Popular Post og1874 Posted April 13, 2022 Popular Post Share Posted April 13, 2022 7 hours ago, paul514 said: Yes, some people however say he has never played well in the really big games. That’s fine, we don’t have any of those 9 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sulberto21 Posted April 13, 2022 Share Posted April 13, 2022 15 hours ago, UpTheVilla26 said: Won't happen, but up top, I'd be asking Torino to name their price for Belotti. Does he not have a release clause? When we were linked with him it was around £63m but this might be lower now? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
duke313 Posted April 13, 2022 Share Posted April 13, 2022 Just now, Sulberto21 said: Does he not have a release clause? When we were linked with him it was around £63m but this might be lower now? He's out of contract in summer, Torino won't get a penny wherever he goes. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JAMAICAN-VILLAN Posted April 13, 2022 Share Posted April 13, 2022 1 minute ago, Sulberto21 said: Does he not have a release clause? When we were linked with him it was around £63m but this might be lower now? Over the past few pages, they've said he's actually out of contract in the summer. So, free. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HalfTimePost Posted April 13, 2022 Share Posted April 13, 2022 3 hours ago, CVByrne said: Also in the 4 3 2 1 formation. The top of that formation requires a lethal poacher / finisher. With excellent movement and footballing brain. It doesn't require lung busting high pressing workrate like say Watkins in 4 2 3 1 and nowhere near the ultra ultra pressing Atletico do. Suarez fits the system better than any player we can sign this summer. Not sure I agree here, More of a poacher may well suit most teams that played 4231 in the way it was popular 10 years ago, when Mata, Oscar, Gotze, Ozil etc were the prototype #10s of the time and the likes of Bayern, Dortmund and the German National team in particular really drove adoption of it as the favoured formation of the time. But it doesn't take into account style of play, if we want the attacking fullbacks Gerrard seems keen for (and to be fair, the fans were keen for with the slating Targett and Cash got throughout the season). If we want them bombing forwards, the forward line needs to be pressing, regardless of formation. Nor do we play 4231 with that strong double pivot allowing a #10 to create alongside wide forwards with more freedom anyway. We pay 4321. And as our wide forwards are actually Narrow 10s, the striker needs to be working very hard and have a burst of pace to get on the end of the through balls from Buendia, Coutinho etc. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
duke313 Posted April 13, 2022 Share Posted April 13, 2022 1 minute ago, HalfTimePost said: Not sure I agree here, More of a poacher may well suit most teams that played 4231 in the way it was popular 10 years ago, when Mata, Oscar, Gotze, Ozil etc were the prototype #10s of the time and the likes of Bayern, Dortmund and the German National team in particular really drove adoption of it as the favoured formation of the time. But it doesn't take into account style of play, if we want the attacking fullbacks Gerrard seems keen for (and to be fair, the fans were keen for with the slating Targett and Cash got throughout the season). If we want them bombing forwards, the forward line needs to be pressing, regardless of formation. Nor do we play 4231 with that strong double pivot allowing a #10 to create alongside wide forwards with more freedom anyway. We pay 4321. And as our wide forwards are actually Narrow 10s, the striker needs to be working very hard and have a burst of pace to get on the end of the through balls from Buendia, Coutinho etc. Seems like it would be well suited to Bailey. -------------------Luiz---------------------- McGinn----------------------Ramsey ----Buendia---------Coutinho------- -----------------Bailey--------------------- Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paul514 Posted April 13, 2022 Share Posted April 13, 2022 4 hours ago, CVByrne said: He has 0.6 goals per 90 or above, every season for the last 10 seasons (the current one included). I don't get why people think his legs and lungs are gone. That Atletico are going with the younger players to build for the future is understandable as Suarez isn't staying at the club next season. For a season long contract he would to a brilliant job for us in a World Cup year. Off the bench or playing 65min in a FIVE sub season. He is on a different level of good to the players we have fluffing their chances week in week out up front for us. Archer training with him, playing with him. People focus on the negative with Suarez and not the elite player with an insane amount of experience. If we could get Suarez and Wijnaldum in, with Gomez. People will complain oh look Gerrard is just getting ex Liverpool players in. They ignore the fact they are all Champions League and Domestic League winners. Winners. Vastly experienced and have worked in environments where the expectations are sky high. Look at our squad of inconsistent mid table bang average players. How can people be against adding such experience. As far as I can see we agree on many things but as a combination…… if I in charge I’m not signing Suarez on a free with massive wages, buying Wijnaldum from PSG, and then giving him massive wages to run my midfield when he is 32 this year. Finally signing Gomez who has hardly played for years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CVByrne Posted April 13, 2022 Share Posted April 13, 2022 7 minutes ago, paul514 said: As far as I can see we agree on many things but as a combination…… if I in charge I’m not signing Suarez on a free with massive wages, buying Wijnaldum from PSG, and then giving him massive wages to run my midfield when he is 32 this year. Finally signing Gomez who has hardly played for years. Why are people so obsessed with wages? Ings costs us 300k per week fee + wages. If we sign Coutinho it'll be 400k per week cost per week If we get Suarez on a free and pay him 200k per week or whatever. He is incredibly value for money. Wijnaldum is on reportedly 300k per week at PSG. He knows to play regular football he needs to take a pay cut and PSG probably want minimal fee if any to get him off the books. So if we get him on a free for 160k per week for example. That's again incredible business. Too many people have something against older players, always throwing their wages at them too. When they actually cost the club less overall than players signed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CVByrne Posted April 13, 2022 Share Posted April 13, 2022 (edited) If we got Bissouma and Wijnaldum and sold Luiz and Sanson our midfield would be top 6 level for next three years We need to stop thinking we are in property trading. Sign young players and improve them so they have sell on value. We have an academy for new talent. We don't need to be signing another Bailey or Luiz or whoever to improve them as they get older and more experience. We need experience, now today. Premier League experience. Winning experience. Edited April 13, 2022 by CVByrne 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
duke313 Posted April 13, 2022 Share Posted April 13, 2022 17 minutes ago, CVByrne said: If we got Bissouma and Wijnaldum and sold Luiz and Sanson our midfield would be top 6 level for next three years We need to stop thinking we are in property trading. Sign young players and improve them so they have sell on value. We have an academy for new talent. We don't need to be signing another Bailey or Luiz or whoever to improve them as they get older and more experience. We need experience, now today. Premier League experience. Winning experience. That's a selling club mentality, we'll never break top 6 with that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zatman Posted April 13, 2022 Share Posted April 13, 2022 (edited) 28 minutes ago, duke313 said: That's a selling club mentality, we'll never break top 6 with that. Except thats how Liverpool have built the recent success and Spurs under Poch Edited April 13, 2022 by Zatman Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
duke313 Posted April 13, 2022 Share Posted April 13, 2022 1 minute ago, Zatman said: Except thats how Liverpool have built the recent success and Spurs under Poch Selling a player because they get a mega offer from two of the most prestigious teams in football is not the same as buying a player to make him better with the intention of selling him as soon as a bigger club comes in for him. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paul514 Posted April 13, 2022 Share Posted April 13, 2022 58 minutes ago, CVByrne said: Why are people so obsessed with wages? Ings costs us 300k per week fee + wages. If we sign Coutinho it'll be 400k per week cost per week If we get Suarez on a free and pay him 200k per week or whatever. He is incredibly value for money. Wijnaldum is on reportedly 300k per week at PSG. He knows to play regular football he needs to take a pay cut and PSG probably want minimal fee if any to get him off the books. So if we get him on a free for 160k per week for example. That's again incredible business. Too many people have something against older players, always throwing their wages at them too. When they actually cost the club less overall than players signed. They have no sell on value and don't offer the possibility of a long term solution.... There are also league rules on wage bills Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paul514 Posted April 13, 2022 Share Posted April 13, 2022 (edited) 59 minutes ago, CVByrne said: If we got Bissouma and Wijnaldum and sold Luiz and Sanson our midfield would be top 6 level for next three years We need to stop thinking we are in property trading. Sign young players and improve them so they have sell on value. We have an academy for new talent. We don't need to be signing another Bailey or Luiz or whoever to improve them as they get older and more experience. We need experience, now today. Premier League experience. Winning experience. Who is the DCM there? It is neither of those two. If you aren't getting the fees for your players then how are buying new ones without NSWE dipping into their pockets in perpetuity Edited April 13, 2022 by paul514 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zatman Posted April 13, 2022 Share Posted April 13, 2022 7 minutes ago, duke313 said: Selling a player because they get a mega offer from two of the most prestigious teams in football is not the same as buying a player to make him better with the intention of selling him as soon as a bigger club comes in for him. But thats not what the actual idea of buying young and developing, the sell on value is just if a player fails though. Liverpool signed Mane at 24, the idea was that even if he didnt succeed they would still get money back in a couple of seasons if he didnt fit in 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
duke313 Posted April 13, 2022 Share Posted April 13, 2022 5 minutes ago, Zatman said: But thats not what the actual idea of buying young and developing, the sell on value is just if a player fails though. Liverpool signed Mane at 24, the idea was that even if he didnt succeed they would still get money back in a couple of seasons if he didnt fit in Mane is one example, sure. But that isn't the case for every transfer. Using Liverpool as an example, the signed an injury prone 29 year old Thiago, not much sell on potential as you say, but sometimes you have to take the risk. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Laughable Chimp Posted April 13, 2022 Share Posted April 13, 2022 Suarez is an interesting one. I think he's probably still good enough to do alright with us. Could tide us over for next season if we decide to focus on other improving other positions first. But I'd rather just get a proper, long-term striker in the summer. I've lost faith in Watkins or Ings coming good. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Delphinho123 Posted April 13, 2022 Share Posted April 13, 2022 I do still think JWP would be a good option if it wasn’t for silly money. For 35/40m, I think he’d be a very shrewd buy and someone to sit alongside a more defensive midfielder in the double pivot. He’s also worth 5-10 assists/goals a season with his set pieces. We could do a lot worse than him and Bissouma as our 2 in front of the back 4 next season. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CVByrne Posted April 13, 2022 Share Posted April 13, 2022 31 minutes ago, paul514 said: They have no sell on value and don't offer the possibility of a long term solution.... There are also league rules on wage bills They make an immediate impact and improve younger players. Not everything is about developing players to create sell on value. Rules on wage bills are all part of the same rules that govern allowable losses. So transfer fees are part of that. We don't need more players who will adapt to the league, adapt to the style and system. We need senior players who have years of Premier League experience. They drive standards when we get the players who have played at the top and won. We need the mix of players on squad. We lack senior players and it's abundantly evident. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nick76 Posted April 13, 2022 Share Posted April 13, 2022 7 minutes ago, Laughable Chimp said: Suarez is an interesting one. I think he's probably still good enough to do alright with us. Could tide us over for next season if we decide to focus on other improving other positions first. But I'd rather just get a proper, long-term striker in the summer. I've lost faith in Watkins or Ings coming good. Might be best to get Suarez for a season because there seems to a fair few teams looking for a striker this closed season and while we are all shopping at different levels, as the top ones are taken the teams that miss out will move closer to our level of strikers. With the likes of Man City, Man U, Arsenal, Chelsea depending on what they do with Lukaku, West Ham, Brighton, Newcastle all looking at strikers (maybe more teams), supply of strikers my be limited and expensive whereas next closed season the market maybe less congested plus we get to see how Archer develops. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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