Manager Paul Lambert

[StefanAVFC]

At the start of the season we played 4-1-2-1-2 but our full back weren't attacking enough which led us to be narrow as ****.

[VillaForever1970]

Again people claiming to understand giving someone TIME but with a big BUT, so not giving them time at all.

Its like saying you'll give them time but only if the results are decent and to your specific liking, giving someone time is taking the rough with the smooth, not pissing and moaning during the rough.

Thank you for once again explaining the meaning of giving someone time.

The thing is thou that giving someone time might just as likelly turn out to be the wrong decision as the right one. 

 

You might be convinced that Lambert is the right one for us, I am not yet, only TIME will tell 

 

Edit: Or are you saying that anyone, given time will be a success?

Time is a season at a minimum, if we'd listened to some fans he would have been sacked and this current improvement might not have existed. A new manager would have been in needing even more time..

I also never said Lambert is the one for us, more that anyone should be given time. Eck was given a season and there were no shoots of progression or improvement, the recent games have clearly shown an improvement for Lambert. We're not world beaters but it has proven that the right man given time can get his views cross...

[Super Jonno]

 

 

 

 

 

People claim they understand giving a manager time, but they really dont.

 

Nail on the head. A few months is not giving time. I appreciate if the manager is not good enough, its just not working out or if results are truly appalling then you have to call time. But with Lambert he had to deal with a huge amount of issues, coupled with him trying to play football with a team who lack experience, quality in a number of positions and importantly, the Villa players from the previous season had a season of playing completely different football ( if i can call it that ).

 

If we go down, I wont shift the blame to much on Lambert. Certainly mistakes have been made hear and there which have cost us a few points but alot of the points thrown away he cant legislate for, its just our team panicking, put it down to experience put it down to the situation at the time, but I have always understood how were progressing under him and i can recognise where he wants to take us. For that reason, I am more than happy to give him time. 

'Trying to play football with a team who lack experience' eh? Who purchased that lack of experience in the first place when there was already inexperience trying to break into the first team?

 

"Progressing under him?" That progression has seen us battling relegation for the best part of the season and breaking records no manager would want on his CV.

 

Did he have much choice considering the positions that needed filling ? Was it viable with the financial restrictions and wage reduction were going through at the moment to go and find a older player with more experience ? probably not, because they would want more money and if they didnt then Id question their quality. He brought in Westwood, Lowton, Bennet and Benteke who are young. Benteke is our player of the season and Lowton and Westwood have been good enough but both showing promise. Only Bennet can really questioned out of Lamberts "inexperienced" signings.

 

The likes of Delph, Weimann, Bannan, Baker and Clarke were all at the club already and are hardly seasoned pro's. I dont like it when people make out he went crazy on youth when he didnt, but given the circumstances we found ourselves in, and the amount of players we needed to bring in players who perhaps lacked a little experience were likely to come in.

 

Do you see everything so black and white ? It is undoubtedly clear that he is installing a philosophy of football in this club, of progressive football. Football that can push clubs on and ultimately be succesfull. We have gone from god awful football, that never wins you games to developing a style of play, which in time and with better players will put us in fantastic stead to push on. Thats progression. Anyone who thought we wouldnt be involved in a relegation scrap ( admiteddly not this much of one ) was naive. It takes more than a season to sort this pish out. 

 

He has made mistakes, I dont deny that but keeping a manager who installs belief and confidence in players like he does, coupled with the way he tries to play football is important.

No i don't see everything black and white. In previous posts i have commended Lambert for actually changing the system and have been one of the very few posters lately who have continually stated that we would stay up if Lambert persisted with correct system.

 

I also recognise that both manager and team may be finally showing signs of growing together in the right direction but that does not exclude Lambert from criticism, criticism which is warranted for his decisions on team selection and tactics for almost three quarters of the season which has resulted in a relegation dogfight that we're still not free from yet.

 

You also cannot ignore the present state of our defence which has been rebuilt by Lambert. I have seen time and time again the excuse that he had limited funding which to replace outgoing players of experience. Did he have to get rid of both Collins and Cuellar immediately? Could there not have been a 'progression' of changing our defence over two to three seasons instead of introducing players without any Premiership experience to form a new defence. That alone invited problems and weaknesses which are still there. Someone posted that it was Lambert's decision to go with youth and thats why he got the job and i would tend to believe that as Lambert has previously stated that the chairman did make funding available for more established Premiership footballers before the season started. You remember the bid for Dempsey.

 

He also had the opportunity to address our weakness at DM with the possible purchase of Diame on a free who went to West Ham. He purchased KEA and the less said about that the better.

 

Just because we now have had a few decent results against some very poor teams shouldn't convince any fan of our club that  Lambert has become a very good manager literally over night. He hasn't, but hopefully he will have learnt a lot this season from his mistakes and won't make the same again next season when hopefully we are still in the Premiership.

 

You missed my point in regards to the black and white comment I think. With him, there is a clear philosophy of the kind of football we play, its one which doesnt have a low ceiling. That kind of football, will give you success. The better players we get in, the better that football becomes and so on. I was making a comment about the attacking / football philosophy of the coach rather than a specific formation he implements.

 

I wouldnt dream of saying Lambert doesnt deserve criticism. That would be daft, and would make me look like a mug. I completely appreciate he has made mistakes, that being said I feel your being overly critical of him. He was trying to find a system, I cant knock him for trying 4-4-2 diamond and 3-5-2. Progressive thinkers should not be dashed aside, but i appreciate a few games were lost on those decisions. He who dares wins and all that, things change in football and I get the impression Lambert is one who likes to be infront of the pack rather than chasing and playing catch up.

 

Alot of our losses / points thrown away have come down to silly individual errors, ones they shouldnt make and although Lambert has to take criticism for some games I dont think its fair to blame him for 3/4 poor performance. We have been playing well enough since January, could be so different if we didnt concede last minute against Swansea ( although we didnt deserve the win ) and held onto 2 goal leads against WBA and Everton. I know thats all IFS and BUTS, but the point remains I feel people have been overly critical of him.

 

Collins yes, he did. He and the club want players who want to play for Villa, who have the right attitude and hunger to suceed. Things had gone sour with Collins and you have to recognise that. He was a disruptive influence on the team and that cannot be tolerated in high performance sport. Did Cuellars contract not expire ? Diame would of been lovely, its all very well in hindsight isnt it ( although I believe you mentioned it preseason ? ), but why didnt all the other clubs go for him ? How do you know we didnt. You make it sound simple.

KEA hasnt been the player we all thought and hoped. He recognised the problem though and tried to address it, ultimately it didnt work out but you cant knock him to much as he tried to address it, and all managers have flops in their history.

 

I have been saying this for longer than the last 5 games, I watched him closely at Norwich. He is a progressive manager who I want here long term. 

He had plenty of time to find a system in pre-season had he not? He has taken far too long to find the correct system to suit the players available and thats why we are currently in a relegation battle. Also remember how many players he purchased in the summer. Good managers buy players to fit the system not the other way about and Lambert not only failed to do that but also failed at how best to use the players already at the club. You are trying to excuse an elementary mistake which the vast majority of good managers wouldn't have made so i do not think i'm being over critical at all!

 

Your saying that Collins was a disruptive influence within the team. Can you actually prove that or is that just your opinion?

 

Cuellar was out of contract but could Lambert not have retained his services in the same way he did with Guzan?

 

No i'm not party to information to determine whether we ever were interested in Diame but we should have been and he probably would have been on a lot less wages than Sissoko who we were interested in.

 

Lambert may indeed be a progressive manager who likes to play attacking football but that alone won't make him into a good manager as we've already seen this season.

 

 

He had pre season to formulate ideas yes, but pre season is hardly the same tactical test as the premiership is it. He tried to find a system that worked, it didnt pan out he moved on to another system, which I could argue was almost forced upon him with the niggling injuries to defenders at the time, before moving on again, and since new year we have looked a much better team. Which managers dont make mistakes, you make out as if he should come in and got it right straight away. Im not making an excuse, Im saying your being overly critical. Big difference. What players has he failed to get the best out of ? Undoubtedly Bent, but given our complete lack of talented midfielders who can give Bent the opportunities he needs and the undoubted importance of Benteke coupled with the emergence of Weimann im not overly fussed by that.

 

Can I prove that ?

 

Well Im going by drunken brawls, repeated allegations and sights of him being pissed as a fart and not to mention the fact he had a row with club coaches in previous seasons. That and he was playing shite I completely agree with the decision to sell him. Your so unbelievably short sighted in your view on football. Lambert wants to play football, Collins cant, thats another reason for him to leave. I do admit I would of liked him to bring in another CB though but who would know Dunne would be injured for the whole season ?

 

Ahhh he SHOULD of done this, hindsight is wonderful isnt it. How do you know he didnt ? Would Cuellar even come back ? Would our financial restrictions let him ? Im pretty sure MON was a big pull for him ( fair assumption ? ) so you bringing up him letting Cuellar go is pretty insignificant. 

 

He identified the DM issue, thats the important thing. He brought in KEA it didnt work out. Because it didnt work out it forced our hand into looking for a new DM. As you have no inclination if we did indeed go for him, discussing that is completely irrelevant.

 

I never said the fact he wants to play progressive football is the only thing that makes him a good manager I just believe its one of his qualities. Im not making him out to be a messiah. I just think your viewing things to short sighted, in black and white and you are being slightly over critical. IMO.

[Morpheus]

 

 

 

 

 

 

People claim they understand giving a manager time, but they really dont.

 

Nail on the head. A few months is not giving time. I appreciate if the manager is not good enough, its just not working out or if results are truly appalling then you have to call time. But with Lambert he had to deal with a huge amount of issues, coupled with him trying to play football with a team who lack experience, quality in a number of positions and importantly, the Villa players from the previous season had a season of playing completely different football ( if i can call it that ).

 

If we go down, I wont shift the blame to much on Lambert. Certainly mistakes have been made hear and there which have cost us a few points but alot of the points thrown away he cant legislate for, its just our team panicking, put it down to experience put it down to the situation at the time, but I have always understood how were progressing under him and i can recognise where he wants to take us. For that reason, I am more than happy to give him time. 

'Trying to play football with a team who lack experience' eh? Who purchased that lack of experience in the first place when there was already inexperience trying to break into the first team?

 

"Progressing under him?" That progression has seen us battling relegation for the best part of the season and breaking records no manager would want on his CV.

 

Did he have much choice considering the positions that needed filling ? Was it viable with the financial restrictions and wage reduction were going through at the moment to go and find a older player with more experience ? probably not, because they would want more money and if they didnt then Id question their quality. He brought in Westwood, Lowton, Bennet and Benteke who are young. Benteke is our player of the season and Lowton and Westwood have been good enough but both showing promise. Only Bennet can really questioned out of Lamberts "inexperienced" signings.

 

The likes of Delph, Weimann, Bannan, Baker and Clarke were all at the club already and are hardly seasoned pro's. I dont like it when people make out he went crazy on youth when he didnt, but given the circumstances we found ourselves in, and the amount of players we needed to bring in players who perhaps lacked a little experience were likely to come in.

 

Do you see everything so black and white ? It is undoubtedly clear that he is installing a philosophy of football in this club, of progressive football. Football that can push clubs on and ultimately be succesfull. We have gone from god awful football, that never wins you games to developing a style of play, which in time and with better players will put us in fantastic stead to push on. Thats progression. Anyone who thought we wouldnt be involved in a relegation scrap ( admiteddly not this much of one ) was naive. It takes more than a season to sort this pish out. 

 

He has made mistakes, I dont deny that but keeping a manager who installs belief and confidence in players like he does, coupled with the way he tries to play football is important.

No i don't see everything black and white. In previous posts i have commended Lambert for actually changing the system and have been one of the very few posters lately who have continually stated that we would stay up if Lambert persisted with correct system.

 

I also recognise that both manager and team may be finally showing signs of growing together in the right direction but that does not exclude Lambert from criticism, criticism which is warranted for his decisions on team selection and tactics for almost three quarters of the season which has resulted in a relegation dogfight that we're still not free from yet.

 

You also cannot ignore the present state of our defence which has been rebuilt by Lambert. I have seen time and time again the excuse that he had limited funding which to replace outgoing players of experience. Did he have to get rid of both Collins and Cuellar immediately? Could there not have been a 'progression' of changing our defence over two to three seasons instead of introducing players without any Premiership experience to form a new defence. That alone invited problems and weaknesses which are still there. Someone posted that it was Lambert's decision to go with youth and thats why he got the job and i would tend to believe that as Lambert has previously stated that the chairman did make funding available for more established Premiership footballers before the season started. You remember the bid for Dempsey.

 

He also had the opportunity to address our weakness at DM with the possible purchase of Diame on a free who went to West Ham. He purchased KEA and the less said about that the better.

 

Just because we now have had a few decent results against some very poor teams shouldn't convince any fan of our club that  Lambert has become a very good manager literally over night. He hasn't, but hopefully he will have learnt a lot this season from his mistakes and won't make the same again next season when hopefully we are still in the Premiership.

 

You missed my point in regards to the black and white comment I think. With him, there is a clear philosophy of the kind of football we play, its one which doesnt have a low ceiling. That kind of football, will give you success. The better players we get in, the better that football becomes and so on. I was making a comment about the attacking / football philosophy of the coach rather than a specific formation he implements.

 

I wouldnt dream of saying Lambert doesnt deserve criticism. That would be daft, and would make me look like a mug. I completely appreciate he has made mistakes, that being said I feel your being overly critical of him. He was trying to find a system, I cant knock him for trying 4-4-2 diamond and 3-5-2. Progressive thinkers should not be dashed aside, but i appreciate a few games were lost on those decisions. He who dares wins and all that, things change in football and I get the impression Lambert is one who likes to be infront of the pack rather than chasing and playing catch up.

 

Alot of our losses / points thrown away have come down to silly individual errors, ones they shouldnt make and although Lambert has to take criticism for some games I dont think its fair to blame him for 3/4 poor performance. We have been playing well enough since January, could be so different if we didnt concede last minute against Swansea ( although we didnt deserve the win ) and held onto 2 goal leads against WBA and Everton. I know thats all IFS and BUTS, but the point remains I feel people have been overly critical of him.

 

Collins yes, he did. He and the club want players who want to play for Villa, who have the right attitude and hunger to suceed. Things had gone sour with Collins and you have to recognise that. He was a disruptive influence on the team and that cannot be tolerated in high performance sport. Did Cuellars contract not expire ? Diame would of been lovely, its all very well in hindsight isnt it ( although I believe you mentioned it preseason ? ), but why didnt all the other clubs go for him ? How do you know we didnt. You make it sound simple.

KEA hasnt been the player we all thought and hoped. He recognised the problem though and tried to address it, ultimately it didnt work out but you cant knock him to much as he tried to address it, and all managers have flops in their history.

 

I have been saying this for longer than the last 5 games, I watched him closely at Norwich. He is a progressive manager who I want here long term. 

He had plenty of time to find a system in pre-season had he not? He has taken far too long to find the correct system to suit the players available and thats why we are currently in a relegation battle. Also remember how many players he purchased in the summer. Good managers buy players to fit the system not the other way about and Lambert not only failed to do that but also failed at how best to use the players already at the club. You are trying to excuse an elementary mistake which the vast majority of good managers wouldn't have made so i do not think i'm being over critical at all!

 

Your saying that Collins was a disruptive influence within the team. Can you actually prove that or is that just your opinion?

 

Cuellar was out of contract but could Lambert not have retained his services in the same way he did with Guzan?

 

No i'm not party to information to determine whether we ever were interested in Diame but we should have been and he probably would have been on a lot less wages than Sissoko who we were interested in.

 

Lambert may indeed be a progressive manager who likes to play attacking football but that alone won't make him into a good manager as we've already seen this season.

 

 

He had pre season to formulate ideas yes, but pre season is hardly the same tactical test as the premiership is it. He tried to find a system that worked, it didnt pan out he moved on to another system, which I could argue was almost forced upon him with the niggling injuries to defenders at the time, before moving on again, and since new year we have looked a much better team. Which managers dont make mistakes, you make out as if he should come in and got it right straight away. Im not making an excuse, Im saying your being overly critical. Big difference. What players has he failed to get the best out of ? Undoubtedly Bent, but given our complete lack of talented midfielders who can give Bent the opportunities he needs and the undoubted importance of Benteke coupled with the emergence of Weimann im not overly fussed by that.

 

Can I prove that ?

 

Well Im going by drunken brawls, repeated allegations and sights of him being pissed as a fart and not to mention the fact he had a row with club coaches in previous seasons. That and he was playing shite I completely agree with the decision to sell him. Your so unbelievably short sighted in your view on football. Lambert wants to play football, Collins cant, thats another reason for him to leave. I do admit I would of liked him to bring in another CB though but who would know Dunne would be injured for the whole season ?

 

Ahhh he SHOULD of done this, hindsight is wonderful isnt it. How do you know he didnt ? Would Cuellar even come back ? Would our financial restrictions let him ? Im pretty sure MON was a big pull for him ( fair assumption ? ) so you bringing up him letting Cuellar go is pretty insignificant. 

 

He identified the DM issue, thats the important thing. He brought in KEA it didnt work out. Because it didnt work out it forced our hand into looking for a new DM. As you have no inclination if we did indeed go for him, discussing that is completely irrelevant.

 

I never said the fact he wants to play progressive football is the only thing that makes him a good manager I just believe its one of his qualities. Im not making him out to be a messiah. I just think your viewing things to short sighted, in black and white and you are being slightly over critical. IMO.

So as far as pre-season is concerned are you then implying that it has nothing to do with setting out a system your going to be playing in league games. Its just really to formulate ideas? Ever thought about working for the F.A.?

 

Where have i said that managers don't make mistakes? Of course they do but is it wrong to highlight those mistakes, or, should we just ignore them especially when they have such a detrimental affect on the team's performance. You criticise me for being over critical yet wish to ignore several mistakes by a manager who is threatening to get us relegated.

 

If i am over critical then you are certainly blinkered.

 

Was Collins involved in that drunken brawl or did he actually try to stop it? Allegations of Collins being pissed. Are you referring to the same incident or has there been others. Can't say i've seen any.

 

Rows with club coaches. When did this happen. I am aware that several of the senior players weren't happy with GH but whats that got to do with Lambert? Your making a lot of unfounded allegations directed at one player to prove your argument without a shred of proof.

 

You also mention that Lambert wants to play football and thats why Collins was sold yet if Dunne hadn't been injured you feel Lambert would have used him. Don't think Dunne is renowned for his footballing skills either so that really contradicts some of your reasoning on why Collins was sold. Collins seemingly isn't doing a bad job at spam at the moment is he and nothing about drunken brawls in the papers.

 

Again i have none of your insight into what has gone on concerning the conduct of players or why certain players were sold but i have reason to question why an experienced Premiership defence was dismantled in one window and replaced by inexperienced defenders due to the performance of that new defence being nothing short of abysmal.

 

Actually discussing the CM issue isn't irrelevant at all. I'm sure you'd like it to be as it is another area where Lambert has failed. If you have read some of the other posters comments on here they have rightly identified the lack of a quality DM as another reason for our defensive frailty. Lambert had options on a free but chose to spend money on KEA.

 

Not really being short sighted either. Just really commenting on the facts of our season so far rather than hearsay.

[P3te]

Dunne's  not half the hoofer Collins is to be fair

[Morpheus]

Dunne's  not half the hoofer Collins is to be fair

Yet by no stretch of the imagination can he be deemed as a footballing centre half and in the context of the debate with the other poster thats what i meant.

[VillaGoMarching]

Wow, i've been off this site since nearly January, and yet the same people have still having the same old arguements.

[villan_007]

Lambert had options on a free but chose to spend money on KEA.

 

Why can you not accept the fact we couldn't afford Diames wages? This is the same reason Cuellar wasn't resigned, 45k a week.

 

Please please stop banging on about Collins - just because you weren't around or didn't read it for whatever reason, it's true. He was constantly causing trouble. Respected posters on here with 100% insight have confirmed this. He was a cancer. He had to go.

 

I've had this debate with many posters and none have answered it. You criticize Lambert for putting this defence together. He put it together with the money he was given and the wage limit he had. Who should he have gone for? and none of them are on more than 25k. Premiership footballers don't come to clubs for 25k - hence why he shopped abroad and in the lower leagues.

 

Also, mostly a defence is made up of 4 players, he signed 3 and wasn't given money for a fourth. He admitted in January he had targets but we couldn't afford the wages. Maybe with another CB he wanted things would have been better.

 

You seem to constantly beat him with this transfer stick - he really didn't have any other options with what he had to spend.

Edited April 8, 2013 by villan_007

[Super Jonno]

So as far as pre-season is concerned are you then implying that it has nothing to do with setting out a system your going to be playing in league games. Its just really to formulate ideas? Ever thought about working for the F.A.?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Where have i said that managers don't make mistakes? Of course they do but is it wrong to highlight those mistakes, or, should we just ignore them especially when they have such a detrimental affect on the team's performance. You criticise me for being over critical yet wish to ignore several mistakes by a manager who is threatening to get us relegated.

 

If i am over critical then you are certainly blinkered.

 

Was Collins involved in that drunken brawl or did he actually try to stop it? Allegations of Collins being pissed. Are you referring to the same incident or has there been others. Can't say i've seen any.

 

Rows with club coaches. When did this happen. I am aware that several of the senior players weren't happy with GH but whats that got to do with Lambert? Your making a lot of unfounded allegations directed at one player to prove your argument without a shred of proof.

 

You also mention that Lambert wants to play football and thats why Collins was sold yet if Dunne hadn't been injured you feel Lambert would have used him. Don't think Dunne is renowned for his footballing skills either so that really contradicts some of your reasoning on why Collins was sold. Collins seemingly isn't doing a bad job at spam at the moment is he and nothing about drunken brawls in the papers.

 

Again i have none of your insight into what has gone on concerning the conduct of players or why certain players were sold but i have reason to question why an experienced Premiership defence was dismantled in one window and replaced by inexperienced defenders due to the performance of that new defence being nothing short of abysmal.

 

Actually discussing the CM issue isn't irrelevant at all. I'm sure you'd like it to be as it is another area where Lambert has failed. If you have read some of the other posters comments on here they have rightly identified the lack of a quality DM as another reason for our defensive frailty. Lambert had options on a free but chose to spend money on KEA.

 

Not really being short sighted either. Just really commenting on the facts of our season so far rather than hearsay.

 

Save your petulant and sarcastic remarks for someone else mucka. I was merely suggesting that the plans and ideas he came up with in pre season cannot be tested to the same extremes as playing premiership football. Ofcourse it gives an indication and he made the decision that what he came up with in pre season would work. It didnt, and he moved on. His got the initial call wrong.

 

Where have I said ignore them? Its right to discuss them certainly, its point of this fan board to discuss good and the bad of Villa. I merely suggested your being overly critical. To suggest im blinkered given the fact on numerous occasions I have said he has made mistakes makes no sense at all. When you criticise I feel your being overly critical.

 

If you believe Collins was a professional and a angel then go ahead and believe that. Everything else indicates he was not a good influence within the dressing room. The repeated sights of him being drunk were from friends, a family member and separate to the alleged fight. Not just allegations, Dunne and Collins were both involved and were disciplined. Try to keep up with your club ey.

 

http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/2011/mar/15/richard-dunne-james-collins-aston-villa

 

http://www.birminghammail.co.uk/news/local-news/aston-villa-richard-dunne-and-james-150207

 

Dunne for a start is no where near as bad as Collins for hoofing,regardless of that though just because Lambert wants to play football doesnt mean he is going to immediately ship every non footballer out. footballing ability aside, Dunne has relatively no resale value as his contract expired at the end of this season, Collins however we could recoup some of the money we spent on him, it was logical for him and not Dunne to leave. If Dunne was available, going by interviews Lambert had when he was asked about Dunne, I would think he could of had a part to play in certain games.

 

Cuellar already was already gone, as discussed. Two huge cancers and shite players told to leave in the form of Hutton and Warnock. Are you kicking up a fuss over Hutton and Warnock leaving ? and Collins leaves. Like I said I would of liked Lambert to bring in one more CB, thats a criticism of mine. That defense was shite anyway and in a team which tries to play football it would be more suicidal than the current one and would not be capable of developing the style of football he is aiming to do. (Try and see the bigger picture please.)

 

I never said discussing the DM issue was irrelevant. I pointed out that Lambert identified the DM issue in pre season. He believed KEA was the answer. He was wrong, managers buy flops. Great managers, good managers, shite managers. Every single one of them buys a flop, no one intends to but it happens. In this case it happened to be in a position we really needed a bit of quality. It was a  bad call to sign him, not bad that he missed out on Diame, just a bad call he chose KEA.

Edited April 8, 2013 by SuperJonno

[StefanAVFC]

Can people cut quoting the massive pyramids out? It's so **** hard to load the thread and read it.

[P3te]

Can people cut quoting the massive pyramids out? It's so **** hard to load the thread and read it.

If they fixed the quoting it'd be easier, but it's almost impossible to delete quotes within quotes without screwing everything up

[Super Jonno]

Yeah my bad, Didnt even think ! Ill edited the post now.

[Big_John_10]

he really didn't have any other options with what he had to spend.

I think that's rubbish. To suggest he had to buy all these players is ridiculous and to suggest that he couldn't have possibly signed players better suited to our needs is also ridiculous. It's a pretty weak excuse.

[Woody1000]

Is it ok to bring back the 'Disco Lambo' gif, or is he still in the doghouse?.......

[StefanAVFC]

Bring it back 

[villan_007]

he really didn't have any other options with what he had to spend.

I think that's rubbish. To suggest he had to buy all these players is ridiculous and to suggest that he couldn't have possibly signed players better suited to our needs is also ridiculous. It's a pretty weak excuse.

 

Give me options then - you can't because you can't name a single player that isn't already in the prem and would come for less than 25k - the only weak argument is yours because you come up with no alternatives.

[Raver50032]

They were the better team over 2 games and deserved to go through.

They played better than us so we were outplayed by them.

 

that isnt actually true. they were better than us from setpieces but we had more clear cut chances over the 2 games. Benteke should have had 1st half hat-trick at Valley Parade

 

I have to agree with you Zat. Their first goal was laden with a lot of luck. If that guy is really that good to be in the right place at the right time, he will be playing for us next season. A truly lucky break - the kind of which we needed to benefit from at the time to give us a boost, as fans and as a Club.

 

We fluffed our chances, having worked very hard to create them at a time when we were in a confidence crisis.

 

They scored more and deserved to go through on that statistic alone - not because we were outplayed. Of course, having 90% of the watching media and public cheering on the underdog didn't do us any favours. That kind of tsunami of support helped create the 'lowly Braford totally owned mighty Aston Villa, and over two legs' belief... That's how people will remember the tie...  

 

The very questionable parade of strikers hogging the 'D' in the closing 15 minutes at VP in the 2nd leg just meant we lacked any space creativity. They were all in the same place!!! That was the embarrassing thing. It was the roll of a dice, except it didn't roll with any numbers on it. Hindsight is great, but I would have preferred us to stick to the plan - we did actually have goals in us to go and win the tie. It just didn't happen.

 

So, the Bantams had their day out at Wembley, which was nice for them... and they got stuffed. Just like we could have been if we had got past 'lowly Bradford.' Actually, it was great to see a reasonably high profile trophy final contested by anyone not in the Sky 5. Pretty one-sided affair, but a breath of fresh air. More next season please, just to prove we are not only in the business of football just to make up the numbers.

 

Swansea have come a long way since I saw them in the old Division 4 (ish) at the Vetch Field getting 'turned over' in the FA Cup 1st Round by Nuneaton Borough. Happy days... As it happens, 'lowly Nuneaton Borough' beat the 'mighty swans' only on penalties in the replay at Nuneaton - but they'll always have that scalp from the 1993-94 competition. They took the 'mighty Bournemouth' to a replay at Nuneaton in the 2nd round too...

 

Anyway, back on topic... Keep up the excellent work (lately) Paul... I loved the outcome on Saturday, the special goal and the confusion prior to kick off about who was playing and why...

[VillaCas]

 

 

 

 

 

People claim they understand giving a manager time, but they really dont.

 

Nail on the head. A few months is not giving time. I appreciate if the manager is not good enough, its just not working out or if results are truly appalling then you have to call time. But with Lambert he had to deal with a huge amount of issues, coupled with him trying to play football with a team who lack experience, quality in a number of positions and importantly, the Villa players from the previous season had a season of playing completely different football ( if i can call it that ).

 

If we go down, I wont shift the blame to much on Lambert. Certainly mistakes have been made hear and there which have cost us a few points but alot of the points thrown away he cant legislate for, its just our team panicking, put it down to experience put it down to the situation at the time, but I have always understood how were progressing under him and i can recognise where he wants to take us. For that reason, I am more than happy to give him time. 

'Trying to play football with a team who lack experience' eh? Who purchased that lack of experience in the first place when there was already inexperience trying to break into the first team?

 

"Progressing under him?" That progression has seen us battling relegation for the best part of the season and breaking records no manager would want on his CV.

 

Did he have much choice considering the positions that needed filling ? Was it viable with the financial restrictions and wage reduction were going through at the moment to go and find a older player with more experience ? probably not, because they would want more money and if they didnt then Id question their quality. He brought in Westwood, Lowton, Bennet and Benteke who are young. Benteke is our player of the season and Lowton and Westwood have been good enough but both showing promise. Only Bennet can really questioned out of Lamberts "inexperienced" signings.

 

The likes of Delph, Weimann, Bannan, Baker and Clarke were all at the club already and are hardly seasoned pro's. I dont like it when people make out he went crazy on youth when he didnt, but given the circumstances we found ourselves in, and the amount of players we needed to bring in players who perhaps lacked a little experience were likely to come in.

 

Do you see everything so black and white ? It is undoubtedly clear that he is installing a philosophy of football in this club, of progressive football. Football that can push clubs on and ultimately be succesfull. We have gone from god awful football, that never wins you games to developing a style of play, which in time and with better players will put us in fantastic stead to push on. Thats progression. Anyone who thought we wouldnt be involved in a relegation scrap ( admiteddly not this much of one ) was naive. It takes more than a season to sort this pish out. 

 

He has made mistakes, I dont deny that but keeping a manager who installs belief and confidence in players like he does, coupled with the way he tries to play football is important.

No i don't see everything black and white. In previous posts i have commended Lambert for actually changing the system and have been one of the very few posters lately who have continually stated that we would stay up if Lambert persisted with correct system.

 

I also recognise that both manager and team may be finally showing signs of growing together in the right direction but that does not exclude Lambert from criticism, criticism which is warranted for his decisions on team selection and tactics for almost three quarters of the season which has resulted in a relegation dogfight that we're still not free from yet.

 

You also cannot ignore the present state of our defence which has been rebuilt by Lambert. I have seen time and time again the excuse that he had limited funding which to replace outgoing players of experience. Did he have to get rid of both Collins and Cuellar immediately? Could there not have been a 'progression' of changing our defence over two to three seasons instead of introducing players without any Premiership experience to form a new defence. That alone invited problems and weaknesses which are still there. Someone posted that it was Lambert's decision to go with youth and thats why he got the job and i would tend to believe that as Lambert has previously stated that the chairman did make funding available for more established Premiership footballers before the season started. You remember the bid for Dempsey.

 

He also had the opportunity to address our weakness at DM with the possible purchase of Diame on a free who went to West Ham. He purchased KEA and the less said about that the better.

 

Just because we now have had a few decent results against some very poor teams shouldn't convince any fan of our club that  Lambert has become a very good manager literally over night. He hasn't, but hopefully he will have learnt a lot this season from his mistakes and won't make the same again next season when hopefully we are still in the Premiership.

 

You missed my point in regards to the black and white comment I think. With him, there is a clear philosophy of the kind of football we play, its one which doesnt have a low ceiling. That kind of football, will give you success. The better players we get in, the better that football becomes and so on. I was making a comment about the attacking / football philosophy of the coach rather than a specific formation he implements.

 

I wouldnt dream of saying Lambert doesnt deserve criticism. That would be daft, and would make me look like a mug. I completely appreciate he has made mistakes, that being said I feel your being overly critical of him. He was trying to find a system, I cant knock him for trying 4-4-2 diamond and 3-5-2. Progressive thinkers should not be dashed aside, but i appreciate a few games were lost on those decisions. He who dares wins and all that, things change in football and I get the impression Lambert is one who likes to be infront of the pack rather than chasing and playing catch up.

 

Alot of our losses / points thrown away have come down to silly individual errors, ones they shouldnt make and although Lambert has to take criticism for some games I dont think its fair to blame him for 3/4 poor performance. We have been playing well enough since January, could be so different if we didnt concede last minute against Swansea ( although we didnt deserve the win ) and held onto 2 goal leads against WBA and Everton. I know thats all IFS and BUTS, but the point remains I feel people have been overly critical of him.

 

Collins yes, he did. He and the club want players who want to play for Villa, who have the right attitude and hunger to suceed. Things had gone sour with Collins and you have to recognise that. He was a disruptive influence on the team and that cannot be tolerated in high performance sport. Did Cuellars contract not expire ? Diame would of been lovely, its all very well in hindsight isnt it ( although I believe you mentioned it preseason ? ), but why didnt all the other clubs go for him ? How do you know we didnt. You make it sound simple.

KEA hasnt been the player we all thought and hoped. He recognised the problem though and tried to address it, ultimately it didnt work out but you cant knock him to much as he tried to address it, and all managers have flops in their history.

 

I have been saying this for longer than the last 5 games, I watched him closely at Norwich. He is a progressive manager who I want here long term. 

He had plenty of time to find a system in pre-season had he not? He has taken far too long to find the correct system to suit the players available and thats why we are currently in a relegation battle. Also remember how many players he purchased in the summer. Good managers buy players to fit the system not the other way about and Lambert not only failed to do that but also failed at how best to use the players already at the club. You are trying to excuse an elementary mistake which the vast majority of good managers wouldn't have made so i do not think i'm being over critical at all!

 

Your saying that Collins was a disruptive influence within the team. Can you actually prove that or is that just your opinion?

 

Cuellar was out of contract but could Lambert not have retained his services in the same way he did with Guzan?

 

No i'm not party to information to determine whether we ever were interested in Diame but we should have been and he probably would have been on a lot less wages than Sissoko who we were interested in.

 

Lambert may indeed be a progressive manager who likes to play attacking football but that alone won't make him into a good manager as we've already seen this season.

 

What an absolute load of nonsense

 

Lambert inherited a complete mess and had to build a team from scratch with limited resources using bargain buys and youngsters whilst weeding out the overpaid crap that had accumulated at the club under previous regimes - no wonder it took some time to find the correct formula. Lambert himself said this would be a long job not a quick fix

 

Collins was clearly a disruptive influence - that was well known. Cuellar was a injury-risk and has hardly done the trick at Sunderland

 

You continue to persist in your fantasy football view of transfers. Picking a particular player like Diame, who you have no idea about availabilty, wages or willingness to come to Villa and then criticising Lambert for not signing him is ridiculous. Even if we were interested in him I doubt we had the finances to afford his wages. Also we were only "interested" in Sissoko until we heard what he wanted in wages.

 

Lambert has made mistakes but anyone would given the circumstances. A win against Fulham and we can begin to relax and look forward to next season

[Big_John_10]

he really didn't have any other options with what he had to spend.

I think that's rubbish. To suggest he had to buy all these players is ridiculous and to suggest that he couldn't have possibly signed players better suited to our needs is also ridiculous. It's a pretty weak excuse.

 

Give me options then - you can't because you can't name a single player that isn't already in the prem and would come for less than 25k - the only weak argument is yours because you come up with no alternatives.

So because a football fan on the Internet doesn't know all available players and for what wages means there aren't any? What a stupid post. Don't know why clubs hire scouts or send managers round the world watching players. Should just ask questions on message boards.

People kept saying we needed this new approach of unearthing gems and now the argument is that actually there aren't that many and somehow Lambert managed to find all the best ones. Like no other LB in world football could have been signed. Or no other CB could have been signed for the money and wages than Vlaar? That's what you honestly believe? KEA was the best midfield player in world football that we could have got?

Crazy viewpoint. Just extreme excuse making really.

On the flipside though I'll say I doubt he could have found a better striker than benteke or made a better decision than signing Guzan.

[villan_007]

 

 

he really didn't have any other options with what he had to spend.

I think that's rubbish. To suggest he had to buy all these players is ridiculous and to suggest that he couldn't have possibly signed players better suited to our needs is also ridiculous. It's a pretty weak excuse.

 

Give me options then - you can't because you can't name a single player that isn't already in the prem and would come for less than 25k - the only weak argument is yours because you come up with no alternatives.

So because a football fan on the Internet doesn't know all available players and for what wages means there aren't any? What a stupid post. Don't know why clubs hire scouts or send managers round the world watching players. Should just ask questions on message boards.

People kept saying we needed this new approach of unearthing gems and now the argument is that actually there aren't that many and somehow Lambert managed to find all the best ones. Like no other LB in world football could have been signed. Or no other CB could have been signed for the money and wages than Vlaar? That's what you honestly believe? KEA was the best midfield player in world football that we could have got?

Crazy viewpoint. Just extreme excuse making really.

On the flipside though I'll say I doubt he could have found a better striker than benteke or made a better decision than signing Guzan.

 

That isn't what I've said at all. I also haven't said that the players he signed were they only ones available.

 

You are the one that is saying that it's the worst defence you've seen and slaging him off for putting this one together. All I've asked you to do is to mention a few alternatives that you think could have improved us considering the money and wages available.

 

You can't come up with one suggestion.

 

If I'm making extreme excuses then what are you doing? being extremely critical??

Edited April 9, 2013 by villan_007