The, he's finally GONE! Tell us your thoughts Thread

[Oaks]

Put it this way, if it wasn't for Gabby he would already be facing the door.

[TheDrums]

Very true Oaks. Or would Lerner let us lumber on until January?

Shocking even thinking about it.

[AVFC-Prideofbrum]

Not seen us and a Villa manager accept defeat in a premier league game like this for some time

Liverpool at Anfield last season

At least that game we had some of the ball and had injury problems, Petrov, Coker, Bannan, Sidwell central midfield I recall all being out, as well as Ashley Young, Heskey (who at that time was an in form player) Gabby was playing through injury. (although arguably could have been tonight) that night we had Clark, Hogg, Ireland in midfield. (which makes it difficult to 'have a go' when lacking so much quality in key areas.

The team we had out tonight wasn't stupidly better but the decisions are baffling. It's not a great midfield but in between Petrov, Herd, Bannan, Gardner, Delph, Ireland ...there is a decent trio in there somewhere or central 2.

I think for starts, Petrov and Bannan have to play. Then you pick someone alongside that. Bent and Gabby up top. Then N'Zogbia or Heskey, I'd have gone for Heskey just because wide threat and he works his socks off so not really too bothered about that, but part of a midfield 4? a midfield 4 without a single player who's going to create. At least having Heskey in the team while say a Bannan is in the team is that even if Heskey isn't providing a threat, can have Bannan, Gabby, Bent trying to make something happen. Even another midfield, given Gardner a chance, or Delph, given him a bit of freedom when we have the ball to break from midfield.

a 6 man base is fair enough (under O'Neill, I'd argue it was 5 men, with Petrov holding in front of back 4 and then the others were all more attacking minded) with other willing workers but we literally had an 8 man base today. The two banks of four, 'try and keep it down' mentallity. Gabby and Bent ....do it your own.

We're not hard to beat, we're not attacking, we're not a counter attacking side, we don't grind results out, we don't have an actual style of play. We don't go long to play off Heskey and get men round him, we don't play it short and try to keep it. We don't look to move the ball quickly into wide areas. There is no identity within this team, no structure or pattern of play that makes it easier IMO for the players to adapt too. Every game it changes, I don't think that helps.

The only games we've won, we've simply had to rely on individual brilliance from one player (in all 3 wins) against poorer opposition.

We don't even play to our strengths, I don't know what we play. It's just shit.

Truly shocking.

[TheDrums]

Alex McLeish was left to rue annoying defensive mistakes as Villa went down 2-0 to Tottenham.

McLeish was immensely frustrated at the manner of the Emmanuel Adebayor double, with the manager insistent that both goals could - and should - have been avoided.

The boss also pinpointed poor ball retention from his side as a major factor in the loss.

But he promised a reaction from his team when they face Swansea on Sunday.

He said: "It's so frustrating to see that and lose such easy goals.

"I thought we started really well. We nearly scored after 40 seconds and I thought 'here we go.'

"We started very bright and positive and then it's almost like we waited to lose a goal before we started getting going again.

"We can't concede goals like that and expect to do well in the Barclays Premier League.

"We played Carlos and Alan on the right. I just wanted to tighten things up a bit and I still think that was the right thing to do.

"But when you lose goals like the way we lost goals it doesn't give you much of a chance anyway.

"I have been playing four forwards the whole season and I took one out.

"Maybe Alan wasn't exactly the ideal man there because he's more of a defender coming on to the ball as opposed to being ahead of it but we thought he could cope.

"We thought Alan and Carlos could thwart the two attacking Spurs left-sided players. I didn't think Alan did too badly and Carlos, in fact, did quite well.

"It was a bad night for a few of our players - a bad day at the office - and they know they owe us one. They owe the fans and me a performance in the next game.

"I thought we stood off Spurs too much. They are a great team, with a lot of pace and a lot of athleticism and some great technical players. But if you allow them to flourish the way we did at times tonight?

"We didn't retain the ball nearly enough. But we still had one or two moments. If we had capitalised on them? Goals change games.

"I just felt ball retention was a big thing. Guys I see make it stick in training every day - it just didn't happen tonight. It did stick at the Norwich game but for some reason it didn't tonight. They are better than that."

Same shit, different result.

He's starting to sound like DOL, repeating himself in interviews "Great bunch of lads", but rather "We can't conceed such easy goals". Do something about it then.

Cuellar aint played PL football in 8 months and he still thinks it was right to play him and Hutton against Bale? This man is seriously deluded.

[DelboyVilla]

Alex McLeish was left to rue annoying defensive mistakes as Villa went down 2-0 to Tottenham.

McLeish was immensely frustrated at the manner of the Emmanuel Adebayor double, with the manager insistent that both goals could - and should - have been avoided.

The boss also pinpointed poor ball retention from his side as a major factor in the loss.

But he promised a reaction from his team when they face Swansea on Sunday.

He said: "It's so frustrating to see that and lose such easy goals.

"I thought we started really well. We nearly scored after 40 seconds and I thought 'here we go.'

"We started very bright and positive and then it's almost like we waited to lose a goal before we started getting going again.

"We can't concede goals like that and expect to do well in the Barclays Premier League.

"We played Carlos and Alan on the right. I just wanted to tighten things up a bit and I still think that was the right thing to do.

"But when you lose goals like the way we lost goals it doesn't give you much of a chance anyway.

"I have been playing four forwards the whole season and I took one out.

"Maybe Alan wasn't exactly the ideal man there because he's more of a defender coming on to the ball as opposed to being ahead of it but we thought he could cope.

"We thought Alan and Carlos could thwart the two attacking Spurs left-sided players. I didn't think Alan did too badly and Carlos, in fact, did quite well.

"It was a bad night for a few of our players - a bad day at the office - and they know they owe us one. They owe the fans and me a performance in the next game.

"I thought we stood off Spurs too much. They are a great team, with a lot of pace and a lot of athleticism and some great technical players. But if you allow them to flourish the way we did at times tonight?

"We didn't retain the ball nearly enough. But we still had one or two moments. If we had capitalised on them? Goals change games.

"I just felt ball retention was a big thing. Guys I see make it stick in training every day - it just didn't happen tonight. It did stick at the Norwich game but for some reason it didn't tonight. They are better than that."

Same shit, different result.

He's starting to sound like DOL, repeating himself in interviews "Great bunch of lads", but rather "We can't conceed such easy goals". Do something about it then.

UselessFuckingCunt!!!!

[Window09]

Really terrible performance.

At least he appears to know where we have gone wrong though, no ball retention and "circus" defending. Do we trust him to finish off the job of getting rid of the MON players (Collins, Dunne, Beye, Warnock, Heskey) and replace them with players that can play the ball? Or will he just make it worse e.g possibly like sending out Makoun to bring in Hutton.

[Ponky]

I don't have a problem with what he said really. He seems to have summarized it pretty well in fact - although understandably perhaps with less venom than many VTer's would use.

But this isn't the problem - if he knows where the problems lie what is he doing to fix it? If the same people are making the same mistakes - the players who "owe us one" - why are they keeping their places? If the players are "making it stick" in training but giving it away in a match what are you doing to try and change things around?

[TheDrums]

That is my point Ponky. Every post match interview he highlights the clear faults, yet the very next week it happens all over again.

And it isn't exactly helped by his negativity. The team has no confidence, how would you under this man? We had every man behind the ball on the 7th minute and majority of first + second half.

[DelboyVilla]

I do have a problem with what he said!

He never admitted HE got the tactics badly wrong!

He never admitted that HE didn't see that the tactics weren't working and HE never even tried to change them!

HE said Hutton did well, when he has clearly been shit since he joined us!

HE keeps talking about defensive mistakes, yet HE keeps putting players such as Hutton, Collins and Warnock on the pitch week in week out!

The blame for this loss quite clearly lays at McUseless' feet and he never once admitted that he **** it up.

[Ponky]

To be honest I have been quietly watching and waiting to see how McLeish goes and while the players must take responsibility for their performances in the field it is McLeish's responsibility to get them playing to the best of their ability and playing with a bit of pride. How could our players see the way Norwich kept attacking us a few weeks ago and then turn up at WHL and basically not give a shit? Surely someone's on the training ground & on the sidelines trying to make that happen?

[DelboyVilla]

To be honest I have been quietly watching and waiting to see how McLeish goes and while the players must take responsibility for their performances in the field it is McLeish's responsibility to get them playing to the best of their ability and playing with a bit of pride. How could our players see the way Norwich kept attacking us a few weeks ago and then turn up at WHL and basically not give a shit? Surely someone's on the training ground & on the sidelines trying to make that happen?

Well I think that the stories of McUseless being a motivator is a complete myth. He couldn't get the scum players motivated last season and let them go from a position of realitive safety (they were above us for most of the season) to being relegated.

[NowDoINotLikeThat]

Tactics , team selection are awful.

Why the **** is Heskey in midifield.

This is his first choice team with Heskey in midfield....

6 defenders starting.

As rightly pointed out our woeful performance against Liverpool last season we were under going massive injury problems at the time.

This is McWank's first choice team.

Hes incredibly limited manager - everyone but our board knew this . Never should have been appointed and unless he has a road to damascus conversion we will be watching turd antifootball. Guaranteed.

[mjames333]

my team against Swansea would be something like this

-------------------------Given------------------------------

Cuellar--------Dunne-----------Clark----------Warnock

--------------------------Herd-------------------------------

----------------Jenas---------------Bannan----------------

Gabby-------------------------------------------N'Zogbia

---------------------------Bent------------------------------

My fear is the team most likely will be this

-------------------------Given------------------------------

Hutton--------Collins-----------Dunne----------Warnock

--------------------------Herd-------------------------------

----------------Petrov-------------Jenas----------------

Gabby-------------------------------------------Heskey

---------------------------Bent------------------------------

same shit with Jenas in for Cuellar.

Collins, Hutton, Heskey need dropping. Nzogbia has to be allowed to find his form. Petrov has been alright this year but there is no future in him so I'd stick with Herd right now.

[DelboyVilla]

my team against Swansea would be something like this

-------------------------Given------------------------------

Cuellar--------Dunne-----------Clark----------Warnock

--------------------------Herd-------------------------------

----------------Jenas---------------Bannan----------------

Gabby-------------------------------------------N'Zogbia

---------------------------Bent------------------------------

My fear is the team most likely will be this

-------------------------Given------------------------------

Hutton--------Collins-----------Dunne----------Warnock

--------------------------Herd-------------------------------

----------------Petrov-------------Jenas----------------

Gabby-------------------------------------------Heskey

---------------------------Bent------------------------------

same shit with Jenas in for Cuellar.

Collins, Hutton, Heskey need dropping. Nzogbia has to be allowed to find his form. Petrov has been alright this year but there is no future in him so I'd stick with Herd right now.

I have to agree with dropping Petrov for Swansea, he is knackered and deserves a rest as he has worked his socks off for us this season. I doubt this will happen though.

[Ponky]

I would pair Petrov and Jenas and move Herd back to right-back for now, although Cuellar wasn't too bad tonight.

[Czechlad]

my team against Swansea would be something like this

-------------------------Given------------------------------

Cuellar--------Dunne-----------Clark----------Warnock

--------------------------Herd-------------------------------

----------------Jenas---------------Bannan----------------

Gabby-------------------------------------------N'Zogbia

---------------------------Bent------------------------------

My fear is the team most likely will be this

-------------------------Given------------------------------

Hutton--------Collins-----------Dunne----------Warnock

--------------------------Herd-------------------------------

----------------Petrov-------------Jenas----------------

Gabby-------------------------------------------Heskey

---------------------------Bent------------------------------

same shit with Jenas in for Cuellar.

Collins, Hutton, Heskey need dropping. Nzogbia has to be allowed to find his form. Petrov has been alright this year but there is no future in him so I'd stick with Herd right now.

The 2nd formation will be the starting one but like you, I'd rather have the 1st.

[quizme]

Not seen us and a Villa manager accept defeat in a premier league game like this for some time

Liverpool at Anfield last season

At least that game we had some of the ball and had injury problems, Petrov, Coker, Bannan, Sidwell central midfield I recall all being out, as well as Ashley Young, Heskey (who at that time was an in form player) Gabby was playing through injury. (although arguably could have been tonight) that night we had Clark, Hogg, Ireland in midfield. (which makes it difficult to 'have a go' when lacking so much quality in key areas.

The team we had out tonight wasn't stupidly better but the decisions are baffling. It's not a great midfield but in between Petrov, Herd, Bannan, Gardner, Delph, Ireland ...there is a decent trio in there somewhere or central 2.

I think for starts, Petrov and Bannan have to play. Then you pick someone alongside that. Bent and Gabby up top. Then N'Zogbia or Heskey, I'd have gone for Heskey just because wide threat and he works his socks off so not really too bothered about that, but part of a midfield 4? a midfield 4 without a single player who's going to create. At least having Heskey in the team while say a Bannan is in the team is that even if Heskey isn't providing a threat, can have Bannan, Gabby, Bent trying to make something happen. Even another midfield, given Gardner a chance, or Delph, given him a bit of freedom when we have the ball to break from midfield.

a 6 man base is fair enough (under O'Neill, I'd argue it was 5 men, with Petrov holding in front of back 4 and then the others were all more attacking minded) with other willing workers but we literally had an 8 man base today. The two banks of four, 'try and keep it down' mentallity. Gabby and Bent ....do it your own.

We're not hard to beat, we're not attacking, we're not a counter attacking side, we don't grind results out, we don't have an actual style of play. We don't go long to play off Heskey and get men round him, we don't play it short and try to keep it. We don't look to move the ball quickly into wide areas. There is no identity within this team, no structure or pattern of play that makes it easier IMO for the players to adapt too. Every game it changes, I don't think that helps.

The only games we've won, we've simply had to rely on individual brilliance from one player (in all 3 wins) against poorer opposition.

We don't even play to our strengths, I don't know what we play. It's just shit.

Truly shocking.

Great post, I fully agree. We are plain shit with no identity at all.

McLeish keeps on about defensive errors, then change the back four FFS. Put Clark on for Collins, atleast it´s something...

[Amsterdam_Neil_D]

Not seen us and a Villa manager accept defeat in a premier league game like this for some time

Liverpool at Anfield last season

At least that game we had some of the ball and had injury problems, Petrov, Coker, Bannan, Sidwell central midfield I recall all being out, as well as Ashley Young, Heskey (who at that time was an in form player) Gabby was playing through injury. (although arguably could have been tonight) that night we had Clark, Hogg, Ireland in midfield. (which makes it difficult to 'have a go' when lacking so much quality in key areas.

The team we had out tonight wasn't stupidly better but the decisions are baffling. It's not a great midfield but in between Petrov, Herd, Bannan, Gardner, Delph, Ireland ...there is a decent trio in there somewhere or central 2.

I think for starts, Petrov and Bannan have to play. Then you pick someone alongside that. Bent and Gabby up top. Then N'Zogbia or Heskey, I'd have gone for Heskey just because wide threat and he works his socks off so not really too bothered about that, but part of a midfield 4? a midfield 4 without a single player who's going to create. At least having Heskey in the team while say a Bannan is in the team is that even if Heskey isn't providing a threat, can have Bannan, Gabby, Bent trying to make something happen. Even another midfield, given Gardner a chance, or Delph, given him a bit of freedom when we have the ball to break from midfield.

a 6 man base is fair enough (under O'Neill, I'd argue it was 5 men, with Petrov holding in front of back 4 and then the others were all more attacking minded) with other willing workers but we literally had an 8 man base today. The two banks of four, 'try and keep it down' mentallity. Gabby and Bent ....do it your own.

We're not hard to beat, we're not attacking, we're not a counter attacking side, we don't grind results out, we don't have an actual style of play. We don't go long to play off Heskey and get men round him, we don't play it short and try to keep it. We don't look to move the ball quickly into wide areas. There is no identity within this team, no structure or pattern of play that makes it easier IMO for the players to adapt too. Every game it changes, I don't think that helps.

The only games we've won, we've simply had to rely on individual brilliance from one player (in all 3 wins) against poorer opposition.

We don't even play to our strengths, I don't know what we play. It's just shit.

Truly shocking.

Top post !

Hit all the nails there I think. As you said, what is our style of play these days but I suppose when (As last night proved for 15 minutes) we don't need the ball we are that good. 81 % possession Spurzzz had, even set up games for the TV featuring the Haarlem Globtrotters is not that one sided. My mrs was on the laptop while I was watching the game, her comment "Let me know when you get a kick".

Yes we all play Football manager and think we know tactics etc. Ever set a team up like that and had 20 % possession on it ? Thought not, the programmers probably thought it was not realistic enough. After 10 minutes last night I actually counted the playeys as I thought we were a man down.

Shocking and a real shot in the arm for Harry, exactley what I did not want for him so well done Villa.

[Mantis]

I am so sick of hearing McLeish talk about shit defending but not doing anything about it. That's the absolute worst thing you can do. Our defence is a joke anyway and I'm of the opinion that as long as Collins and Warnock (think it's too soon to write off Hutton) are there we will be shit defensively. However, there's absolutely no reason why he can't replace Collins with Clark or Cuellar.

[Amsterdam_Neil_D]

I am so sick of hearing McLeish talk about shit defending but not doing anything about it. That's the absolute worst thing you can do. Our defence is a joke anyway and I'm of the opinion that as long as Collins and Warnock (think it's too soon to write off Hutton) are there we will be shit defensively. However, there's absolutely no reason why he can't replace Collins with Clark or Cuellar.

I think the defence are all shit personally. The all have major problems IMO. Either too slow, can't read the game, give away free kicks, can't defend, can't distribute, can't step up as one, can't bring it out of defence and can't support.

Apart from the above, solid.

How long we been waiting for a right back ? We had a test drive of what we needed to purchase last year, we know the model and type we need so we spent a year getting the perfect RB ready for fuckface at spurzzz.

It must be nice for spurzz to have pace down the flanks with the LB /RB pushing up, we should go out and get A Young and that Downing geezer. It looks really effective with Bale and Lennon maybe we should do the same.