Heretic

Watching the Tesco bags become the Harrods bags would be, ah... inconvenient.

5 years! Youtube compilations aren't all bad then.

I doubt it. Religious people are hardly averse to BBQ-ing people they disagree with. Sometimes a roaring fire cures all ills.

What about Ross Perot? Wealthy guy. Shot from the hip. Not a professional politician. Denounced NAFTA (before it was signed). (Not a narcissist, true.) Arguably, Trump is a third party candidate that has run by running off with a top-two party. Perot actually ran as a third party candidate. The main difference, I think, is that Trump knew a third party candidate would find it difficult to win in a separate third party. But Gary Johnson is actually running for a third party and polling decently, even in a Trump year.

Trump performing well in the polls. John Hinckley just released. Hmm...

So we could be losing Micah 'The Rock' Richards? Dr T's plans to be one of the top three clubs in the world rested on his leadership. Ah well, League 2 here we come

The polls always assume One Man, One Vote. Of course, the President is elected by the Electoral College. The truth is that the Rust Belt states are going to be crucial. As Gore showed, you can win the popular vote but lose the White House. The RB states are not Hillary's natural hunting ground. There's a lot of angry, white working class people. Trump's rhetoric plays well there. She can easily be ahead in the polls and lose. I saw on TV that Tim Kaine was selected as he speaks Spanish so they can appeal to Hispanics. They already do. I suspect that he was chosen because he is from a regular, no-frills state that gives him a chance of pushing the Hillary ticket to those ordinary folks who have to turn to her for her to grab the White House.

I hope we can start a song about our owner having more shadows than yours? (4 to be precise).

Which is it? You're back pedalling.

I'm not sure that's the right link, BOF. There's no post from irreverentad on that page. I was wondering how posters knew that he had passed away. Is there a thread about him/others that I'm missing?

Wouldn't be the guy in your avatar, by any chance?

Elphick brings more to this club than just his boots. I think it's the same with Stan. How is this man anything other than an inspiration? If this man can't inspire you, who can?

Hindsight. Easy for me to say now, of course.

The heat out there has been vicious, so I read. Over 40 degrees celsius daily!

Sir John Scarlett told Blair the evidence of Iraq WMD was 'patchy.' Blair told Parliament the evidence of Iraq WMD was 'authoritative.' That's a lie. Blair said Saddam was enriching uranium in Niger. The Bush adminstration refused to support this allegation. Or 'lie', which it was. We didn't invade Iraq because he gassed Kurds. We didn't care much if he had WMD either. The policy was containment even after the first Gulf War. He could sit on WMD all day as far as we were concerned, just don't use them. Not only that, but Bush and Blair offered to let Saddam stay in power if he gave up his WMD. Now they say it was right to remove him. Which is it? More lies. 9/11 bred the idea that Saddam was now a present threat to the West. This required linking him to 9/11 to ensure an attack on Iraq would enjoy legitimacy. That was false and they knew it. A Blair memo with Bush revealed by Chilcot clearly shows that Blair told Bush the evidence of Saddam's links to 9/11 were 'tenuous at best.' A bunch of Saudi hijackers had nothing to do with Saddam. Bush and Blair knew it. It was like linking the Thai tsunami to Lockerbie. A key US source for Saddam's WMD programme was an Iraqi called 'Curveball.' You can guess how trustworthy they knew he was from his codename. In Richard Clarke's book (he was an advisor to Rumsfeld at the time of 9/11) he said that within a few weeks of 9/11, Rumsfeld asked for evidence linking Saddam to 9/11. Evidence to draw a conclusion, or a conclusion to draw some evidence? Why not try linking Bin Laden? He was behind a previous Twin Towers bombing. Perhaps he might be a viable suspect? But members of the Bin Laden family were allowed to fly from US airspace the day after 9/11 without any questioning. Why not try linking the Saudis? Most of the hijackers were Saudi. Where was there one shred of evidence that Saddam was involved in 9/11? None. The idea Saddam would have attacked the US or the UK was preposterous. If he attacked the US - or attempted to - the US would have turned Iraq into glass. He knew it. The US-hating was all for domestic consumption. The reality is that the Bush adminstration hated Saddam and 9/11 was their opportunity. With Blair, they didn't care about the blowback that would occur. Never waste a crisis.

You can say that again.

Best wishes to you, villarocker. I've been through it too, but a few years back now. There will be good days and bad days. Over time, the ratio of good days to bad days goes in your favour. All part of the process of accepting the new life you must forge. for you.

How's life back in Cleveland, Randy?

The vote shows they think he's a load of Crabb.

He looks a great bunch of lads. I suspect Steve Clarke is behind it and I trust him on this one.

The Moors clubhouse was right by the stand so you could go in and often meet players. You could see them in the car park as you had to walk through there to get to the pitch. There weren't that many autograph hunters, actually. I guess they were just folk like us, or that's how we felt. You do have a little more connection with them as they drive cars just like many of the fans. Yeah, it's been a rough 12 months indeed. Brighter now, I think. There seems to be direction now, not just crisis management. I never felt as if was cheating on Villa, going to the Moors. The fun thing was you never knew when the next new player came in, if he was young, would he be the next IT7 or something like that? I mentioned Stewart Talbot. Fine player - close to IT7, I thought, but not quite good enough. He went on to play in the Anglo Italian Cup in 1996 with Vale. Lost in the final to Genoa. Genoa included Vincenzo Montella (Italian international, now managing Milan) and John van't Schip, 40-cap Dutch international. All from the Moors! I should add to the list of ex-Moors - Dave Busst (honourable mention to Bobby Coy, a great player too). Dave Busst was an excellent defender and like IT7 you knew he had the ability to go far in the game. You may recall the horror injury that ended his career for Coventry at Old Trafford.

Some fun times at the Moors. I have fond memories. Obviously some fans were primarily following Villa, the noses, the Tesco bags. Some players who'd played for them worked their way down to the Moors. Sometimes you saw players you knew off the telly or your sticker albums and there they were, trudging off to the dressing room so close you could sneeze and they'd hear you. Some terrific players down there over the years - Phil Davies, Dave Fearon, Stewart Talbot (who also went to Port Vale and who I thought would go higher but didn't), Graham Clegg. I recall one team (I think it was Worcester or Waterlooville) bringing a keeper who, um, had clearly eaten three good meals a day. Actually, make that an hour. The home stand was so close to the goals you could easily hold a conversation with the keeper. We had a good half of football and to top it off, whenever the ball left his area he literally turned his back on the play to have the banter with us like we were all at a bus stop. We had a real rivalry with Solihull Borough and those matches always had some needle to them. Never saw the merger coming but I understood the business reasons for it.

RDM's going to issue a hell of a fine to Micah for wearing the cap.

I used to watch Moor Green back in the day and remember IT7 playing for them. He was clearly better than everyone around him. He was always a lovely bloke going back there. Never struck me as thinking he was better than the others (he was, of course). I recall being at the Midland Floodlit Cup final (honest) which was played at the Olbion. IT7 hit a dipping shot from 35 yards out that just dipped over the bar. He played really well. I recall reading somewhere later that John Rudge (Port Vale) was there and left early. Other scouts there thought he didn't rate IT7. Turns out he'd made up his mind to sign him and didn't need to see the rest of the game.

Always wondered why you had the Cannavaro avatar. All becomes clear. That Italy kit was terrific. Thanks for the write up. I thoroughly enjoyed reading it. I'm glad you had a wonderful time. I think it was very cool of the club to involve supporters groups the way they did. Didn't have to, but it showed real class, IMO. Admit it - you wished you were a kid again and scouts were there!