Houllier: Back him or sack him?

[Amed]

Did he really say "Had we won they would be chanting my name"?

WTF?!

Yes we would...Results mean everything.

No they don't. Even if he won his next 5 games it wouldn't change my view of the man and I wouldn't be singing his name.

I'm with you Trent..

agree.... the man has no clue.......had we won we would be 14th in the table.... villa fans would really be chanting his name following that??!... this is why he has to go....he has no clue...

[Stu_The_Villan]

Are you awake !

You think it is basically bollocks that people think we may go down.

We are one point off the bottom - come mid January you know !.

It is very likely we will be bottom going in February - as Blues away - no chance, Wigan away - jesus don't bare thinking about.

If we are bottom in February mate - we WILL go down, tell me how many teamsave beat relegation from that point !

Wake up for god sake !

And two wins could potentially take us top half of the table!!

Just a question...if we sack Houllier and his replacement loses three games on the trot, what do we do then?? Sack him??

[Villaboy69]

the prick lost a vast majority of supporters with his love fest for Liverpool a few weeks ago. It clear that non of the players have any respect for him or any desire to play for him. If he continues to utilise the quality players he has at his disposal in the pathetic manner that he is currently adopting then its only a matter of time. I just hope the board realise it in time

[jack_bauer87]

[jacketspuds]

Houllier out tomorrow. Then spend until Jan 15th sorting out a new manager and give him two weeks to bring in his own players. It took us 3-4 weeks to get Houllier and that has to be the worst managerial decision of the season.

All these Liverpool fans crying over Hodgson...well he isn't going to get you **** relegated.

Houllier out. Lambert in.

[Si.]

To be fair to these comments by GH. Right up until Heskey getting sent off people WERE chanting Houllier's name and chanting 'Houlliers Claret Army'. Heskey gets sent off, beardsley gets a goal and within 5 minutes the same fans were chanting 'Sacked in the Morning'.

It was understandable of him to think if we won the game the Houlliers Claret Army chants would have continued.

For the record, I was going to post exactly this...

Our fans were singing it at Chelsea on Sunday aswell.

Are you serious?! ****! I wasn't at Chelsea and I sit in the Doug Ellis so could hardly hear them singing (we weren't loud until "you're getting sacked in the morning!") but is that seriously how fickle our fans have become?

Seriously, that's **** embarrassing if true.

We ain't fickle we just don't like..anybody?

[paulanddonya]

I dont give a shit what MON did - that was nearly 6 months ago !!!.

Did MON leave with the entire squad -no he didn't !.

Now I dont like MON, I agree with your comment about wages - but dont give me this fecking tosh he bought players that were not good enough.

Our captain who was not good enough to get in the 18 last week - was voted by his peers into the Premier Team of the Year last season.

Our winger, who for some reason, the current manager thinks is an inside forward was Young Player of the Year, Gabby - you know that forward who was scoring 12-15 goals a season - is suddenly a winger - a shit winger yes - but a winger none the less.

I HATED MON - but the fact is, we had a squad we haven't had in sodding years. If you remember NRC couldn't even get into it !.

I never liked MON, I had many arguament on here about him - but dont try and blame this fecking shit on him - coz it is just burying your head !.

[RMB]

Mat Kendrick

#avfc Houllier was reassured by chief executive about his job at the end and insists he has 'firm' backing of Randy Lerner

Not only is he risking the future of our football team but he is also going to come close to losing the backing of the fans if he isn't careful. We all know once the backing has gone too it is seriously hard to get back.

Are you talking about Houllier or Lerner here?

Lerner. If he were to keep GH and we get relegated I don't think many people will still have the faith which was there this time last year.

[sellyoakvilla]

Do you really think it would be great for the team to have four different managers in five months?

Houllier comes in and loses a few games after getting sacked, for arguments sake we get Sam Allardyce in and he loses a few games on the trot and we eventually get relegated, what then?

The signs are there that we can perform as a team, i.e. Chelsea, but we have ALWAYS failed to break down teams like Sunderland at home, particularly under MON.

And for the record Steve Bruce has a very good record at Villa Park, if I recall correctly we lost to Sunderland 1-0 last season too and also failed to beat Wigan at VP over two or three seasons whilst he was manager. And he got some good results with Blues here too.

Edit: We also have no divine right to expect to beat Sunderland may I add as they are a **** good team with goalscorers

[Si.]

I dont give a shit what MON did - that was nearly 6 months ago !!!.

Did MON leave with the entire squad -no he didn't !.

Now I dont like MON, I agree with your comment about wages - but dont give me this fecking tosh he bought players that were not good enough.

Our captain who was not good enough to get in the 18 last week - was voted by his peers into the Premier Team of the Year last season.

Our winger, who for some reason, the current manager thinks is an inside forward was Young Player of the Year, Gabby - you know that forward who was scoring 12-15 goals a season - is suddenly a winger - a shit winger yes - but a winger none the less.

I HATED MON - but the fact is, we had a squad we haven't had in sodding years. If you remember NRC couldn't even get into it !.

I never liked MON, I had many arguament on here about him - but dont try and blame this fecking shit on him - coz it is just burying your head !.

Why don't we bring in Stevie Boy Hodge as our next manager?

[YankeeinMadrid]

Well I know you claim to be Ireland's best mate or ITK or something like that so you probably think that gives you some insight into the club that the rest of us don't see. You tell me this though, what has Faulkner done for our club? Be instrumental in the sale of Milner and the bringing in of Ireland , advise Lerner to stop spending, be instrumental in the appointment of Houllier. All of that IMO is incompetent. We were far better off before he arrived at our club.

That first bit is unneccessary, for starters.

Secondly, he was instrumental in the sale of Milner in as far as he assisted MON in negotiating the deal that MON wanted after Milner wanted to leave.

Did he advise Lerner to stop spending? Show me..

I know very little about Paul Faulkner, but some of the abuse he gets on here is absolutely vile. I thought we, as a club and as a fanbase, were better than that.

You say it's unneccessary but it's not because you either do or you don't know something about the Milner deal that the rest of us dont? Do you know whether MON wanted to sell Milner? I suspect that he didn't. If this is the case then between Faulkner and Lerner they could have stopped that deal going ahead (which is what they should have done when we didn't have a manager in place, another example of his incompetency there for you).

When did Lernr tighten the purse strings? When Faulkner arrived. Coincidence? Maybe, maybe not. I'm sorry if you think the abuse towards him is vile but I think he deserves it. He pissed about in appointing a manager and ended up being instrumental in appointing this loser Houllier so he is therefore partially responsible for the mess that we now find us in. Houllier is a large part of Faulkner's stamp on the club to date.

Wind your neck in for a second...

No, MON didn't want to sell Milner. Nobody wanted to sell him. However, when you're faced with a situation where a player wants to leave, is not entertaining the idea of a new contract and there is a club interested who have a habit of spending insane amounts of money on players, you make a decision.. MON and the board made a decision jointly to sell Milner when they were able to negotiate an acceptable deal with Man City. As for stopping the deal when MON left, that would have cost the club approx £5million in penalty clauses. In fact, I'd say it would have been incompetent of the Chief Executive to call off the deal at that cost.

You say we were better off before he came here? Well, Faulkner became Chief Operating Officer in May 2008. I think we've been doing quite well with him on board, up until August last year.

I don't wanna let the truth get in the way of any arguments, but Penalty Clauses (by definition) in Contract Law cannot be enforced! They are only used to try to force a party into completing their part of an agreement in a timely manner. These clauses are thrown out in court. It doesn't matter what they name the "penalty clause". If it is deemed to be a penalty clause, its unenforceable.

[MrMoseley]

I can't believe Houllier was "happy" with that performance, we were fecking clueless. There is no pattern to our play, everyone looks scared stiff of the ball, Gabby would have been more use standing in the queue for my chips at half time than where he was played. I was prepared to give him time due to the injuries, that excuse doesn't stand up now, to persevere with that formation when it was so obvious it wasn't working is just plain stupid. Potatoe head must have thought all his christmas's had come at once.

For me there was also something weird about A Young lumping balls into the box towards the end and ignoring Friedel's attempts to take responsibility. Surely he would be better waiting for the knock down in the box rather than hanging around on the half way line. He seems to give a hell of a lot of stick out to those around him, whilst hardly be setting the world alight himself. Maybe as there is a dirth of direction coming from the bench, he's taking on the role of captain/manager himself? Can't blame him for trying but it points to a lack of management for me. players should know their roles but at times we looked a total mess.

[GaztonVilla]

As for stopping the deal when MON left, that would have cost the club approx £5million in penalty clauses. In fact, I'd say it would have been incompetent of the Chief Executive to call off the deal at that cost.

No it wouldn't. Do you know anything about contract law?

I'll admit I don't know a lot about contract law so why don't you enlighten me?

Manchester City and Aston Villa signed a Memorandum of Understanding the week before the England international stating that an agreement had been reached between the two clubs for the transfer of James Milner for a fee of approx £18m plus Stephen Ireland. In that MOU, it was stated that were any party to cancel the deal, they would be liable to pay the other party approximately £5million as a cancellation charge as well as covering the costs (legal, medical etc) that were incurred. I believe that the only circumstances in which the transfer could be cancelled without the cancellation clause being invoked was if either player were to be found to have an injury causing sufficient concern to the club's insurers as to make the transfer impossible.

The MOU was signed after MON approved the transfer. I believe it was signed on the morning of the friendly vs Valencia.

Now, I admit I don't know an awful lot about contract law, so which part of the above is bollocks and shows Paul Faulkner to be incompetent?

[Shillzz]

He'll stay, I'm 99% sure of it.

[jacketspuds]

The worst thing hasn't been the results, but the performances. Apart from Chelsea and Man Utd we have been consistently awful. The form table and current standings do not lie at all.

Our squad looks like it has less morale than a fluffer.

Our manager is clueless.

So frustrating.

Something is massively wrong at Villa. It's either the squad or the manager and as we don't have time to replace 10-15 players this month there really is only one other option.

[carew_villa]

Back him!!!

Randy and Faulkner obviously like him and see him as a long term appointment, and barring anything disastrous, he'll still be at the club next year IMO. We should support him.

[GaztonVilla]

I don't wanna let the truth get in the way of any arguments, but Penalty Clauses (by definition) in Contract Law cannot be enforced! They are only used to try to force a party into completing their part of an agreement in a timely manner. These clauses are thrown out in court. It doesn't matter what they name the "penalty clause". If it is deemed to be a penalty clause, its unenforceable.

Fair play. I guess that's why the lawyers are able to charge what they charge. Like I said, I don't know the intricacies of it but that's what I've been told.

[TRO]

Yes let's all blame MON who has not managed a single game. Is it MON's fault that Houllier wouldnt be able to manage himself out of a paper bag never mind the team. I was at the game today, travelled from Manchester as I work away and for it to be 60mins before we have an attempt at goal is shocking. Seriously guys get ready as were heading down, other teams have proved they can grind results out, we can't and our manager comes out of his dug out 5 times.

well he may not of managed a single game, but they are all his purchases, they are the players who have listened to his doctrine for 4 years and then watched him dump them in a flash.....are you saying thay are not to be affected by that double standard.

yes its the responsibility of the present incumbent and for what its worth its looking pretty grim for him (despite 17 odd games, an injury list that would drag any confidence out of a team and no opportunity until now to bring anyone in)and being a bit too soon to be comfortable to be calling for his head.

If we are to go down O'Neill can take every bit as much as Houllier in terms of blame for this mess.

Ps It may well be Houllier ain't right for our club, but any manager given c 17 games ain't right either....Randy must take some of this responsibility along with Faulkner.

don't forget Faulkner is the 3rd CEO after cunnah and fitzgerald, so all may not be right there either.

[gilbertoAVFC]

To be fair to these comments by GH. Right up until Heskey getting sent off people WERE chanting Houllier's name and chanting 'Houlliers Claret Army'. Heskey gets sent off, beardsley gets a goal and within 5 minutes the same fans were chanting 'Sacked in the Morning'.

It was understandable of him to think if we won the game the Houlliers Claret Army chants would have continued.

For the record, I was going to post exactly this...

Our fans were singing it at Chelsea on Sunday aswell.

Are you serious?! ****! I wasn't at Chelsea and I sit in the Doug Ellis so could hardly hear them singing (we weren't loud until "you're getting sacked in the morning!") but is that seriously how fickle our fans have become?

Seriously, that's **** embarrassing if true.

We ain't fickle we just don't like..anybody?

I despair for this club I really do. It's the fans as much as anybody that has bought this downfall.

As Sky pump more money into the game and players demand a bigger salary, fans ticket prices will just get steeper and steeper. You might think I'm going off on some tangent but as these ticket prices get higher, it will increase the expectations of fans to get their money's worth and this will have an adverse effect on the performance of a team. Murdoch + Villa fans = bad mix.

Yes, it's the same for everybody in the Prem, but not everybody in the Prem has a huge percentage of their support living on past glories of winning the European Cup. There are so many fans who's expectations are too high and as a result when thing's go bad at Villa, things get really bad.

I fear for us, I really do. It feels like we are turning into Forest #II and we are self-destructing in with huge consequences.

Sorry for that cynical rant, but like I said, when things turn shit (they never really did under MON), they really do turn shit and everyone is to blame except the fans but when you see just how low and fickle some people are.. I dunno. Maybe a few Villa fans (who I don't suppose post on this bored because they forgot their **** password to get onto their computer) need to look at themselves, because its just embarrassing.

People underestimate the power of fans.

[YankeeinMadrid]

As for stopping the deal when MON left, that would have cost the club approx £5million in penalty clauses. In fact, I'd say it would have been incompetent of the Chief Executive to call off the deal at that cost.

No it wouldn't. Do you know anything about contract law?

I'll admit I don't know a lot about contract law so why don't you enlighten me?

Manchester City and Aston Villa signed a Memorandum of Understanding the week before the England international stating that an agreement had been reached between the two clubs for the transfer of James Milner for a fee of approx £18m plus Stephen Ireland. In that MOU, it was stated that were any party to cancel the deal, they would be liable to pay the other party approximately £5million as a cancellation charge as well as covering the costs (legal, medical etc) that were incurred. I believe that the only circumstances in which the transfer could be cancelled without the cancellation clause being invoked was if either player were to be found to have an injury causing sufficient concern to the club's insurers as to make the transfer impossible.

The MOU was signed after MON approved the transfer. I believe it was signed on the morning of the friendly vs Valencia.

Now, I admit I don't know an awful lot about contract law, so which part of the above is bollocks and shows Paul Faulkner to be incompetent?

MOU's and other Penalty Clauses in Sports are only to put some pressure on the parties to get the deal done quickly. I have no opinion on Faulkner tbh, just wanted to clear up the 5m bullshit