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The Next Club Crest/Badge


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7 hours ago, robby b said:

I guess I like the simplicity of our badge compared to some other teams. Maybe a little bit of outline for the lion might look better, to make it stand out more.

I've noticed that we have the joint strongest animal out of all the animal badge premier league teams, along with Chelsea and Burnley, but they're both blue so we're the real lions so we win! Strongest Premier League animals table:

  1.  Lions  (us)     
  2.  Blue lions  (Chelsea)
  3. Smaller blue lions (Burnley)
  4.  Mooses  (Watford)
  5.  Wolves  (Wolverhampton Wanderers)
  6.  Foxes  (Leicester)
  7.  Seagulls  (Brighton and Hove Albion)
  8. Cockerels  (Tottenham Hotspur)
  9.  Red cormorants  (Liverpool)
  10. Canaries  (Norwich)   

 

 

A moose would smash a lion to pieces in a fair fight, it's about three times the size and outweighs it by about 1000lbs.  Luckily for us the creature on a Watford badge is a male red fallow deer, also known as a hart.  Because Watford is in Hertfordshire.  When it eventually gets incorporated into London (which is surely only a matter of time) then they might change the badge to a hornet which is probably an upgrade.  

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1 hour ago, The_Rev said:

 

A moose would smash a lion to pieces in a fair fight, it's about three times the size and outweighs it by about 1000lbs.  Luckily for us the creature on a Watford badge is a male red fallow deer, also known as a hart.  Because Watford is in Hertfordshire.  When it eventually gets incorporated into London (which is surely only a matter of time) then they might change the badge to a hornet which is probably an upgrade.  

Not sure what you mean by a fair fight, and this is largely unimportant (especially as they hunt in packs), but a grown Lion would easily take down a moose. I've seen my share of them, and while they are big, they are still a moose. Lions take down animals about the same size of a moose all the time, it's a part of their normal non-hipster diet. 

 

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47 minutes ago, KenjiOgiwara said:

Not sure what you mean by a fair fight, and this is largely unimportant (especially as they hunt in packs), but a grown Lion would easily take down a moose. I've seen my share of them, and while they are big, they are still a moose. Lions take down animals about the same size of a moose all the time, it's a part of their normal non-hipster diet. 

 

Reckon we can get a kickstarter or something going to fund a Lion vs Moose fight to the death? Maybe Netflix would pick it up, failing that it would do gangbusters on YouTube.  

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9 hours ago, useless said:

People underestimate Moose (Alces alces), they're massive and can be very dangerous, but they'd be very vulnerable to the mighty predatory prowess of a lion (Panthera leo), indeed Moose are often killed and eaten by Mountain Lions (Puma concolor).

Ambush predators though, right? I'm thinking a square go. Flat terrain, start in opposite corners. 

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http://askanaturalist.com/who-would-win-lion-or-moose/

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The Short Answer: You are both right.

 

Quote

For many years, my son and I have had a running argument as to who would win in a battle: a Tyrannosaurus rex or Spiderman. I contend that a T-rex would simply crunch Spiderman with its nine inch teeth. My son clings to the preposterous claim that Spiderman would run around T-rex, wrapping up the dinosaur’s legs with spidey-silk, causing the T-rex to fall clumsily forward onto its face. And T-rex, with its tiny, useless arms, would be unable to catch itself as it fell. That sounds plausible … except that T-rex would simply chomp Spiderman before he could run around with his spidey-silk!

But I digress …

Your question is similar, in that we aren’t ever likely to get any definitive evidence.  Lions (Panthera leo) and moose (Alces alces) don’t overlap in range, since lions live in Africa and some parts of southern Asia, and moose live in the northern half of North America, and northern regions of Europe and Asia.  (If only we could talk to some prehistoric Europeans or North Americans, we might get an answer, since there were African lions in Europe up until about 2,000 years ago and North America had its own similar species until about 13,000 years ago.)

On the other hand, however, your question is much more answerable than T-rex versus Spiderman in that we do know something about what kinds of animals lions can and do kill, and we do know something about the kind of prey lions choose.

Because they’re big, charismatic, and symbolic, as well as being an apex predator, lions have received quite a bit research attention over the years. By following lions around and recording exactly who they chase and who they kill, we know that lions truly are “The King of Beasts.” A tiger (Panthera tigris) may be the single largest and most dangerous predator on land, but a pride of lions can kill anything, and even solitary lions can bring down most of the large game in their habitats. Despite the often repeated claim that only female lions hunt, both sexes hunt in groups and individually.

A moose is certainly a large animal, with males weighing 380–720 kg (850–1580 pounds) and females weighing 270–360 kg (600–800 pounds). Lions will hunt anything from a rabbit to an elephant, but they prefer larger animals. Theory suggests there should be an optimal size prey where the extra energy expended and the extra danger risked in hunting a larger animal is balanced by the larger prize of more meat. And this seems to be the case. When given the choice, lions don’t necessarily go for the most common prey, and can often be seen walking right past smaller animals that seem like easy pickings. Instead, they often target prey that are about 250 kg (550 pounds). A female moose is very close to that sweet spot.

Lions also prefer slower prey over faster. Like most big cats, lions are capable of very fast spurts of speed for a short distance, but speedier prey like impala and zebra can often simply outrun a lion. Slower animals such as African buffalo are less likely to outrun a lion and therefore will turn and fight, using horns and hoofs.

Given the fact that a female moose is not particularly fleet, and does not sport the impressive antlers that male moose do, I think it’s pretty reasonable to assume that if lions lived where moose do, female moose and moose calves would be on the menu regularly.

But I suspect your argument is really about a battle between a solitary lion and a male, antlered moose. However, even then, I don’t think there’s much question that a solitary lion could kill a full-grown bull moose. When I asked Matt Hayward, Regional Ecologist for the Australian Wildlife Conservancy, who has studied lion predatory behavior extensively in Africa, for his opinion, here’s what he said, “Lion would love moose. The antlers of moose would pose little risk to lions given they are not always present, often covered in velvet and not overly sharp.  Individual lions regularly kill buffalo and giraffe that are as large or larger than even a male moose.  A moose would be a snack.”

One final piece of evidence is that the mountain lion (Puma concolor), which overlaps the range of moose in North America, regularly kills moose. The animals killed are almost entirely calves and juveniles, but adult male mountain lions do occasionally kill adult moose. If a mountain lion, which is a solitary hunter and is about one third the size of an African lion, can kill an adult moose, it certainly seems likely that a solitary African lion could also do so.

Everything I’ve said so far suggests that you should win the argument. But … and this is a large but … here’s where the scale tips back in favor of your friend. Even as one of the world’s most ferocious predators, lions are most often failures. All predators fail on most of their hunts, and Dr. Hayward points out that lions are particularly unsuccessful. “Lions are notoriously hopeless hunters and only catch prey in 1 out of 10 hunts on average.” Of course you don’t want to be the unlucky #10, but the truth is that most of the time, lion prey outrun the lion, or fight off the attack or otherwise end up shaking but alive at the end. And there’s little reason to assume the same wouldn’t be true of moose.

So chances are that in most encounters between a moose and a lion, the moose would walk away at the end and the lion would sulk hungrily, plotting its next nine attacks. That’s why my short answer was “You’re both right.”

And now I’ve probably given you both more ammunition. Have fun.

Image result for hercules the lion aston villa cartoon

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19 hours ago, robby b said:

I've noticed that we have the joint strongest animal out of all the animal badge premier league teams, along with Chelsea and Burnley, but they're both blue so we're the real lions so we win! Strongest Premier League animals table:

  1.  Lions  (us)     
  2.  Blue lions  (Chelsea)
  3. Smaller blue lions (Burnley)
  4.  Mooses  (Watford)
  5.  Wolves  (Wolverhampton Wanderers)
  6.  Foxes  (Leicester)
  7.  Seagulls  (Brighton and Hove Albion)
  8. Cockerels  (Tottenham Hotspur)
  9.  Red cormorants  (Liverpool)
  10. Canaries  (Norwich)   

 

I reckon Crystal Palace and their Eagle would be top 6, definitely beating all the other avian badge critters and the fox, too.

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11 hours ago, GarethRDR said:

I come to VT for the Villa gossip, I stay for the hypothetical moose vs. lion debates.

Good job Coventry aren't in the premier league otherwise they would crush everyone.

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1 hour ago, blandy said:

I reckon Crystal Palace and their Eagle would be top 6, definitely beating all the other avian badge critters and the fox, too.

Oops, I totally forgot to put Palace in the list! Yes, I guess you're right, they must be in the top six.

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Game of Badges...

 

House Arsenal - cannons, good start with an actual weapon but slow to load, inaccurate and unreliable.

House Aston Villa - A lion, pretty much king of the mammals. Claws sometimes sharp, have also been quite blunt over the years...

House Bournemouth - A human being. Pretty deadly all things considered. Monumentally stupid based on Trump and Brexit however.

House Brighton - Scavenging seagull. Useless in a fight unless it's for chips.

House Burnley - Another lion, this time flanked by killer bees and a pointless stork.

House Chelsea - Lion number three in the list. But dead. Or just very, very cold.

House Crystal Palace - An eagle, pretty deadly. Easily trained to land on a glove.

House Everton - No animals, no weapons. Just a tower. Try defending that forever...

House Leicester - A fox, clever, cunning and often found around bins.

House Liverpool - An imaginary bird. Offers nothing.

House Man City - A boat. Might be backed up by an armada. Pretty useless on land.

House Man Utd - A devil. Might attack through ideological fear rather than actual weaponary.

House Newcastle - Seahorses. Yes, really. Magpies are pretty harmless already but Seahorses?! Dead before battles begin.

House Norwich - A canary will help you in a mine...but pretty pointless on the battlefield.

House Sheffield - Actual weapons are back. Close combat with swords might be effective.

House Southampton. A tree...err. Could be an ent?! Simply not in the fight.

House Tottenham - A cockerel will get them up nice and early for the battle but they'll be torn to shreds in minutes.

House Watford - A deer is pretty big and strong, possibly an issue for anyone with an army using cars.

House West Ham - A pair of hammers. Not even bringing a knife to a gun fight. Waste of time.

House Wolves - A wolf will work well in a pack, pretty effective in most fairytales but normally dead by the end.

 

So who wins?

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On 19/10/2019 at 11:25, nepal_villan said:

Like the claret lion as it contrasts with the light blue. I'd get rid of the star. The club has much more history than a European Cup trophy. The top clubs don't put stars on their crests. It's only the ones that feel a need to validate themselves.

I disagree, I think it’s a nice touch to put a star above your crest to commemorate a World Cup or Champions League title. Those are considered the pinnacles of international and club football, respectively. What I don’t like is MLS teams using stars to represent MLS Cup wins, that feels small time to me.

Does the PL allow stars above badges? I thought I heard somewhere that they don’t, but I may be wrong.

In regards to Villa, I’ve always thought that we should remove the star in our badge, it looks out of place. We don’t need a star above the badge for domestic competitions, but put one up above when we play in Europe.

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  • 4 months later...

Any chance we can get a petition going to try and get a new badge? I wore my retro 1980 away shirt to Wembley and before I left I held it next to this season's kit and actually took a moment and looked at the two badges side by side. The retro one is a million times better. Just actually look at our current one. There's barely any claret in it. Anyone would think by looking at the badge we play in yellow and blue. I love the round design and the claret lion with gold letters on the retro. It's a thing of beauty. I really think we should try and get a petition going and get it changed to something like the one on the left. Who's with me?

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I will say it for the millionth time; A circular Villa badge is not our traditional badge! It has been used by far the shortest time versus the shield we now have and no outline at all.

People like the circular badge largely because either a.) they remember that fondly from their youth/our grestest success or b.) because it plays in to the whole retro styling fad at the moment.

In another generations time, people will be wanting the 'Prepared' scroll back. If anything, the circle badge is the less traditional than our current one.

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Since this has been bumped.

I like the newest lion (With paws) but still hate the badge.

It tends to look terrible in social media and print as well.

I'd even like to see how it would look with the colours inverted.

Gold lion surrounded in claret for great contrast.

Then gold piping, and find a way to classily integrate the blue.

I genuinely don't know how much these "design experts" got paid for this but there are so many basics wrong it's astonishing IMO.

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2 hours ago, jackbauer24 said:

I will say it for the millionth time; A circular Villa badge is not our traditional badge! It has been used by far the shortest time versus the shield we now have and no outline at all.

People like the circular badge largely because either a.) they remember that fondly from their youth/our grestest success or b.) because it plays in to the whole retro styling fad at the moment.

In another generations time, people will be wanting the 'Prepared' scroll back. If anything, the circle badge is the less traditional than our current one.

I was born in the 90's so I've only ever known the shield badge. The circular badge doesn't mean anything special to me. The only reason I'd like to change to the round badge again is purely because I think it looks much better than our current one.

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