Genie Posted August 14, 2022 Author Share Posted August 14, 2022 (edited) If they freeze the cap at the current level what is the outcome? Consumers mainly won’t freeze to death or run out of money. The government won’t need to aggressively intervene with handouts. Suppliers make a profit Producers will make £6-9b profit per quarter. The question should be, Why put the cap up higher? Edited August 14, 2022 by Genie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
foreveryoung Posted August 14, 2022 Share Posted August 14, 2022 Ofgem are not fit for purpose. It was there fault there was no regulation on new energy suppliers starting up and now have all gone bust, leaving quite a few people out of pocket. They have now probably found out increasing the energy cap and looking after the BP's and Shell's of the world increases there yearly profits. They are there to look after the consumer, increasing the cap every quarter, is looking after the energy companies not us! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rjw63 Posted August 14, 2022 Share Posted August 14, 2022 3 hours ago, Genie said: If they freeze the cap at the current level what is the outcome? Consumers mainly won’t freeze to death or run out of money. The government won’t need to aggressively intervene with handouts. Suppliers make a profit Producers will make £6-9b profit per quarter. The question should be, Why put the cap up higher? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Genie Posted August 14, 2022 Author Share Posted August 14, 2022 This is fine isn’t it, cost of living crisis. It’s basically diverting the worlds wealth into the hands of a handful of businesses. Quote Saudi oil giant Aramco has broken its own record with a $48.4bn (£39.8bn) profit for the second quarter of 2022. It is a 90% year-on-year increase and marks the biggest earnings for the world's largest energy exporter since its public listing three years ago. Russia's invasion of Ukraine has seen oil and gas prices skyrocket. Russia is one of the world's biggest exporters but Western nations have pledged to curb their dependence on the country for their energy needs. According to Bloomberg, the Saudi oil giant's figure represents "the biggest quarterly adjusted profit of any listed company". As well as the record profits, the state-owned Saudi energy giant announced it would keep its dividend unchanged at $18.8bn for the third quarter. https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-62539480 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cheltenham_villa Posted August 14, 2022 Share Posted August 14, 2022 On 12/08/2022 at 16:20, foreveryoung said: Just receieved the same Email. Thought they asking me to increase direct debit. But says, I don't need to do anything on my £125 a month direct debit for gas and electric, I am 45 quid in credit and on my fixed till feb 23, so may miss out on all the hikes, which is mega! Not sure who else took a fixed when everyone was telling us not too, but we proper hit the jackpot there! Hate to be the bearer of bad news, but you will only miss out on the hikes until Feb 23. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
foreveryoung Posted August 15, 2022 Share Posted August 15, 2022 9 hours ago, cheltenham_villa said: Hate to be the bearer of bad news, but you will only miss out on the hikes until Feb 23. Yeah for some reason, I was thinking 2023 was 2 years away. Still, I'll miss the winter rise. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trekka Posted August 17, 2022 VT Supporter Share Posted August 17, 2022 (edited) It seems one of the directors of Ofgem has resigned (breaking news live on Sky now). EDIT: Quote A director at energy regulator Ofgem has resigned, accusing it of favouring businesses over consumers with a rule change that will add as much as £400 to the average UK household energy bill. The Guardian Edited August 17, 2022 by trekka Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
foreveryoung Posted August 17, 2022 Share Posted August 17, 2022 3 minutes ago, trekka said: It seems one of the directors at Ofgem has resigned (breaking news live on Sky now). EDIT: The Guardian Be interesting to see how much their profits have increased recently. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Genie Posted August 17, 2022 Author Share Posted August 17, 2022 Whatever formula they use to calculate the cap, it’s broken. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
foreveryoung Posted August 17, 2022 Share Posted August 17, 2022 1 minute ago, Genie said: Whatever formula they use to calculate the cap, it’s broken. I just don't know how they can call it a cap, when it's being adjusted for the Energy companies benefit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sidcow Posted August 17, 2022 VT Supporter Share Posted August 17, 2022 34 minutes ago, foreveryoung said: I just don't know how they can call it a cap, when it's being adjusted for the Energy companies benefit. It's a cap because it's lower than the open market price. Doesn't matter who's benefit it's for. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
foreveryoung Posted August 17, 2022 Share Posted August 17, 2022 57 minutes ago, sidcow said: It's a cap because it's lower than the open market price. Doesn't matter who's benefit it's for. Until next quarter an the quarter after that. An it does matter who's benefit it is for when it's not for the consumer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Genie Posted August 17, 2022 Author Share Posted August 17, 2022 1 hour ago, Genie said: Whatever formula they use to calculate the cap, it’s broken. Actually thinking about it, it’s not the cap formula that’s broken, it’s the wholesale price that is killing it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sidcow Posted August 17, 2022 VT Supporter Share Posted August 17, 2022 5 minutes ago, foreveryoung said: Until next quarter an the quarter after that. An it does matter who's benefit it is for when it's not for the consumer. I don't understand your point. If the market price moves next quarter or the quarter after that then the cap moves too. You can say its too high so as to benefit the supplier or it's too low to the benefit of the consumer, but as long as it's below the market price then it's a cap. A cap is a cap is a cap. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
turvontour Posted August 17, 2022 Share Posted August 17, 2022 Interesting that the live market for the next year is now 500. All of the projections of the cap going to £4k per year are based on 300 units. So unless theres some sort of interruption to all this we'll be looking at close to £7k per year from mid next year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Genie Posted August 17, 2022 Author Share Posted August 17, 2022 7 minutes ago, turvontour said: Interesting that the live market for the next year is now 500. All of the projections of the cap going to £4k per year are based on 300 units. So unless theres some sort of interruption to all this we'll be looking at close to £7k per year from mid next year. If the government felt that £1500 was the maximum affordable (by giving out £400 towards a £1900 average bill) then what will they do for £5,000 or £6,000 or £7,000 bills? Are they going to give the general public hundreds of billions of pounds of public money only for it to land on the profit line of BP, Shell and co? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
turvontour Posted August 17, 2022 Share Posted August 17, 2022 2 minutes ago, Genie said: If the government felt that £1500 was the maximum affordable (by giving out £400 towards a £1900 average bill) then what will they do for £5,000 or £6,000 or £7,000 bills? Are they going to give the general public hundreds of billions of pounds of public money only for it to land on the profit line of BP, Shell and co? I mean the cap runs at a lag average to the live market, so surely the live market at current levels isnt sustainable. I suppose it doesnt/cant exist at £7k, demand destruction is deep, and quickly undermines the excessive price. Forward live price will be based on current projection of supply v demand for forward period. It wouldnt take into account a reasonably sudden 35% reduction say in demand whether domestic usage, industrial etc. We saw a really quick snapshot of this with Covid. Fuels markets halved in price because you suddenly shut down 15% of fuel need with factories closing, leaving excess supply. But the flip side you've never had one guy controlling the destiny of a continents gas flow. Its 20% of norms coming through the key pipe to Germany. Will it be zero come winter or back up to 40%, we cant know and hence the heavy prices. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
foreveryoung Posted August 17, 2022 Share Posted August 17, 2022 All I know is we must be being screwed somewhere, if the BP's, Shell's are showing record profits. Even the providers are making record profits too. They should pause the green levy for a start. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Genie Posted August 17, 2022 Author Share Posted August 17, 2022 Just now, foreveryoung said: All I know is we must be being screwed somewhere, if the BP's, Shell's are showing record profits. Even the providers are making record profits too. They should pause the green levy for a start. and VAT. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Davkaus Posted August 17, 2022 Share Posted August 17, 2022 7 minutes ago, foreveryoung said: All I know is we must be being screwed somewhere, if the BP's, Shell's are showing record profits. Even the providers are making record profits too. They should pause the green levy for a start. By providers do you mean UK energy suppliers? Which ones are making record profits? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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