The Film Thread

[flamingsombrero]

I once had to write a 3000 word essay on Shane so I've always had an appreciation for that one. Other Westerns I've enjoyed include the odd atmosphere created in High Plains Drifter and the downright bizarre Django Kill! (If You Live Shoot).

As for the more modern releases they have on the whole been very very good but for me Assassination of Jesse James is head and shoulders above the rest.

[mjmooney]

When I was young, my dad would often have Westerns on and I hated them.

But as I grew into more of a film geek I do enjoy a lot of the more modern ones as well as a fair few of the older 'classics'. I still can't say I like a lot of the older fair - they're too... staid.

I'm the exact opposite. When I was a kid, my dad and I would watch old westerns and I loved them to the exclusion of almost everything else. Hence they have a VERY strong nostalgia buzz for me.

But the change in emphasis that you correctly point out with the "newer" ones (Leone onwards) means that I never QUITE enjoy them as much (although I will still watch them, with a geek's obsessiveness - for one thing the new ones are usually more "authentic" in terms of history, costume, guns, etc.)

You're spot-on about "Open Range" - total B-movie fodder (not that that's a bad thing in itself - I love the Bud Boetticher/Randolph Scott "B"s of the 50s). Costner's "Wyatt Earp" is also a poor relation to the much superior "Tombstone".

Don't apologise - it's a sign of weakness.

[theunderstudy]

Heath Ledger as the Joker was perfect though, if he was alive today it would be a travesty had he not got the Oscar. Iwas very impressed with True Grit.

[Chindie]

I think part of the change you get around about the time Leone comes along is that the films become more... professional might be the word. My experience of the older ones is that they generally appeared to have been made for pittance, the actors in them had careers because they looked half decent, could ride a horse and did what they told, and the stories were always knocked together 'the good guy gets the girl and the baddie (in the black hat) gets his comeuppance' stuff with narry a diversion from that plot (literally played as straight and to the letter of that as possible) and the whole comes off as a bit naff.

Leone comes along and he has a good eye for a shot, so immediately the thing looks better on the screen, and he has more flair in his plotting. Even if ultimately he doesn't veer too far from the tried and tested 'the good guy wins', he plays a little more with it, he gives his characters more 'character'. And he's working with more talented actors.

Old old Westerns generally are B-movies. Even the really well held ones. Even a lot of Wayne vehicles, a man who could act but generally it was one character in different suits he was playing in his sleep.

I prefer the more pro, grandiose modern films, ultimately. Though despite it's connection to the old school Westerns, I really like Open Range. It's a little naff but it's played so well I let it go, and it helps that I find Costner fundamentally likeable.

[BOF]

I agreed with the Ledger oscar. Totally won on merit. Actually checking now, I didn't realise Bridges didn't win one. I thought he had. Justice done so

[Chindie]

I've actually seen the 3:10 to Yuma remake, mainly because Christian Bale was in it. I've also recently seen the True Grit remake which was fairly 'meh'. People criticised the posthumous oscar given to Ledger in TDK because "being a mad man in makeup is an actor's wet dream". I felt the same about Bridges in True Grit. Being a disgruntled, perpetually pissed, layabout with zero effort in his elocution is also a fairly easy thing for even a half-decent actor to pull off.

I like the 3:10 remake. It's hokum but clearly everyone is having an amazing time making it, Crowe especially. It's also the film that made me realise something a US critic had said about Christian Bale, is fairly true. He often plays the kinda... straight, dull, non-eye catching role when another actor is playing the character that gets the cameras attention. Almost like a straight man in a comedy.

I also like True Grit and I really like Bridges portrayal of Cogburn. I don't think he was on top of his game or anything, but the character is really such a good one that he picks it up and runs with it, and he has the presence to really do it - I think a lot of half decent actors would have collapsed under the character and not have been as convincing. It's a very good story too, the 'race for life' at the end is surprisingly effective thanks to the performance of the 2 leads.

[theunderstudy]

The Dark Knight is one of the best films I've watched in the last 5 years.

[theunderstudy]

Yeah the lass in True Grit's revamp was very very good. Hailie something? Name escapes me.

[Chindie]

The Dark Knight is a very good film, one of my favourites and I've watched it far too many times, but it's got a lot of weird problems.

The underpass chase has loads of confusing cinematography errors. I noticed that something felt off about that whole scene when I first saw it at the cinema and it was only when I watched a video that pointed out how the way it's shot makes you confused about the orientation of everything. This is particularly bizarre because the problems basically constitute a serious of schoolboy errors that make up the entire scene.

The final confrontation with the Joker is a mess thanks to the 'sonar' thing. Which itself I always go 'Naaaaaaaaah' at.

Fingerprint off a bullet thing.

And so on.

It's a great film (that has a pretty grim message behind it - you can analyse it as a terrorism parable that justifies doing whatever is necessary to fight an evil), but it's got loads of flaws.

[mjmooney]

Yeah the lass in True Grit's revamp was very very good. Hailie something? Name escapes me.

Hailee Steinfeld. First-time actor, and she was brilliant - exactly like the character in the book. Did her own stunts, too - riding the horse through the rapids, etc.

[Ingram85]

The Game (Douglas/Penn)

:notworthy:

It was awesome. Brilliant film. Not a massive douglas fan but he was superb in this. Felt Penn (tee hee) was underused but that was more to do with the story not really needing him that much I guess. Still, top film! Any other good films in a decent vein?

[mjmooney]

Leone comes along and he has a good eye for a shot, so immediately the thing looks better on the screen, and he has more flair in his plotting. Even if ultimately he doesn't veer too far from the tried and tested 'the good guy wins', he plays a little more with it, he gives his characters more 'character'. And he's working with more talented actors.

Partly agree, partly disagree.

The "eye for a shot" and the look of the films - absolutely. Leone was a master of the close-up and the tracking shot, and he could choreograph a gunfight like no-one else. He was also massively helped by Morricone's soundtracks.

Flair in the plotting? Nah. He stripped it down to its basic elements - basically a bunch of guys fighting each other for two hours. As a "gunfight porn" junkie, I loved that, but ultimately I missed the light and shade you'd get in the older movies. I thought I didn't enjoy the comedy and romance elements from the old oaters - until they weren't there. Leone tends to be a bit "all meat and no potatoes".

And there's more psychology in any ten minutes of "High Noon" or "Red River" than the whole of the Dollars trilogy.

[Stevo985]

The Dark Knight is a very good film, one of my favourites and I've watched it far too many times, but it's got a lot of weird problems.

The underpass chase has loads of confusing cinematography errors. I noticed that something felt off about that whole scene when I first saw it at the cinema and it was only when I watched a video that pointed out how the way it's shot makes you confused about the orientation of everything. This is particularly bizarre because the problems basically constitute a serious of schoolboy errors that make up the entire scene.

The final confrontation with the Joker is a mess thanks to the 'sonar' thing. Which itself I always go 'Naaaaaaaaah' at.

Fingerprint off a bullet thing.

And so on.

It's a great film (that has a pretty grim message behind it - you can analyse it as a terrorism parable that justifies doing whatever is necessary to fight an evil), but it's got loads of flaws.

I completely agree about the sonar and the bullet thing.

I LOVE the film, one of my favourites. but, as you said, those 2 bits I always find to be too unrealistic.

Which sounds stupid when you're talking about a man dressed as a bat defending a city from crime, to be pinickity about realism. But those two things are just too far out for my liking. Feels like they really didn't need to be there either.

[CarewsEyebrowDesigner]

the more i watch dark knight, the less i like it. seems to be a common trait with nolan's films.

i think batman begins has the right tone, and stays within nolan's apparent criteeria for a grieving man without having to blow up a main character during an incredibly contrived scene.

the dark knight is a good, solid film with plenty to admire, but i don't think it's brilliant by any stretch.

[Stevo985]

I'm still on the brilliant side of the fence. I really love it. But it's not faultless.

Inception, I agree with your theory entirely. Less good with repeat viewings, although it blew me away when i first saw it.

[BOF]

TDK is still one of my favourite films and, like Chindie, I could play a(ny) part in it at this stage. I never particularly liked Inception. People thought it was hard to follow (the levels). For me it wasn't and probably for that reason to me it was a normal film that didn't live up to it's hype. Maybe if I'd seen it without the hype I would have liked it more. I'm also not the big Joseph Gordon-Levitt fan that everyone else seems to be these days. I still see him as the kid from 3rd Rock From The Sun and I can't get past that

[coda]

I found with Inception the more levels they went down the less I cared. I'd almost lost interest by that snow scene.

[Stevo985]

I followed it too. My problem with it is that it doesn't make sense. As in, there are holes in the logic (or rather THEIR logic, as logical as something like that can be)

And I genuinely think those are mistakes rather than intentional.

I do like Gordon-Levitt though. He was excellent in Brick (which is a great film)

[mjmooney]

Perhaps I should give Inception another try. I abandoned it after about 20 minutes.

[BOF]

Perhaps I should give Inception another try. I abandoned it after about 20 minutes.

That's interesting. I rarely abandon a film once I've started. It has to be truly atrocious to the point of annoying before I'll give up. For example if I find out 20 minutes in that Ben Stiller is in it. That might do the trick.