspicious of the good and concentrate on the bad. Just because it works both ways doesn't mean both ways are of equal merit.

Are there are those who only see the positives.

And I agree 100% they aren't of equal merit.

Think that's quite clear.

[dont_do_it_doug.]

Pay attention to your own clarity then!

I'm off, you're doing my head in.

[Big_John_10]

Pay attention to your own clarity then!

I'm off, you're doing my head in.

Pay attention to your own clarity then!

I'm off, you're doing my head in.

Bye then.