Richard Posted August 3, 2011 Author Share Posted August 3, 2011 I really want Ireland to be a star this season...mainly just to piss all the negative doubters off!!! This! I think he'll be great for us this season and will silence a lot of critics! This is just wishful thinking, with all due respect. All the evidence so far suggests he will offer us very little. And what evidence would that be?I'm guessing it's the evidence of him actually playing for us Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flamingsombrero Posted August 3, 2011 Share Posted August 3, 2011 I really want Ireland to be a star this season...mainly just to piss all the negative doubters off!!! This! I think he'll be great for us this season and will silence a lot of critics! This is just wishful thinking, with all due respect. All the evidence so far suggests he will offer us very little. And what evidence would that be?I'm guessing it's the evidence of him actually playing for us Exactly! Nobody is "doubting" him, we know he's shite, it's there for all to see. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wiggyrichard Posted August 3, 2011 Share Posted August 3, 2011 What a complete load of rubbish! He played 30 minutes against Walsall and an hour against Chelsea. The 30 minutes he played against Walsall, he was head and shoulders the best player on the pitch. And for the hour he played against Chelsea, he was the only one doing the closing down. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BOF Posted August 3, 2011 Moderator Share Posted August 3, 2011 The trouble is that both sides have a point here and it does no-one (and certainly not the discussion) any good to say things like "Nobody is "doubting" him, we know he's shite". Ireland had a piss poor season last season, we all know that, but we also know that his head wasn't in it. He probably didn't particularly want to leave City and he appeared to be sent to Newcastle against his will too. So he wasn't the only one to appear to have issues with Houllier. He has come back this pre-season and seems to be more up for it as evidenced by his performances in the few friendlies he has appeared in and through anecdotal evidence. What we do know is what he is capable of when his head is in the right place and his head seems to be closer to that place this season than it has been at any previous point in his Villa career. So we seem to have some people clinging to the undisputable fact that he was poor last season and that he won't change and they won't give him the benefit, and we have those who have seen and heard the clear differences this season and want to give him a chance to show that he is the player he was for City. Is he a risk? Yes on the evidence of last season he probably is. Is it potentially worth it? Yes absolutely he is worth it. Is there anyone else in the squad (now that Young has gone) who can play the role Ireland plays? No. So let's try and have a constructive discussion about him rather than some pointless shit-flinging contest where we stick fingers in our ears every time the other side opens their mouth. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wiggyrichard Posted August 3, 2011 Share Posted August 3, 2011 The trouble is that both sides have a point here and it does no-one (and certainly not the discussion) any good to say things like "Nobody is "doubting" him, we know he's shite". Ireland had a piss poor season last season, we all know that, but we also know that his head wasn't in it. He probably didn't particularly want to leave City and he appeared to be sent to Newcastle against his will too. So he wasn't the only one to appear to have issues with Houllier. He has come back this pre-season and seems to be more up for it as evidenced by his performances in the few friendlies he has appeared in and through anecdotal evidence. What we do know is what he is capable of when his head is in the right place and his head seems to be closer to that place this season than it has been at any previous point in his Villa career. So we seem to have some people clinging to the undisputable fact that he was poor last season and that he won't change and they won't give him the benefit, and we have those who have seen and heard the clear differences this season and want to give him a chance to show that he is the player he was for City. Is he a risk? Yes on the evidence of last season he probably is. Is it potentially worth it? Yes absolutely he is worth it. Is there anyone else in the squad (now that Young has gone) who can play the role Ireland plays? No. So let's try and have a constructive discussion about him rather than some pointless shit-flinging contest where we stick fingers in our ears every time the other side opens their mouth. What's your point? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BOF Posted August 3, 2011 Moderator Share Posted August 3, 2011 My point is that some need to give him a chance and stop writing off his improved attitude and performances so far this pre-season simply because he had a poor first season under what may have been extenuating circumstances. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wiggyrichard Posted August 3, 2011 Share Posted August 3, 2011 Sorry mate, i forgot the :winkold: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BOF Posted August 3, 2011 Moderator Share Posted August 3, 2011 I was wondering how you'd missed it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HackneyVillain Posted August 3, 2011 Share Posted August 3, 2011 Completely agree with BOF. The question is how long will he be given? My guess is if he doesn't perform in the first 3-4 games that may be it for Ireland at Villa so I really hope he (cliché alert) hits the ground running. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
switters Posted August 3, 2011 Share Posted August 3, 2011 Completely agree with BOF. The question is how long will he be given? My guess is if he doesn't perform in the first 3-4 games that may be it for Ireland at Villa so I really hope he (cliché alert) hits the ground running. I'm not sure that's exactly true. If we get to the end of the transfer window with the squad as it is now, Ireland will have at least until the January transfer window to get chances in the team. Simply don't have the squad to sideline him completely, though he could find himself behind someone like Gardner in the pecking order should he fail to perform. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T.Daley Posted August 3, 2011 Share Posted August 3, 2011 I predict he will score a brace tonight...or he will be subbed after 40 mins never to be seen again. He really needs a goal to kick start his Villa career. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BOF Posted August 3, 2011 Moderator Share Posted August 3, 2011 I don't think Ireland will just be given 3-4 games either. Eck seems to clearly want all of our prodigal talents to feature prominently and the likes of Ireland and Warnock have featured whenever they've been fit to. I do still think Ireland needs to be given a freer role than he has had, because he's not been strong enough in the tackle. He needs to be allowed to concentrate on the attacking aspects where he excels, and the likes of Petrov/Makoun/Delph to mop up and break up opposition attacks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HackneyVillain Posted August 3, 2011 Share Posted August 3, 2011 Completely agree with BOF. The question is how long will he be given? My guess is if he doesn't perform in the first 3-4 games that may be it for Ireland at Villa so I really hope he (cliché alert) hits the ground running. I'm not sure that's exactly true. If we get to the end of the transfer window with the squad as it is now, Ireland will have at least until the January transfer window to get chances in the team. Simply don't have the squad to sideline him completely, though he could find himself behind someone like Gardner in the pecking order should he fail to perform. I think Bannan would take his place myself but Gardner will hopefully push for a first team place. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaulMcGrath_5 Posted August 3, 2011 Share Posted August 3, 2011 I had a dream last night that he scored a cracking free kick against Derby. Therefore, I think he deserves a chance.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard Posted August 3, 2011 Author Share Posted August 3, 2011 I personally do not buy the story that he has improved dramatically this pre season. I still think he is basically a rich man's Lee Hendrie, where Lee is better than him is at least Lee wanted to be here I do not think he will make a positive impression next season at all, certainly not the dominant match winning craetive midfielder driving us forward impression that some people seem to feel he is capable of However on saying all that I do think Mcleish is stuck between the devil and a hard place with him. Shift him on for the 2M we would probably get for him and not replace him, certainly not replace him with the 2M received, or try and get something out of him next season. I think he is in that position with one or two players actually but with Ireland it is worse as it is such a pivotal position to the team now in terms os a role that should craete things for us. I guess Mcleish has decided to stick with him. I do not expect him to get anything out of Ireland at all as I think he is a waster but I completely understand Mcleish's position. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BOF Posted August 3, 2011 Moderator Share Posted August 3, 2011 Good post Richard and I can certainly understand that point of view. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LondonLax Posted August 3, 2011 Share Posted August 3, 2011 My point is that some need to give him a chance and stop writing off his improved attitude and performances so far this pre-season simply because he had a poor first season under what may have been extenuating circumstances. The thing is, he also had a poor season the season before that for Man City leading to him being sold. The only good spell he has had in his career was one season playing off Robinho and Elano and even then Man City were only performing at home. That season they were poor away and finished below us in 8th from memory. I'd love it if Ireland could capture that bit of form he showed at home that season but it seems more and more like that was the exception rather than the norm. A purple patch in an otherwise mediocre career so far. I am willing to give him a chance but mostly because we have nothing to lose and no one commanding a place in centre mid but I am not expecting a lot to come from him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gilbertoAVFC Posted August 3, 2011 Share Posted August 3, 2011 A purple patch in an otherwise mediocre career so far. You see, whilst this is so far true in Ireland's career, you don't lose ability (at least at the age he's at - then again you're not meant to lose hair at that age either). There is a very gifted player in there somewhere and I firmly believe that if him and his team-mates gel and he starts to settle at Villa, we will see that. McLeish has all the attributes to deal with somebody like Ireland - not saying he's a bad intentioned player, because I don't think he is - he does need to have an arm around him though to get the best out of him and he will get that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wiggyrichard Posted August 4, 2011 Share Posted August 4, 2011 Was he any good last night? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neil Posted August 4, 2011 Share Posted August 4, 2011 Was he any good last night? Ahh yes, someone let us know....ashamedly I completely forgot about the game last night. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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