"The Terrace View" - Upper Holte Lounge

[villan-scott]

13 hours ago, Hereford-Villan said:

I spoke with them earlier. 10% allocation of overall away tickets will be allocated to the terrace view in a ballot just for terrace view i was told. I went to buy 2 tickets but was told i couldn't as my wife wasn't on the season ticket wait list which is frankly ridiculous!

Waiting for them to get back to me about it

Can’t you just add her to the list then go back and buy? The opportunity for Terrace View went to all on the list - so I’d just add her now then try again?

[Hereford-Villan]

44 minutes ago, villan-scott said:

Can’t you just add her to the list then go back and buy? The opportunity for Terrace View went to all on the list - so I’d just add her now then try again?

I've tried that and it isn't showing as available to her account

[OutByEaster?]

9 hours ago, Hereford-Villan said:

I don't think it is. it certainly sounded like 10% of overall tickets as i made a point to say that i was really interested in away tickets. 

Blimey - if it is, then the trust are right and I can see there being some very lively debate with the away ticketing group and Mr Heck!

 

[Robbie09]

11 hours ago, Hereford-Villan said:

I don't think it is. it certainly sounded like 10% of overall tickets as i made a point to say that i was really interested in away tickets. 

If that’s true then that’s 130 tickets for Bournemouth which means 130 fans that like me attended every away game last season potentially misses out to a new STH.

Makes a mockery of the whole system.

[Don_Simon]

1 minute ago, Robbie09 said:

If that’s true then that’s 130 tickets for Bournemouth which means 130 fans that like me attended every away game last season potentially misses out to a new STH.

Makes a mockery of the whole system.

I feel like a lunatic with this whole thing, but even this is annoying me. Season Ticket Holder by jumping the queue because they're much wealthier than the others. 

[delboy54]

This whole ticket thing is a debacle.

Terrace View

Existing ST holders

Claret members

Away tickets

Villa have really screwed this up royally

[brommy]

1 hour ago, delboy54 said:

This whole ticket thing is a debacle.

Terrace View

Existing ST holders

Claret members

Away tickets

Villa have really screwed this up royally

If you think fans are annoyed now, wait until we're fighting for seats when the capacity is reduced to less than 36k for 2 seasons!

[GeordieVillan]

4 hours ago, Don_Simon said:

I feel like a lunatic with this whole thing, but even this is annoying me. Season Ticket Holder by jumping the queue because they're much wealthier than the others. 

Let’s just be a bit careful here. The distinction shouldn’t be that some fans are wealthier than others, it is that some fans are prepared to pay the premium for the Terrace View, even though it may not represent great value (pound for pound). That does not make them better or worse fans or better or worse people for that matter!

I would imagine that fans attending away games spend a lot more than £82 per game on tickets/travel/beers, so this isn’t necessarily a financial issue anyway, it’s about choice.

If you want to make the argument that because some fans are wealthier than others they are receiving some kind of privilege by accessing Terrace View, then you could argue that regular general admission season ticket holders have privilege because they access extra/away tickets before some others who can’t afford a season ticket, or that those attending all away games last season shouldn’t get priority on away games this season because other fans would like to do that but may not be able to afford it. It’s endless.

Making this an issue about one fan being wealthier than another is a dangerous game, and ultimately it ignores the fact that those comparisons can be made about a whole range of other things which are already in place and have been for many years. It also pits one Villa fan against another, and presents this as a brand new thing, when that simply isn’t the case. We are all in the same boat, and have always been in the same boat, in terms of wanting to attend games when we are willing and able to do so, but sometimes demand exceeds supply.

Edited August 1, 2023 by GeordieVillan

[Don_Simon]

Why would it be a dangerous game? 

I think it's quite straightforward that wealthier people will be purchasing Terrace View season tickets. You said yourself in your long post about purchasing your Terrace View season ticket that "everything has fallen in place for me - personally, financially, family etc".

You have been able to jump the queue for potential away tickets, and other benefits, because you are able to afford a Terrace View season ticket, it's just a fact. There's nothing wrong with it from your perspective, but the club may face a backlash. Who knows.

[GeordieVillan]

4 hours ago, Don_Simon said:

Why would it be a dangerous game? 

I think it's quite straightforward that wealthier people will be purchasing Terrace View season tickets. You said yourself in your long post about purchasing your Terrace View season ticket that "everything has fallen in place for me - personally, financially, family etc".

You have been able to jump the queue for potential away tickets, and other benefits, because you are able to afford a Terrace View season ticket, it's just a fact. There's nothing wrong with it from your perspective, but the club may face a backlash. Who knows.

You said above that you are getting annoyed that people are jumping the queue because they are wealthier. You don’t know they are wealthier! You have then highlighted the word “financially” from my post. I have paid for my season ticket on a credit card and will be paying it off in the coming months when I can afford to. Quite honestly though, it’s none of your business whether I can afford it or not, or whether I am “wealthy” or not, it’s my choice. 

1) it isn’t jumping the queue - it’s a new offering with new facilities, it’s not a like for like package so there is no jumping of the any queue.

2) it’s dangerous/pointless because you can make the same comparison about anyone’s financial position if there are other people who are missing out on things they want because they cannot afford.

3) you are making the point that people are jumping the queue because they are wealthier, but wealth isn’t the key issue - most people on this thread have said they wouldn’t take up the Terrace View because they think it’s poor value, not because they can’t afford it. That’s a fair point as it’s someone’s subjective opinion.

4) you are presenting this current situation like it is a new concept - it isn’t. People place a different value on things based on a whole host of factors and that determines their decision to purchase or not. Some people attend more games than others and then get priority for certain things, is that unfair and because of wealth?

5) it’s dangerous because you are critiquing a small section of fans who are doing nothing different to any other fans, the only difference on this situation is that you personally don’t want to do it, and because you aren’t doing it, there are consequences for your own position.

If you can’t see any of the above, then this discussion is as pointless as well!
 

Edited August 2, 2023 by GeordieVillan

[DakotaVilla]

The real issue here is that people are really feeling the pinch in their personal lives and being unable to easily afford increases in a season ticket (where there is such emotional investment over many years) is a visceral example of falling standards in living.

At the same time the club are opening more premium ticketing channels which I imagine for some is reinforcing the “have”/“have not” narrative.

My personal view is that it’s not the clubs job to provide economic respite from the wider issues in society. Look to your elected politicians for that and you can decide whether they are doing a good job or not. The clubs job is to put Emery in the best possible position to win trophies, simple as that. 

Also, regular season ticket holders should note that premium tickets are helping to cap season ticket increases. If there was no additional hospitality etc you can take it as guaranteed that your season ticket will go up by more to help address the shortfall. 

 

[delboy54]

Football is becoming an expensive hobby for me. Next year I shall be retired reaching the ancient age of 66. I live near Newmarket in deepest Suffolk and its a 2 hr drive from home to VP, and then back again....

I love watching the Villa live, and have followed them since the late 1960's, but football is changing, maybe it always was changing (just like the length of a players shorts!), but it is becoming an expensive option for me.

I have to admit to being very disappointed with the situation regarding tickets and what is happening to the Holte End and how Aston Villa FC have been handling it. It doesn't bother me about people "jumping the queue" just because they can afford to, or chose to, its just like choosing to purchasing a business class air fare instead of economy class, good luck to them. I suppose forking out £1500 will mark anyone who pays for the Terrace View as an even crazier Villa Fan 

It just feels that its the price of success, more expensive seats, increasing prices of ST, selling Claret memberships to supporters who will find it harder to get a ticket, trying to entice more "tourists" to get the "Villa experience", etc. All this has, or is being done by the top clubs, we are no different if we want to compete and bring in more money.

But this extra money does it really make that much difference to the income?..... does it really outweigh the argument to pi$$ing off supporters of AVFC ?, 

[GeordieVillan]

5 minutes ago, delboy54 said:

Football is becoming an expensive hobby for me. Next year I shall be retired reaching the ancient age of 66. I live near Newmarket in deepest Suffolk and its a 2 hr drive from home to VP, and then back again....

I love watching the Villa live, and have followed them since the late 1960's, but football is changing, maybe it always was changing (just like the length of a players shorts!), but it is becoming an expensive option for me.

I have to admit to being very disappointed with the situation regarding tickets and what is happening to the Holte End and how Aston Villa FC have been handling it. It doesn't bother me about people "jumping the queue" just because they can afford to, or chose to, its just like choosing to purchasing a business class air fare instead of economy class, good luck to them. I suppose forking out £1500 will mark anyone who pays for the Terrace View as an even crazier Villa Fan 

It just feels that its the price of success, more expensive seats, increasing prices of ST, selling Claret memberships to supporters who will find it harder to get a ticket, trying to entice more "tourists" to get the "Villa experience", etc. All this has, or is being done by the top clubs, we are no different if we want to compete and bring in more money.

But this extra money does it really make that much difference to the income?..... does it really outweigh the argument to pi$$ing off supporters of AVFC ?, 

I think you’ve nailed it here. Terrace View isn’t a landmark change in the direction of travel, but is football generally slowly creeping even further away from where most fans would want it to be…

[delboy54]

GeordieVillan.......you maybe sitting next to me in the first home game as that was always a "spare" i.e. non ST holder seat last year.....I wonder if you will get a different seat every game or will you get the same seat?........still its yet another mystery from AVFC ! 

[Don_Simon]

1 hour ago, GeordieVillan said:

You said above that you are getting annoyed that people are jumping the queue because they are wealthier. You don’t know they are wealthier! You have then highlighted the word “financially” from my post. I have paid for my season ticket on a credit card and will be paying it off in the coming months when I can afford to. Quite honestly though, it’s none of your business whether I can afford it or not, or whether I am “wealthy” or not, it’s my choice. 

1) it isn’t jumping the queue - it’s a new offering with new facilities, it’s not a like for like package so there is no jumping of the any queue.

2) it’s dangerous/pointless because you can make the same comparison about anyone’s financial position if there are other people who are missing out on things they want because they cannot afford.

3) you are making the point that people are jumping the queue because they are wealthier, but wealth isn’t the key issue - most people on this thread have said they wouldn’t take up the Terrace View because they think it’s poor value, not because they can’t afford it. That’s a fair point as it’s someone’s subjective opinion.

4) you are presenting this current situation like it is a new concept - it isn’t. People place a different value on things based on a whole host of factors and that determines their decision to purchase or not. Some people attend more games than others and then get priority for certain things, is that unfair and because of wealth?

5) it’s dangerous because you are critiquing a small section of fans who are doing nothing different to any other fans, the only difference on this situation is that you personally don’t want to do it, and because you aren’t doing it, there are consequences for your own position.

If you can’t see any of the above, then this discussion is as pointless as well!
 

It's absolutely none of my business, or anyone else's, your financial situation. You brought it up in your post though, thus bringing it into the discussion.

The other points:

1. If I'd wanted to get in on the away games and done what the club asked for me years in accruing other tickets etc, to then potentially lose that right because someone has instantly got a ticket by buying this package, or course that is jumping the queue. 

2. Pointless I'd agree with, not sure how it can be pointless and dangerous, let's ignore that one.

3. If people on the thread had levels of disposable income where buying this had no impact on doing the other things they love, their quality of life in other areas, could still sit with their mates / family, etc, I'd hazard a guess they'd do this.

4. Paying £82 to watch Villa play is a new concept. It has brought with it other benefits which it has to to make it valuable on the market, such as access to Upper Holte and away tickets.

5. The danger thing again - the perception of this new Villa venture has not been well managed nor well communicated. I however don't forsee you guys in the terrace being in any physical or metaphorical danger from the Villa masses, it's a safe space I'm sure.

Let's leave this now until the club communicate better the plans moving forward.

Have a wicked season at VP mate, it's a wonderful place to be, (most of the time!)

UTV.

[TRO]

16 hours ago, Don_Simon said:

I feel like a lunatic with this whole thing, but even this is annoying me. Season Ticket Holder by jumping the queue because they're much wealthier than the others. 

I think that is a false and convenient narrative....its a different market, the club are selling these seats to.

The world we live in is Supply and demand....and we can't have our cake and eat it.

To all the Folk, who would love a season ticket, but can't afford one ( even if they was available) is not your fault, or our fault for being able to afford one....on that point it could be argued, no season tickets for sale, first come first served basis.....what then?

I have been in the corporate, and its nice, but I can't afford it, but it would be wrong to deny those that can.

I am not privvy to all the detail surrounding this new facility, which some issues could be controversial.....but I think in principle its wrong to deny the club an opportunity to raise more revenue, (when they are shopping in a more expensive market) and wrong to deny the affluent an opportunity to spend their cash, in OUR club.

 

 

Edited August 2, 2023 by TRO

[DakotaVilla]

33 minutes ago, TRO said:

I think that is a false and convenient narrative....its a different market, the club are selling these seats to.

The world we live in is Supply and demand....and we can't have our cake and eat it.

To all the Folk, who would love a season ticket, but can't afford one ( even if they was available) is not our fault, or their fault....on that point it could be argued, no season tickets for sale, first come first served basis.....what then?

I have been in the corporate, and its nice, but I can't afford it, but it would be wrong to deny those that can.

I am not privvy to all the detail surrounding this new facility, which some could be controversial.....but I think in principle its wrong to deny the club an opportunity to raise more revenue, (when they are shopping in a more expensive market) and wrong to deny the affluent an opportunity to spend their cash, in OUR club.

 

 

It’s especially wrong when the owners have already shown that every single penny will be spent on more investment in the club. 

[MrBlack]

42 minutes ago, TRO said:

I think that is a false and convenient narrative....its a different market, the club are selling these seats to.

The world we live in is Supply and demand....and we can't have our cake and eat it.

To all the Folk, who would love a season ticket, but can't afford one ( even if they was available) is not our fault, or their fault....on that point it could be argued, no season tickets for sale, first come first served basis.....what then?

I have been in the corporate, and its nice, but I can't afford it, but it would be wrong to deny those that can.

I am not privvy to all the detail surrounding this new facility, which some could be controversial.....but I think in principle its wrong to deny the club an opportunity to raise more revenue, (when they are shopping in a more expensive market) and wrong to deny the affluent an opportunity to spend their cash, in OUR club.

 

 

I agree with the sentiment that this is being marketed as a new corporate/ hospitality type offering and hence you can't say the people taking it up are jumping the queue.

But you can definitely lay some blame and anger at the club's doors for how it's been handled.

They interviewed season ticket holders for their opinions and used them to justify putting the service in.  To then deliver a service that clearly was never targeted at them is underhand and I don't like it.  Not to mention that the season ticket holders are complaining about the existing service, and will now find that they're actually worse off with less room than they had before, and will be paying over inflation increases for the privilege.

The club should have been more honest about what they were doing 

Edited August 2, 2023 by MrBlack

[cheltenham_villa]

3 minutes ago, MrBlack said:

I agree with the sentiment that this is being marketed as a new corporate/ hospitality type offering and hence you can't say the people taking it up are jumping the queue.

But you can definitely lay some blame and anger at the club's doors for how it's been handled.

They interviewed season ticket holders for their opinions and used them to justify putting the service in.  To then deliver a service that clearly was never targeted at them is underhand and I don't like it.  Not to mention that the season ticket holders are complaining about the existing service, and will now find that they're actually worse off with less room than they had before, and will be paying over inflation increases for the privilege.

The club should have been more honest about what they were doing 

i dont think i agree that it was underhand.

The club is asking questions to try and determine where a demand may exist to increase revenue, it wasnt about getting permission, they dont need that. It was clear to me that they were targeting some form of hospitality linked ticket and lots of people had an interest. That tells the club that the demand maybe there. 

Your issue is with the price and the fact that these seats have now been offered to non STs, that wasnt explicit but why would it need to be? . I dont agree by with the costs, i dont agree with the price increases to STs but they are not surprises to me. I dont see the club coming out and saying that  prices will be held, in my opinion they are consistent in showing that they need to generate more funds and some of that will mean that fans are paying more.

 

[OutByEaster?]

3 hours ago, GeordieVillan said:

1) it isn’t jumping the queue - it’s a new offering with new facilities.

Just a note on this; it's not. It's a new offering with existing facilities - there are no new seats in the Holte End being created.

I think amongst all of the stuff about people pointing fingers, there are some potentially serious issues with the experience for those people who are buying Terrace View offers which I think are a concern.

The allocation of tickets - depending on just how many season ticket holders there already are in the Upper Holte, and how they're distributed, the allocation of placements to people who are paying a pretty hefty sum to be in the Terrace View might be quite disappointing - it's a lot of money to pay to sit in the back corners of the Holte End. I'm not sure how clear the club are being with Terrace view buyers on where exactly they're going to be able to sit.

This thing about away tickets; there's a definite question about whether the club are going to take a substantial amount of tickets away from those that have spent years building a history, or whether their salespeople are lying to Terrace View customers about what is available and the merits of purchasing in a desperate attempt to sell Terrace View season tickets. If Terrace View season ticket holders are being asked to pay out a substantial sum on the idea that Away tickets will be available and it turns out that's two pairs to every away match, they're being mis-sold an offer.

Terrace View season ticket holder status - if people are being plucked from the season ticket waiting list when they take up this offer, but aren't being then considered as 'normal' season ticket holders, then that, for me at least, is unfair - if the club decide to sell this area differently next season and don't allow people to renew, they're left high and dry, if you're off the list, you can't relocate and you can't renew, then Terrace View ticket holders have paid an awful lot of money and sacrificed something in order to buy nineteen individual match tickets.