tonyh29 Posted February 13, 2015 Share Posted February 13, 2015 So you agree it's the same crime ...so therefore your issue is a class thing Legally avoiding paying your tax isn't a crime so where as your builders are knowingly commiting a crime your man in a suit isn't ... So it's the wine drinking man in a boiler suit we should be going after Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrisp65 Posted February 13, 2015 Share Posted February 13, 2015 Class? We haven't been talking about social 'class' have we? Nah, come on, you're just playing thatcher's advocate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
meregreen Posted February 13, 2015 Share Posted February 13, 2015 So you agree it's the same crime ...so therefore your issue is a class thing Legally avoiding paying your tax isn't a crime so where as your builders are knowingly commiting a crime your man in a suit isn't ... So it's the wine drinking man in a boiler suit we should be going after How many plumbers do you know who require a Swiss bank account to hide their money. Legally, these tax avoidance maneuverings might just be the right side of some fairly lax laws. But morally, I personally find them reprehensible. Makes the world seem like it's populated by spivs and shysters. But then it probably is. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
markavfc40 Posted February 13, 2015 Share Posted February 13, 2015 as I've said before a lot of the people out in the real world moaning about them there tax evaders are yer builders and plumbers who will give you a quote for £1200 but do it for £1000 cash no questions asked when they do it it's "good on you" but wear a suit and try and avoid your tax and you are the biggest criminal on the planet again I'm speaking in very simplified terms and we are talking different amounts involved for sure , but its our duty to pay as little tax as possible ... heck I sneak through a marathon bar on my expenses every now and then and feel great that I've got one over the system If the world was a black and white place I'd agree with you. But there's a case being bandied around today of a millionaire that has self confessed not paid a penny income tax in 24 years and the IR have no plans to prosecute. That is simply not the same league as getting £100 off your plumbers bill. I can't argue that it's not essentially the same crime. But we hunt down people with an unused bedroom and sneak around videoing people on disability that can play golf. We apparently have ten times more people chasing benefit cheats than chasing tax dodgers. It just feels a bit unfair. If we all got done for driving at 35mph but people in Bentleys were allowed to do whatever speed they fancied, it wouldn't make us right, but it wouldn't exactly be fair. A simple like didn't do this justice. Chrisp this is a great post. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tonyh29 Posted February 13, 2015 Share Posted February 13, 2015 ...but if you pay tradesmen cash in hand you are avoiding tax. Sell your house for £249,999 and then accept £10k for "appliances" you're avoiding tax.I don't employ tradesmen and don't own a home (I think that may go for a lot of people, too). Same. Do you have a pension ? If so you pay into it and ....well you avoid paying tax and legally Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tonyh29 Posted February 13, 2015 Share Posted February 13, 2015 Class? We haven't been talking about social 'class' have we? Nah, come on, you're just playing thatcher's advocate. Presumably you brought up Bentleys because your postman drives one ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrisp65 Posted February 13, 2015 Share Posted February 13, 2015 (edited) Class? We haven't been talking about social 'class' have we? Nah, come on, you're just playing thatcher's advocate. Presumably you brought up Bentleys because your postman drives one ? it was an example of an expensive car you really don't have to be upper class to drive one Edited February 13, 2015 by chrisp65 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bickster Posted February 13, 2015 Author Moderator Share Posted February 13, 2015 Anyone who has paid anyone cash in hand to do a job for them has also illegally avoided tax.No, wrong. Firstly that would be tax evasion (semantics I know) but and its a big but… its the person receiving the cash that has evaded the tax not the person paying it.So anyone paying cash in hand to someone has not avoided / evaded tax, The person not declaring that income to HMRC is the guilty party. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snowychap Posted February 13, 2015 Share Posted February 13, 2015 Do you have a pension ?No, I don't have a pension. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post chrisp65 Posted February 14, 2015 Popular Post Share Posted February 14, 2015 9 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post blandy Posted February 14, 2015 Moderator Popular Post Share Posted February 14, 2015 Exactly as per that picture - ISAs and not earning enough to pay tax, are not "tax avoidance" - ISAs were set up by the Government who said "we invite you to put your UK money into these UK accounts". Not earning money isn't avoiding tax, it's not having any money. Moving your money to abroad, and hiding it from the tax man - that's either illegal evasion, or tax avoidance by weaseling. 10 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MakemineVanilla Posted February 14, 2015 Share Posted February 14, 2015 The cartoon above certainly verges on propaganda in the way it misrepresents the benefits of non-dom status, by suggesting that non-doms don't pay any tax. The truth is rather different to the left's calculated misrepresentation. Non-doms are required to pay a sliding scale of fixed charges (£30K to £90k) depending how long they've been in the country, to protect money earned outside the UK. Seems quite a lot of money for the benefit of public services most of the population pay either a lot less for, or nothing at all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peterms Posted February 14, 2015 Share Posted February 14, 2015 So you agree it's the same crime ...so therefore your issue is a class thing No, it's a "Justice" thing. You know, "We are all equal before the law". The only possible moral justification for obeying the law. When it is shown, as it has been, that some people are free to avoid paying taxes, and another, very possibly overlapping group, is free to rape children, in both cases without being prosecuted though their crimes were known to people in a position to prosecute them, then you may expect a reaction. Possibly a political reaction, which would be my preference. Otherwise, a more direct and violent reaction. Both should concern you. I don't know if you are trying to lighten the mood, or laugh off and shield this evil under the cloud of lightheartedness. Both seem inappropriate to me. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrisp65 Posted February 14, 2015 Share Posted February 14, 2015 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tonyh29 Posted February 14, 2015 Share Posted February 14, 2015 (edited) So you agree it's the same crime ...so therefore your issue is a class thing No, it's a "Justice" thing. You know, "We are all equal before the law". The only possible moral justification for obeying the law. When it is shown, as it has been, that some people are free to avoid paying taxes, and another, very possibly overlapping group, is free to rape children, in both cases without being prosecuted though their crimes were known to people in a position to prosecute them, then you may expect a reaction. Possibly a political reaction, which would be my preference. Otherwise, a more direct and violent reaction. Both should concern you. I don't know if you are trying to lighten the mood, or laugh off and shield this evil under the cloud of lightheartedness. Both seem inappropriate to me. With respect child rape has never been mentioned by me in this thread so whilst unintentional it's a little unfair to suggest I'm applying light heartedness to that subject... Tax avoidance .. Well to be honest it's not something I get angry about , if people can get away with it via legal means then good luck to them ... To link it to benefit fraud is great as headlines and pie charts go but "fraud" is the operative word here ... Do I think it's right that people with illness are told they are fit for work and deprived of benefits ... Absolutely not , do I think someone faking an injury and claiming money should be deprived of benefits ... Yes but not at the current cost which seems to be penalising those that are genuine Edited February 14, 2015 by tonyh29 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjmooney Posted February 15, 2015 VT Supporter Share Posted February 15, 2015 This crackdown... sorry help for people with obesity 'issues'... I'd love it if they put Eric Pickles in charge of it. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bickster Posted February 16, 2015 Author Moderator Share Posted February 16, 2015 This crackdown... sorry help for people with obesity 'issues'... I'd love it if they put Eric Pickles in charge of it. Here's one obese twunt that should lose his benefits 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MakemineVanilla Posted February 16, 2015 Share Posted February 16, 2015 Obesity is such a problem amongst the poor these days that the media are increasingly finding it difficult to find people thin enough to appear in their stories about food banks. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tonyh29 Posted February 16, 2015 Share Posted February 16, 2015 This crackdown... sorry help for people with obesity 'issues'... I'd love it if they put Eric Pickles in charge of it. Here's one obese twunt that should lose his benefits he is working though (at least until May 8th ) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villaajax Posted February 16, 2015 Share Posted February 16, 2015 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8qjBec3fpBI Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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