sheepyvillian Posted September 18, 2023 Share Posted September 18, 2023 2 hours ago, luckyeddie said: Because 99% of what he says is clickbait sh*te we tend to ignore the rare pearls of wisdom, but he is right about this. He was a fantastic winger who played heads up rugby, a throwback to days when mavericks had a place. I agree, the way England and some other countries play rugby union is just not attractive to watch, fact! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sheepyvillian Posted September 18, 2023 Share Posted September 18, 2023 2 hours ago, turnbull said: I think the RFU approached him but he said no. He's contracted to France for another 4 years. I'm not sure about that, it looked to me like Borthwick was in no matter what. Such a shame, because with a good decent coach England could still be a force. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
turnbull Posted September 18, 2023 Share Posted September 18, 2023 1 hour ago, sheepyvillian said: I'm not sure about that, it looked to me like Borthwick was in no matter what. Such a shame, because with a good decent coach England could still be a force. They could be, granted, but with the top tier disintegrating, the future of top level rugby looks a little fragile and where will that leave any promising English youngsters coming through? Granted, clubs will need to look closer to home for players, so that may help I guess, but the standard of imported players will drop too. A successful England team bolsters interest at club level. As it stands, this England set-up is hardly firing anyone's imagination. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
luckyeddie Posted September 18, 2023 Share Posted September 18, 2023 2 hours ago, sheepyvillian said: I agree, the way England and some other countries play rugby union is just not attractive to watch, fact! I watch because I am emotionally invested in being an England rugby fan, not because it is exciting. Statically, nobody kicks more than the All Blacks, but they know when to. They hardly ever kick in the opponents 22, but we do it consistently, which is just a Rugby League sixth tackle tactic. We play like we're scared of having the ball, this continuous box kicking is awful. Nobody plays more entertaining rugby than the Welsh when they are 15 points down with 10 minutes to play. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sheepyvillian Posted September 18, 2023 Share Posted September 18, 2023 1 hour ago, luckyeddie said: I watch because I am emotionally invested in being an England rugby fan, not because it is exciting. Statically, nobody kicks more than the All Blacks, but they know when to. They hardly ever kick in the opponents 22, but we do it consistently, which is just a Rugby League sixth tackle tactic. We play like we're scared of having the ball, this continuous box kicking is awful. Nobody plays more entertaining rugby than the Welsh when they are 15 points down with 10 minutes to play. Even when we won the World Cup we were methodical and very reliant on our forwards, the difference then was we were extremely effective in what we did. However, we're still playing , or trying, the same way and it's become all so predictable. Other teams may kick as often, but they do it with confidence and purpose, we're almost kick and hope. That's why I fancy Ireland because they seem to have that self - belief, which is required if you want to reach the pinnacle. France, as good as they are, I think may choke when it matters. You can't discount the All Blacks, regardless of the defeat to France, and the same goes for South Africa, who, fwiw, I hope don't win it again. I'm looking forward to the knockout stages, it's going to be juicy, that's for sure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sheepyvillian Posted September 18, 2023 Share Posted September 18, 2023 2 hours ago, turnbull said: They could be, granted, but with the top tier disintegrating, the future of top level rugby looks a little fragile and where will that leave any promising English youngsters coming through? Granted, clubs will need to look closer to home for players, so that may help I guess, but the standard of imported players will drop too. A successful England team bolsters interest at club level. As it stands, this England set-up is hardly firing anyone's imagination. I never watch club rugby, it only interests me at international level. The same with RL, although I whish they hadn't stopped the GB side, I used to love those Ashes tests with Australia, even though we could never win the series. Ellery Hanley, Schofield, Davis and Offiah, they were some players. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
turnbull Posted September 18, 2023 Share Posted September 18, 2023 25 minutes ago, sheepyvillian said: I never watch club rugby, it only interests me at international level. The same with RL, although I whish they hadn't stopped the GB side, I used to love those Ashes tests with Australia, even though we could never win the series. Ellery Hanley, Schofield, Davis and Offiah, they were some players. That's the problem, but you can't have an England team without club rugby. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
luckyeddie Posted September 18, 2023 Share Posted September 18, 2023 1 hour ago, sheepyvillian said: Even when we won the World Cup we were methodical and very reliant on our forwards, the difference then was we were extremely effective in what we did. However, we're still playing , or trying, the same way and it's become all so predictable. Other teams may kick as often, but they do it with confidence and purpose, we're almost kick and hope. That's why I fancy Ireland because they seem to have that self - belief, which is required if you want to reach the pinnacle. France, as good as they are, I think may choke when it matters. You can't discount the All Blacks, regardless of the defeat to France, and the same goes for South Africa, who, fwiw, I hope don't win it again. I'm looking forward to the knockout stages, it's going to be juicy, that's for sure. The difference with the 03 side was that it spent the first 50 minutes grinding the opposition down and putting themselves out of site with penalties, which the forwards did very effectively. The last 30 minutes was piling on the tries, which the backs were ruthless with. The statistics show we score a huge amount of tries between 01 and 03. This is easy done when all 15 of the starters would come close to the World XV side at the time. A nutless monkey could have managed that side to victory. Now we only have Itoje and Tom Curry who would come anywhere near a World XV. There are different types of kicking games, one is dominate territory (I always thought O'Gara was the master of this), another is to compete for kicks (the boring box kick) and one is when the team has run out of ideas. England revert the last one almost immediately. Kicking in the opposition 22 when not on a penalty advantage is a sign of a poor attacking side low on confidence, and we do it regularly. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
luckyeddie Posted September 18, 2023 Share Posted September 18, 2023 1 hour ago, sheepyvillian said: I never watch club rugby, it only interests me at international level. The same with RL, although I whish they hadn't stopped the GB side, I used to love those Ashes tests with Australia, even though we could never win the series. Ellery Hanley, Schofield, Davis and Offiah, they were some players. Watching Adrian Morley go to war with the Aussies was a thing of beauty 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikeyp102 Posted September 21, 2023 Share Posted September 21, 2023 On 18/09/2023 at 10:44, sheepyvillian said: Shaun Edwards would have been my choice, or someone with a bit of rugby nous. An unbelievable defence coach, but could he lead the whole team? How we’ve never had him in a role though is beyond me. But then we’ve had Farrell in the system before and got rid and now he’s coaching the best team in the world (not that he’d have left Ireland when we got rid of Jones). ROG was my choice but I think he turned us down as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LondonLax Posted September 22, 2023 Share Posted September 22, 2023 France decided to start Dupont against Namibia in order to rack up a cricket score and now it looks like the world’s best player is out of the tournament with a broken cheekbone Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
turnbull Posted September 22, 2023 Share Posted September 22, 2023 1 minute ago, LondonLax said: France decided to start Dupont against Namibia in order to rack up a cricket score and now it looks like the world’s best player is out of the tournament with a broken cheekbone In a game like rugby, where basically anything can happen, injury wise, especially against less experienced nations, it makes sense to not start your best players, especially the ones with Dupont's quality. 96-0 eh, definitely worth it. Zut alors! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
luckyeddie Posted September 22, 2023 Share Posted September 22, 2023 57 minutes ago, LondonLax said: France decided to start Dupont against Namibia in order to rack up a cricket score and now it looks like the world’s best player is out of the tournament with a broken cheekbone That's a crazy decision, I'd be furious if Borthwick did that, but we don't have any players worth protecting 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
theboyangel Posted September 23, 2023 Share Posted September 23, 2023 England have ridden the inevitable enthusiastic start by Chile and got two tries on the board. A much more adventurous outlook, however still the same handling errors Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stevo985 Posted September 23, 2023 VT Supporter Share Posted September 23, 2023 This is one of the most physical matches I’ve ever seen 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villa89 Posted September 23, 2023 Share Posted September 23, 2023 10 minutes ago, Stevo985 said: This is one of the most physical matches I’ve ever seen Both teams trying to put a marker down. Ireland's line-out a huge worry. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CVByrne Posted September 23, 2023 Share Posted September 23, 2023 13 minutes ago, Stevo985 said: This is one of the most physical matches I’ve ever seen It's insane. Ref doing great letting it be a total war. If we have sorted the lineout we can win this. If it goes back to losing own throws SA will edge it 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Villa87 Posted September 23, 2023 Share Posted September 23, 2023 What a game this is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stevo985 Posted September 23, 2023 VT Supporter Share Posted September 23, 2023 Unbelievable game. What a result Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
theboyangel Posted September 23, 2023 Share Posted September 23, 2023 What a brutal game! Well done Ireland 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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